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JACKAL!!!!????? My prayers worked! Where have you been? Oh, who cares!!!!!! KISSKISSKISSKISSKISS SPANKYSPANKYSPANKY...this could take a while ;)
SOROW
Sunday, August 15, 1999 08:16:17 PM
IP: usr12-dialup80.mix1.irving.cw.net

**enters the room laughing maniacally, switching out the candles. Sits in the big chair and struggles to control himself**

Hee hee ... go to the GFW ... hee hee ... Mara Cordova's MSTing of "Sleepover" was posted today ... hee hee ... I haven't been able to stop laughing!!

**takes a deep breath, then continues**

Okay, try to reply a bit, suck it up ... you can do it ...

The "Young Lovers" Fund: Good to see that it's nearly halfway there. :)

Fleur, re: radiator: Oh no ... if they find those bastards, take out an extra piece of flesh for that poor radiator!
And thanks for the complements on "Team Bravo."

Crzy: **stands up an applauds**

Wilek, re: Michigan mountains: If you're looking for a place those other French gargs would've gone, the only mountains in Michigan that aren't manmade ski resorts are in the upper peninsula (the Iron Mountains). Sadly, Michigan also happens to be one of the *flattest* states in the Union, so mountain climbers have to make do with health spas. :)
If you're looking for more French gargs in Michigan, I would recommend going along the state's water-formed border with Canada. Just a suggestion.

Stephen: **rises to feet again, applauding**

JackaL: THANK GOD!!!

Robby: **face changes shade** Thanks for your high regard, friend. That goes to everyone. **big group hug**

**sits back in the big chair, fixating once more**
Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Sunday, August 15, 1999 08:04:47 PM
IP: modem61.i-is.com

My stupid computer is not loading the whole room, so forgive me if I missed some posts...

Lexy> I'll contribute $5 to your fund! Anything to keep my friends in here together! E-mail me...

Wilek> Ha ha. I'm feeling much better though. Thanks :)
SOROW - [jim.abadie@cwix.com]
Sunday, August 15, 1999 07:23:53 PM
IP: usr12-dialup173.mix1.irving.cw.net

Just sticking my head in real quick.

Lexy> $123.00?? All right!

Paul> *sigh* I have no problem with your opinions, really. But I have difficulties with the way you express them. Most of your comments on Christine's fics were such that they should have been restricted to a private EM. A simple comment like "I just don't think Christine's stories are as true to the characters as they are in Jewel's" would have been a lot better.

Most of your comments and opinions have come off as very personal - perhaps they really aren't, but the way you express your opinions makes it seem like you take these things a lot more personally than you should. You state a lot of opinions as if they were facts, and while any smart person could determine that you're just expressing your opinion... it still comes off fairly harsh. Personally, I was a little disappointed that certain authors didn't make the poll, but hey, life goes on. You're entitled to your opinions - and I have to hand it to you, admitting that you don't prefer the works of an author who almost no one doesn't like is pretty brave. Just back down a bit, all right? :)

As for your reasons for not liking Christine's fanfic, well, I have one thing to say: do NOT read any of my fanfics. If you don't care for Christine's stuff, you will hate mine. I have a tendency to let my original characters run amuck. It's not intentional, but it happens.

Jackal> What? You're alive! Yaaay!

Okay, dinner's in a few minutes... got to go...
Mandolin
Sunday, August 15, 1999 05:42:12 PM
IP: pm3-1-ppp11.iximd.com

Jackel/Deuce glad to hear from you. It's been too long. Try to keep in contact.

Lexy put me down for five. Your math is right on, much better than your spelling ;)

Auntie Starsinger the wet, as in it waited til I got off work to open up.
Theresa - [Starsinger@Webtv.net]
Sunday, August 15, 1999 04:45:35 PM
IP: proxy-413.public.paix.webtv.net

Well, I've always held to this old reliable adage:

"If you can't say anything nice, don't say nothing at ALL."

because if you do give into the urge, and speak without the brain in gear, you might just prove another popular saying:

"It's better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt."
Spike
Sunday, August 15, 1999 04:42:11 PM
IP: bart.airmail.net

Anonymous Person-Ah, yes, the one who was most likely the person who Sent me around 2,000 Electronic Mails with the f-word in them every second word or so. If you think that's going to change anything, forget it. Don't hack into my Electronic Mail again, or else.

The Fanfiction Debate-First of all, I saw the Comment Room Rules before, Robby. I know about them, and know not to insult someone's story. I was just telling the truth, as I saw it. I stated it was my opinions. As for the whole Post, I explained beforehand I don't do things like this, but someone asked me why I didn't like her stories. So I responded. I was asked a question, and answered.
The comment on the Fanfiction Poll was just some stupid comment that shouldn't have been taken seriously. The one about Christine Morgan being higher up, that is. Jewel Faulkner is a much better writer. I shouldn't have said that, if Christine's offended I'll apologize. The comments yesterday, though, were in response to a question posed by someone else. If I'm asked why I think Jewel Faulkner's a better writer, I'll answer the question.
These are opinions. A friend of mine bashed XENOGEARS around, I didn't snap at him, because I understood why he didn't like the Game. A lot of other people bashed him around, so he put up a notice on his Webpage about how there will be opinions in the Webpage, and if someone will feel the need to do anything nasty about the opinions, to please click the Back Button on the person's browser.
I was asked, I gave my opinion, and I did not intend to insult anyone with it. If I'm asked I question I can answer I will answer. My comments were my evaluation, not insults. They were meant as an answer. I am not looking down at Christine Morgan's work, I'm answering a question. The comment on the Polls was uncalled for, but I'm not perfect. I do look at my Posts, but I thought that that wouldn't do much harm, it was just a little side comment.
I made mistake.
Therefore I will apologize if Christine feels offended. I don't intend to insult anyone's Fanfiction, no matter how bad it is. I was asked a question and answered.
I know Fanfiction is meant to take the Series in various directions, but the characters, if original characters, can't just be used in an unrealistic way. Jenniren, you made an interesting point on the Electronic Mail last night on how that would be room for Comment Room Discussion, so I'll give my point on it now.
If there are characters from shows, they need to hold true to form initially. If they undergo character development to be used differently, the change needs to be understandable.
As for romance not being a main theme, I know Goliath, and Elisa liked each other as perhaps more than friends long before THE GATHERING line, possibly, but not until then was I sure how much there was. I saw the lines in other cases, but the romance in itself isn't the theme. Its Elisa being the close friend to the gargoyles that is.
Yeah, she had her hands on his in EYE OF THE BEHOLDER. There was nothing beyond friendship in that gesture, in my opinion. In this case, though, at least for that part of EYE OF THE BEHOLDER, I think I'm right here. There's no evidence it was anything else.
The relationship had nothing to do with any form of physical relationships, it had to do with trust, and support. That's where the importance of their relationship is to the plotline, in my opinion. Not on a romantic standpoint, but on one person being able to be trusted. Elisa's important as a friend to the whole Clan, not just to Goliath.
I don't mean to upset anyone, I don't want to hurt anyone. Someone, forget the name, pointed out that I was just expressing my opinions. Stop bashing me around for giving my opinions. Yeesh!
I am not insulting a story, I am answering a question, and that was all. I am not going to change my mind about the opinions, and I will apologize to Christine if she's offended if she tells me. I'm not bashing her around, or her stories, I was just pointing out that I don't like them, and giving the reasons why, so I wouldn't be sounding insulting.
I was explaining I don't like the stories because I was asked if I had some sort of grudge against her, and I attempted to show I most certainly do not. I don't hold grudges against people.
The comment on the Poll, like I said, was stupid. I'm human, and I'm not perfect, and I don't need to be bashed around for making a mistake. I just need to have it pointed out and then I'll correct it.
Oh, and why I don't write my own Fanfiction: Actually, I do, but I need to wait until A STITCH IN TIME is finished.
The criticism was constructive, in my opinion.
If you don't think it was, that's your opinion.
To the main point on the 'story bashing'.
First of all, I noticed Jewel Faulkner was upset at the commentary, but forgot to add in the apology. That one I'm doing right now.
I'm sorry for inadvertently insulting you, or whatever you didn't like.
If Christine Morgan feels insulted, then I will apologize, too. She hasn't made any comments yet, concerning this, so I'm unsure as to her standing. If she's insulted, I'll apologize. I do not intend to hurt anyone.
If I make a stupid remark like before, next time, point it out to me. If I make a mistake and someone points them out, then I'll correct them. There's always the chance I'll discover I made the mistake myself, but it could take longer, so to avoid me having to realize later on that I've said something wrong, tell me I did, and explain why, and I'll fix the mistake.
I can't notice every mistake I've made myself immediately, some I may never notice. I'm human, I'm not perfect, just point out if I make another dumb remark, and I'll fix it. If anyone needs an Example:
This is for something rather similar, but in a way, the same.
At one point a while ago I'd been rather confused as to Athenaverse Canonicity. Before I figured out the right answer to how it fits in with the real Shows, Scott Iskow was nice enough to tell me. He helped me beforehand, and gave me his points on it, and showed me where I was mistaken. He didn't bash me around for having the wrong opinions, he showed me where I was wrong.
The same thing could work if I make a stupid comment.
The reason for the comment could have to do with having that dislike of Christine Morgan's Stories, and I didn't Send her criticsm simply because I thought that'd be mean. I'm not perfect, I can't always do the right thing.
Humans are supposed to help each other correct their mistakes, not pile on top of the people who make the mistakes, and bash them around. If this happens again, I hope I'll be helped, not whacked around.
I'm not upset or anything, but I would prefer being helped. Can anyone understand my point now?

Brooklyn and Angela-I forgot to mention this yesterday. Similarities still don't give any indication on various arcs. I didn't see Angela as being more inclined to choose Brooklyn. I can understand why others would think so, I didn't. Can others understand why I didn't think so?

XENOGEARS: First of all, Stephen, if you're referring to Gameplay, or whatever, well, that's not what makes a Game great. RPGs, at least. Its the Storyline and the Characterization that do, something I doubt will be mentioned in any Reviews. Well, any Reviews where someone (I forget the name) suggested to look for Reviews.
The Storyline and the Characterization make a Role-Playing Game. So because of the wonderful Storyline and wonderful Characterization, XENOGEARS is my favorite Story anywhere.
I am not obsessed with XENOGEARS. I love the Game so much because of many aspects, the reason its mentioned here so often is because its got great lines. I Quote great lines from various Stories, and XENOGEARS has a ton of excellent lines. I like to Quote at the end of Electronic Mails and Comment Room Posts. That's just me.
As for why I love XENOGEARS so much, well, it has fully realistic characters, and situations that are incredible. Like reasons for living, what it means to live. It shows each individual and their emotions and at the same time looks at the human race as a whole. The emotional value in that story is something found hardly anywhere else.
I know what is real and what isn't.
I hope I've explained the reasons for what I said yesterday up above, I thought I'd mentioned them yesterday. Again, I do not wish to insult stories, but if I'm asked why I seem to dislike someone, and/or am not able to be very cordial to them, I will give an answer. Its not fair to ignore a question like that, if I have a problem with someone, or don't, I need to explain. How else am I going to continue to be able to associate with people? I can't have the wrong judgements of what I think going around if I can help it.

Kaioto-I'm not rereading the Post because if it wasn't what I thought it was, I feel no need to comment.

I'd comment on LIGHTNING CRASHES, I've finally read it, but I've spent enough time in here, and I have a story to write. I'll comment tomorrow, or so, most likely, and in-depth, which means I'll have to use Spoiler Warnings. I don't need rules to tell me that.
The Spoiler Warnings I use when necessary, I'd do so even if it weren't a rule, I don't like giving Spoilers.
I'll probably have commentary tomorrow.

"Everyone needs somebody to love them."-Elhaym 'Elly' van Houten
XENOGEARS
Paul Allen Nathans - [LacanPanother@worldnet.att.net]
Sunday, August 15, 1999 02:38:23 PM
IP: 93.morristown-06-07rs.nj.dial-access.att.net

Ok it seems another weed of bad vibes as sprouted again and the root of it is Paul. Let me get this off my chest.. I am not a die hard romantic. I'm not weven an XF shipper,but a little romance should pop up in sereis now and then. Your were tactgul yet Rude whne you bashed Christine Morgan's writing. You could have been a bit more constructive or say "Christine isnt my favorite of the writers" Something more along the line. As for saying the romance ruins it...hello? I have seen all the ep of the first two seasons and a few of TGC... and well their are many romantic eps. and personaly i think you are too obsesive with Xenogears.
.
Fleur: I hope your car gets better

Angie:Goliath and Sailormoon????hmmm sounds a bit like the GL's...interesting Scenario Lita(Jupiter) meeting Brooklyn

Brooklyn: That was pretty amazing what you did with that lighting

Lita: Thanks your were pratty good yourself. You know. you look just like my old boyrfirend, except your hair is nicer

Brooklyn:(says nothing just blushes)

Oh great now I have the gigglefits. :Snickers
Spacebabie - [Spacebabie76]
Orlando, Florida, U.S.A
Sunday, August 15, 1999 02:28:15 PM
IP: ts001d13.orl-fl.concentric.net

Regarding Paul's Comments: I have just one comment; Who's business of ours regarding what he says about Christine? I by no means condone what he says but it's between Paul and Christine. It ain't friggin' Kosovo! Let them settle the problems between them, not the rest of us. He offended ONE person, not everyone. If somone screws with me, it's just between the two of us and possibly the people who have to clean up the other person's remains. Yeah, it sounds ignorant but I'm not saying the same thing over and over again.

Right now, you're probably thing about critisizing me because I critized people in here. Am I right?

God, I miss the old days when two people would settle their differences by walking 20 paces in opposite directions and draw their guns. It sure saved everyone from the incessant bickering. ;)
Anonymous
Sunday, August 15, 1999 02:27:20 PM
IP: s20-onawa.pionet.net

Wilek Nereus hmm I remember a lot of the dream. Do you really want the whole dream with it 200+ characters or just the ending?
The Fundraiser. Not to rain on the parade, but want do the parents think or do they even know. The reason I ask is I remember a member having problems coming to this room because the parents were worried about the room. Man I hate being the downer, but well I just want to make sure everyone ain’t heading for a problem. Now that I have been the horrible romance killing dweeb um if everything is kosher put me down for 20 and email me with an address so I can send a money order.

The Paul Christine thing> I don’t think he was attacking her, but yes he should not have been critiquing her work in a public forum (it is not polite Paul). Everyone has his or her own likes and taste. Personally I like the TGS stories the best. My reason because they do stay true to the characters. That is why I like the regular writers and this series better than Christine’s and Jewels series (though I think a Texan character is cool). Notice that I said I; it is my opinion it is neither right or wrong. The poll just cataloged everyone’s opinions of those who voted. So Paul have your opinion but remember that you need to be polite and respect peoples feelings when expressing them, and every one like I said I don’t think he was attacking her. I think he just was suffering from a moment of lack of tact.

Message in a bottle spoilers
It SUCKED I was watching this on tape with a couple of my girlfriends (friends who are girls not the other meaning like I am that lucky). Any way two of them had seen it and knew he DIED. Akhhhhh you watch they fall in love and you think happily ever after right. NO. He dies that sucks. I get involved with the characters feel their lives and then a sad ending? If I want a sad ending I live my life Thank you.

Jackyl hey nice to here from you
D- man nice to here from you and hope you can make it back soon

Ironwolf - [cag16@bellsouth.net]
Sunday, August 15, 1999 02:11:33 PM
IP: host-209-215-8-154.cha.bellsouth.net

::Looks down at the battered remains of Paul Nathans:: Never has a public dressing down been more deserved. Paul, many words of wisdom have been offered over the last two days. I would suggest that you take them to heart.

So very much to catch up on, so little time.

Happy birthday both past and present to those August babies, too numerous to mention. ::Adds a cake to the side board next to the punch bowl::

Movies: Why is it there's nothing to see for about two years and now there's more movies then time? Feast or famine. Btw, if you haven't seen "Mystery Men" I'd reccomend it. Yes, it was silly, but it had heart.

Old news, but thank you for the recognition in Robby's recent Fanfic Favorites Poll. It was more appreciated than you know.

Other stuff, something vaguely TGS related... you know, it's really hard to come up with a reader response question that won't be construed as either a spoiler or hint because I spent so long on staff. ::Ponders:: Can't think of a thing right now. Oh well, not for lack of trying.

I'm also looking forward to seeing what next season brings. DARK AGES was something of a favorite in terms of deconstructing the present day characters to figure out what might have happened in their pasts to make them become who they became. (o_O) That was convoluted, but it led to lively discussions during the planning phase of the first DA season.

Denis > Hope you feel better soon.
kathy - [kpogge@atl.mediaone.net]
Sunday, August 15, 1999 12:31:53 PM
IP: client24095.atl.mediaone.net

Patrick - I've attached a link to a Xenogears review to my name. It should give you some idea of what the game is like if you are interested. http://www.gamecenter.com/Consoles/Sony/Xenogears/

Poor Paul. I don't think he meant to bash anyone. He just has his opinions and this is how he happens to express them. But Paul, since it is obvious that so many people don't like the way you express yourself, you need to find a way to tone it down. Look over your letters before you submit them and try to avoid saying something which is going to cause a fuss. Calling Christine's writing "lousy" is not only inaccurate, it is insulting, and there are a lot of people in here who don't want to see her insulted (as you've no doubt noticed). The points you made about Christine's "take" on the Gargoyles characters not being accurate and her stories being more like romance novels than the original show could have been made without being so insulting to her. I realize you have strong opinions, but when you express them the way you do, most people only see the insults. Instead of noting what you have to say, people just get mad at you. Since that isn't what you want to happen, you need to examine the way you express yourself and make the necessary changes.

Fleur - I'm sorry to hear your car is ailing. I hope you're able to get it operational soon.

Skippy - [Darth Maul in garters and stockings?] ROTFL!!!

Hey JackaL posted!!! I was afraid he'd done himself after his previous post... and then nothing for so long.

Robby - Glad to hear you're feeling better and your depression was a short-term thing. Is Lonny dead or undead? ;-)

Deuce is coming back? Good.

Lexy - I'll send you an email.

Jenniren
Sunday, August 15, 1999 11:07:13 AM
IP: user-2ivf72f.dialup.mindspring.com

Patrick Toman> Xenogears is supposably the best RPG ever
James Birdsong
Sunday, August 15, 1999 11:06:36 AM
IP: dt049n74.san.rr.com

Xanather- Ofcouse! That is no problem at all. Here is my Email again lex@hnet.net

OK heres the latest update

Coyote- 50.00
Kaioto- 26.00
Lexy- 10.00
Mandi- 10.00
Heather- 8.00
Delphi- 5.00
"Shakdown"- 5.00
Skippy- 5.00
Cherry- 2.00
Xanather- (1.00)
Someonesensitive- 1.00
------------------------
123.00

*points out that she is tired* OK if i totled it wrong im sorry!;)

GREAT JOB PP'lS!!


Lexy - [lex@hnet.net]
Sunday, August 15, 1999 10:20:16 AM
IP: d095.hnet.net

Paul Nathans > You went way over the line this time. If you've got something to say to somebody, or criticism to offer them on their work, then write to them privately. Don't come into a public forum and totally trash on them as if you are the Ultimate Authority on Fanfic.

And for the record, I agree with CrzyDemona's comments on the romance angle of the show. You've obviously missed a lot when you've watched if you can say it wasn't an important element.

Also... could someone please tell me what the heck XENOGEARS is? I have never heard of it. :: does the little thing with his pinky finger :: "Somebody throw me a bone here..."

Pistoff > Don't get too excited, my friend... Crzy pretty much asks EVERYBODY to marry her. :P

:: hurries off before Crzy can thwap him with her tail ::
Patrick Toman
Sunday, August 15, 1999 09:37:04 AM
IP: 98adbdaa.ipt.aol.com

Hi all!!

Lexy:I'd love to send out a donation only trouble is you'd have to change it for American money at the bank,Do you want me to Email you?

Paul:You bashed Christine's writing style in a public forum!,THAT WAS LOW!!!How would you like it if somebody did that to you and openly critisized something that you put your heart into!

Denis:since I suffer a bad ear infection, I'll make it short>>Ouch!I feel for you,I used to get them a lot.:(

Fleur:Got your Email and I've sent on a reply,I'm sorry to hear about your continuing car troubles.:(

JackaL:Hey there JackaL!:)

Someone sensitive:Hi Deuce!:)

C'yas later!!
Xanathar
Melbourne, victoria, Australia
Sunday, August 15, 1999 06:24:09 AM
IP: 203.29.192.74

Dang it! know should be no.
Angie
Sunday, August 15, 1999 04:38:23 AM
IP: dial193.b1.tnt4.wa.freei.net

Ironwolf: "Angie did you steal part of that line about being the Goliath defender from sailor moon or am I just crazy" I sure did wolfy. How did you guess? :)
Warpmind: "When you managed to tick off Pistoff, maybe you should have finisthed with something like 'why aren't you sharing with the rest of us?'" Huh?
traveler: "I have never seen this pic, I hope it's good. I'm suprised that it's the only goliath picture, there should be more." I'm not suprised, and yes, there should be more.
Paul: Lay off Christine! She's one of the best fanfic writers out there. And know one should have to ASK you for an apology. You should give to them, because they deserve one. Follow my example and apologize.
traveler(again): I have a lot garg episodes on tape, too. I never told my parents about them. I don't plan to, because they might start lecturing to me about how I'm too old to be watching cartoons. You should hide your tapes in your room, like me. I never keep them where my parents could just easily pick them up. I hide mine in one of my old book bags. I have about 54 episodes from the Gargoyle series. I wish I had them all. I can't get the ones I missed 'cause we don't have satellite anymore. Darn! Oh well, that's life.

(says in kissy-face voice)Isn't that just a cute wittle picture. Wittle Goliath's all skinny and little and CUUTE. I can just eat him all up. teeeheee
Angie - [Goliathgirl5@yahoo.com]
WA, USA
Sunday, August 15, 1999 04:30:33 AM
IP: dial193.b1.tnt4.wa.freei.net

I usually just lurk here, but I had to say this:

JackaL--You're alive! *hugz* Don't scare us again like that!
Llewwellyn Gaelfire - [llewwellyn@hotmail.com]
Sunday, August 15, 1999 04:21:40 AM
IP: ctrts1-2.mrs.umn.edu

Umm... Congrats to CrzyDemona and Pistoff? The newly engaged or something I guess...

Fanfic progress- Today I decided it was time to put my blasted fanfics out so I started going over them and editing them... Depending on how school and TGS work get in the way, I may be putting up my series soon...

Those contributing to the "Get Robby and Heather together fund"- Um... Thanks. Really means alot, even if the soonest we can feasibly get together is Spring Break in March.. Thanks for throwing this together Lexy, even if I didn't ask you to do it... As far as how much I'm going to throw into the fund? Whatever I got when the time comes.

And Coyote- You KNOW we'd do it for you and Ravyn. Heck, you two probably would've raised the full fundage needed by now.

Someone sensitive- Nice to see ya again Deuce.

Doug- I shoulda said it sooner, but I was waiting for ya to get back... moot point really considering how the CR works... but condolances on the job man.

Wilek- Nothing to worry about. i was in a bit of a bad mood this morning between school, new sleep schedual, and not getting a drawing right in like 3 weeks... But an extra 10 hours of sleep and some time at a drawing table and the fun activities of this room cheered me right up.

Also, if you take over Sony, could you get me a Playstation 2?

Fleur- What is it with people in here and car problems? Ah well, hope it fixes itself...

**RP HERE**

Aboard the Dark Star Two, Connection Denied writhes in pain as a device saps his energy and regeneration powers. He looks at the one who has bested him, and will soon kill him.
"Who... Are you?" CD groans and gasps between breaths.
The figures eyes glow a mechanical red, and a booming voice emits. "You know full well who I am. You all thought me dead. But now I'm back to take control of this mighty vessel."
"Lonny?" CD asks in horror?
"Who?" The figure replies. Suddenly, the figure's eyes glow brighter, and for a moment, Connection Denied sees and recongizes his enemy.
"YOU!"
"Yes." And suddenly, the last of CD's energy zaps out of his body, and he turns to dust, all evidence of Dis Connect ever having an evil twin gone.
The evil figure laughs and surveys his new vessel.
Robby
Sunday, August 15, 1999 04:19:02 AM
IP: spider-wj081.proxy.aol.com

Haven't read anyone's posts yet...., just wanted to say that ..., "I'm drunk. And I'm sooo in love with you!!" YaY!!!! Lynn hurt me.., but whatever, what can you do?!?? I'm soo far beyond pastered it ain't funny. But I feel better and that's what matteres!

I'll readf posts and rtesponsed later..., bye!!!
JackaL - [Sucdeth89@aol.com]
Sunday, August 15, 1999 03:41:05 AM
IP: spider-wg014.proxy.aol.com

Fleur: Ack! Sorry about your car. Hope you can get it fixed soon. If you can find the scumbag who damaged it, you could try to make him pay for it. Or at least put him in jail. Either way, I wish you the best of luck.

Kaioto: Right on! :)

CrzyDemona: <you rock!> Uh, wow, thanks. **blushes** You're pretty rockin', yourself. :) <Will you marry me?? ::wicked laughter and a wink::> Sure. Where and when? <g> ;)
Pistoff - [pistoff@outgun.com]
Sunday, August 15, 1999 03:26:36 AM
IP: wire-8.koalas.com

Greetings all!

I finally got out to see "The Iron Giant" today. Wow! A great film, and nice the way they treated the characters. A future classic for animation annals.

ANNONYMUS - Patience, lad/lass! We're not ignoring you!

TGS will be starting up again with new episodes soon. I can give an exact start date, but expect at least the new season of "Dark Ages" to show up possibly in September or October... that is subject to change, though, so don't quote me on that.

RECENT CHRISTINE BASHING: Here's my view...

Paul,

Please understand this... first and formost, there is one cardinal rule that people should ALWAYS follow, no matter if they are a fan or not:

NEVER TRASH ANOTHER WRITER IN PUBLIC!

Your comments as of late have been juvenile, uncoordinated, and insulting to an unbelievable degree, especially where Christine Morgan is concerned. I'd ask you to apologize, but I seriously doubt that you'd even consider doing that.

If you have such an opinion about Christine's writing, why don't you write your own Gargoyles fan fiction stories, and prove your point? If you say so many of us flub the 'true theme' of the show in our work, then prove what you say. Write some stories, and show us.

Otherwise, keep your opinions to yourself and never bring them up again, unless you can show CONSTRUCTIVE CRITISISM or can more maturely speak your piece.

And, once again Paul, drop Xenogears. I've been playing console RPG's since the first Final Fantasy and Dragon Warrior games were out on the Original NES, and even as far as ADVENTURE for the old Atari consoles. I recently gave Xenogears a run, and while it is impressive in some aspects, it in no way is the end product of all RPG's.

****

Well, that's all from me for now. Maintain and Check Six!
Stephen "Coldstone" Sobotka, Jr. - [scififangargoyle@yahoo.com]
Spokane, WA, USA
Sunday, August 15, 1999 01:32:59 AM
IP: m190.ieway.com

I thought I would give Lexy a break...for now.

FUND MONEY DONATED

Coyote- 50.00
Lexy- 10.00
Heather- 8.00 (all in quarters)
skippy- 5.00
Delphi- 5.00
Cherry- 2.00
mandolin- 1.00
Kaioto- 26.00 ( Lexy added one dollar)
someone sensitive- 1.00
--------------------------
108.00

We're getting closer! Guys, all of you that are doing this..I think you...so very much.
Heather - [kheetor84@aol.com]
Sunday, August 15, 1999 01:31:09 AM
IP: 98a94b43.ipt.aol.com

Wilek Nereus> oh
James Birdsong
Sunday, August 15, 1999 12:47:40 AM
IP: dt049n74.san.rr.com

**RP!**

[In Jashin and Dark Eternal's assigned quarters on the Avatar Of Ganon...Eternal: "We have been here for *hours*. Do they not recognize the importance of our request?" Jashin: "Patience, friend; our time will come soon enough. Besides, this wait is not our problem--the real challenge will be convincing the Administrator to give us the technology. Not to mention adapting it to our own systems, although I imagine the Borg will take care of that..."]

**PAUSE RP!**

James> <<You'd think that but you aren't remembering how imune fey are to human weapons like silver bullets, wooden arrows, grenades, steel cannonballs, and spitwads.>> Trust me, friend; nukes are on a completely different level than those toys. A nuclear explosion is a huge release of energy, and since the Fey are sentient energy structures, then they might be affected even more than corporeal beings.

Anonymous> <<Hey, is it just my computer, or have they stopped making episodes for a while?>> For a while, yes, although there'll probably be more new eps in...well, I'm not sure...

SOROW> <<Well, I hope everyone ELSE had a good morning cause I woke up and everything bit my ass at once! *sigh*>> Heh...have you seen a vet? Those things might carry rabies. ;P j/k

Lexy> <<clears her thought loudly>> I had no idea clearing one's mind made any sound at all. Zen meditation? Or perhaps a psionic phenomenon? 8P j/k <<Well I propose we have a fundrive!! THATS RIGHT ! Fellow CR'ers unite! "Donate a doller" Thats right! Donate a doller for Heather and Robby fund!>> Wow...it's so psychotic, it just might work! aND THOSE FOOLS AT THE UNIVERSITY SAID WE WERE MAD!! wE'LL SHOW THEM MAD!!!!! HAAAAAHhaHAhhaHAHHHhaHhaHAhaHHhahaHhahahhhaAAAAAhhhhhhhhHHHHH! <blink> Seriously...oh how I wish I could contribute to this...Would projecting good vibes help? <projects>

Paul> [Darth Jashin trundles in. <<Keep in mind that in STAR WARS, the Dark Side of the Force was originally used for good, until the Sith warped it.>> Jashin: "Of course...this explains everything..." <leaves>] Er...don't mind him. Now...as to your little review of Christine's work. <sigh> Granted, I haven't read much of her (or anyone's) fanfic. But really, from what I *have* encountered, I fail to see why her characterizations could be considered 'trashed'. What I've seen of it was done perfectly. As for focusing on romance more than the show did...ISN'T THAT THE ENTIRE POINT OF WRITING FANFIC?!! To do things the show wouldn't or couldn't do, to create things that the original designers weren't twisted enough to create, to boldly go where no one has gone before? As someone here has said, if one keeps the characterization right (which IMO Christine has done), one can do just about anything with the source material. I know my own stories depart WAY away from the original direction of the show. So does almost anyone else's, I'd wager. This is why we write our own stuff--so we can expand the Gargs universe. Granted, I consider Jewel a great writer, but...having a favorite writer is one thing, but trashing another for the simple reason that she isn't as much to your taste is quite another. Gaia knows, erotica isn't to *my* tastes (although my tastes aren't exactly normal), but she does it well. Oh, and...I myself am a great fan of video games, but...well...you *do* seem to be a tad too absorbed in this Xenogears.

Heather> <<**looks at Robby** If only I can get him out of his depression.>> Depressed? Robby, is everything OK? If there's anything you need to talk about, we're all here to help.

Theresa> <<I love planning the future of the almost unsuspecting.>> Oh, *yes*. Nothing's quite so fun as engaging in a bit of megalomania. >8) <checks his take-over-the-world schedule> Next step: acquire Sony...

Denis> Ear infection? ACK! Get well soon! <puts a spatula through Sli Sludge's skull>

Coyote> <<I'm pretty sure that the possibility exists for more of the French gargs to have settled around the state.>> Ah, good...are there any mountains or anything in the vicinity of the Great Lakes...?

Skippy> <<Darth Maul in garters and stockings?>> Heh...I am speechless...or perhaps afraid to comment... :P

Person whose return draws near> YEAH! <high five> Can't wait! :D

Fleur> <<I don’t know if this is a normal thing, but I’ve got mixed feelings about my first fics. I’m proud of them, ‘cos I got the guts to post them, but it’s also like *cringe* ‘I _really_ hope I’m getting better at this.’>> You do that too? I'm always so nervous when I announce a new fic (which happens all too infrequently).

Delphi> <<I'm suprised no one else noticed or perhaps they were just being polite?>> Heh...I was just being a smart-arse (something I've been doing a lot lately). ^_^

**RESUME RP!**

[Suddenly, the comm panel in Jashin's quarters signals an incoming call. Jashin answers, and before the person on the other end can say anything, he says, "Greetings, Administrator." Admin: "Darth Jashin. You...have something to offer us?" Jashin: "Indeed, in return for the donation of some simple equipment." Admin: "What...sort of equipment?" Jashin: "Perhaps this negotiation would be more suited to a private meeting...?"]

**END RP!**
Wilek Nereus
Sunday, August 15, 1999 12:07:04 AM
IP: tnt-2-39-56k.portsmouth.zoomnet.net

Sorry for the second post but...

Pistoff - you rock! Will you marry me?? ::wicked laughter and a wink::
CrzyDemona
Sunday, August 15, 1999 12:02:40 AM
IP: abd6756e.ipt.aol.com

Everyone: Thank you for your thoughts. It makes posting worthwhile. Many of you are more than too kind. What I write is just what strikes me that survives editing, no biggy.

Doug: I’m very sorry to here about your situation. Downsizing is a terrible thing. I wish you the best of luck finding a new job. If there is anything I can do, let me know.

Pledge: I’m not sure how my financial situation will be when the pledge comes due, but I’ll pledge at least $25 now because I Know for Sure I’ll have that. Anything else I have available is yours, you two.

Paul:
You did skim my post. Maybe it would be wise to read for content before opening your mouth.

You did trash out Christine. You may have raised some legit points about Christine’s fic. Yes, some of it does fall out of character. Yes, some of it does fall more out as a romance novel than Gargoyles was originally written. That is, however, the theme or spin of Christine’s own unique take of the Gargoyles universe. She’s entitled to it just as much as you are entitled to dislike it. You did not, however, express your opinion in a constructive or courteous manner. Instead of contributing any evidence of simple explanation of your opinion, you instead repetitively hammered at Christine’s work, trying to make it out to be poor workmanship rather than something not suiting your tastes. Your tastes are not objective. Things you dislike are not objectively bad. Maybe you should reflect some more before you post.

Your obsession with a lack of any black and white extremes has made you presumptuous and overbearing in your personal opinions. You speak as if they carry as much wait as fact, because you see little distinction. They don’t. This attitude is what makes everything you say come out as so freaking irritating and rude.

If you have criticism so extensive, send it to someone in private. What you have done is the equivalent of the rude drunk standing up on the barstool just to tell the person across the hall that in they are dressed funny.

Thought of the day: “Light of so many shades and hues can not be unless bound by light and darkness above and below. From white are all colors shattered from. Into the dark falls all shades as they fade away to nothingness. Only in between the absolutes does color exist.”

Toku Kaioto - [kaioto@yahoo.com]
Boston, MA, USA
Saturday, August 14, 1999 11:59:36 PM
IP: 1cust86.tnt1.brockton.ma.da.uu.net

Coyote- 50.00
Lexy- 10.00
skippy- 5.00
Delphi- 5.00
Cherry- 2.00
mandolin- 1.00
Kaioto- 1.00
someone sensitive- 1.00
--------------------------
75.00

*updates runs out*

Lexy - [lex@hnet.net]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 11:45:44 PM
IP: d081.hnet.net

Paul Nathans: Gargoyles NOT about romance? Wow... are you watching the same show I am watching? I think you missed something. Perhaps you should go back and watch some episodes like... hmmm... SANCTUARY, VOWS, EYE OF THE BEHOLDER, THE MIRROR... Heck... even start with AWAKENINGS (in case you didn't notice the look that passed between E&G when Goliath literally swept Elisa off her feet).

Or better yet... Read ASK GREG. Or go to a Gathering and hear what Creator, Greg Weisman has to say about E&G and their relationship and future sex life. You are WAY off on your perspective of what Gargoyles is all about.

Oh... and I have some REALLY amazing news for you. You don't HAVE to read ANYONES fanfic if you don't like it. ISNT THAT AMAZING??? I thought you would like to know... It is your god given right to JUST SAY NO! You don't like it... don't watch it... don't read it. But don't come in here and nag at all of us about what you don't like. Isn't there a nice XENOGEARS chat room you can write to and spare us all?

Hugs and kisses... :)
CrzyDemona - [demonacrzy@aol.com]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 11:44:42 PM
IP: abd6756e.ipt.aol.com

Lexy>> count me in for $5.00, email below

Wilex>>Elisha=Elisa This is what happens when I don't proof what I've written BEFORE clicking submit (I'm suprised no one else noticed or perhaps they were just being polite?)

Paul>> WOW YOU DESCRIBED CHRISTINE'S WORKS AS SOMETHING THAT WILL REALLY INTEREST ME, I'm a sucker for tear jerkers and romance, and I just love a good twist on an old theme. SPICE in life is great. And honey if you don't want others to critize your favorite things then you need to learn TACT. There is a time and a place for everything, treat others how you would like to be treated yourself.


Delphi - [cmiller@magiclink.com]
Twin Falls, Idaho
Saturday, August 14, 1999 11:40:50 PM
IP: 207.14.200.84

*RP*
“It all started when my father died,” Fleur begins slowly, “He was a gargoyle, but my mother wasn’t from Earth. She’s from a planet in the Adromeda, and she was exploring Earth when she met my father. You can guess the rest. When Dad died, my mum and I went back to her planet. But...” Fleur sighs. “There’s two races there, the Marnia and the Kalya. My mother’s one of the Marnia. They rule the planet - they’re the only ones allowed to be educated, or do anything really. The Kalya are little more than slaves. The entire basis of this is their religion. According to that, a couple of thousand years ago, two Marnia were blessed by a diety, who gave them magical powers, and to all their descendants. They were called the First, and they used their powers to defeat the Kalya, who were the ‘evil overlords,’ and bring peace and freedom to their people. These” Fleur holds up the sword and the blade “were their weapons, and they’re suppose to contain their power. Some even say it is the source of the powers of their descendants.”
“So why did you take them?” Lathrop asks.
“Two reasons really. The first was because the story is a lie. Only one of the First was a Marnia. The other was a Kalya. They didn’t use their powers to defeat the Kalya, who _weren’t_ evil overlords. They used them to join the two races together, to bring peace to them all. But somewhere along the line, the story was changed, and the Kalya were enslaved. The Marnia have known all along, but they’ve done nothing about it. I thought if I destroyed the weapons, perhaps the Marnia would lose their powers and then they wouldn’t be able to conrol the Kalya anymore. But maybe the damn things _do_ contain the First’s power, because I just couldn’t destroy them, no matter what I tried.” Fleur takes a deep breath, then goes on, her eyes glowing. “The second reason is a lot simpler. Revenge. My mother dared to question the way the Marnia treated the Kalya and was punished for it. What was her punishment? Death. By the blade and the sword.”
*END RP*

Hi all,
Well, my car-saga continues. Now the radiator’s started leaking all over the place. I don’t know if it was because of the accident, or because it was about to do it’s Niagra Falls impersonation anyway, but either way, my poor little car is now grounded. :( But on a lighter note, Deuce asked me to say hi to everyone and that’s he thinking of us. :)

Robby> >I was too busy being hurt at the time to notice the guy's license plate, so, nope.< Oh no!! Man, that sucks. My sympathies.

Wilek> >And Gaia forbid that Ewan himself (not to mention Alec Guiness!) finds out about this. >;) < *imagines Ewan going trainspotting-style troppo and Alec rambling about the force while slicing and dicing and falls over laughing* :)

Warpmind> Stupid customer story - oh my god. How the heck did this idiot make it to puberty, let alone adulthood? :)

Coyote> >'tis a relief to know I drive a car that could (theoretically) saw a Honda in half. :)< Yep, that would be pretty reassuring. ;) BTW, read Team Bravo, loved it. :)

David G> Kewl stuff on the illuminati.

Christine> >Nah ... there's been a story out there for years called something like "The Interrogation of Princess Leia", and that icked even _me_ out < The woman who wrote _that_ Scooby doo story? It must have been bad. ;) But seriously, I can’t wait to read your Obi story. Let us know when you've finished it. (If you haven't already guessed, patience is not a virtue I possess in any way, shape or form. ;))

Atilla> Thanks *Pats*

Heather> Don’t worry too much about your first day at High School... The first day is usually absolutely frantic and very confusing, but not too bad, overall. It’s the couple of hundred days after you have to worry about. (Just joking :)).

Traveller> > Especially *when* he reported it stolen, and what his driving record looks like.< Yeah, if he reported it stolen after I was hit, he’d better have a damn good alibi. >Depending on how they hit you and the make of the van, they might have done more damage to the van than to your car.< Nah, it was older than mine. But from what my neighbour told me about what it looked like when she saw it dumped, they must have hit a pole that was older and stronger than the van. >:) >also I believe your writing style is improving from your earlier efforts. < Thanks. I don’t know if this is a normal thing, but I’ve got mixed feelings about my first fics. I’m proud of them, ‘cos I got the guts to post them, but it’s also like *cringe* ‘I _really_ hope I’m getting better at this.’ :)

Kitania> *blushes* Thanks.

Lexy and Kai> *grins* I’m so glad you guys had a good time together. Here's to many more visits that are even better!!

Welcome to the newbies! :)

Mandolin> Buff witch project> *ROTFLMAO* I would _love_ to see that!!

ironwolf> >Has anyone else ever had a serial dream?< Yes, a couple of years ago. I hated every second of it. Basically, it involved one of my best friends getting hit by a car and going to hospital. The next night, I dreamt she died. Two nights after that, I dreamt of her funeral. The big mistake was that, the night after I dreamt she got hit by the car (before I dreamt she died), I told my friend about it - just one of those ‘I had a really weird/horrible dream last night’ things. The next day she asked me, just joking, had I had anymore dreams about her. I’m a hopeless liar when it comes to these sorts of things, so as you can imagine, those three dreams pretty much scared the crap out of us. Fortunately, they didn’t come true. :)

Doug> Oh no!! My condolences, and I hope you get a new job soon.

traveler> I hope you find those tapes soon.

Paul> I understand you were just expressing your opinion, and I respect that, but I don’t think it was something for the public forum. There’s a bit of an unspoken rule, (at least, one that I always try to follow) that if you don’t like the way a certain author writes, you either simply don’t read their work, or you email them and tell them, as politely as possible, what you didn’t like. You don’t do it in a public forum like the CR. It’s very rude.

Denis> *Fleur covers Sli Sludge in lighter fluid and sets fire to him. As he runs, burning and screaming around the CR, he spots the moat and leaps in to put out the flames. The fire goes out, which only makes it easier for the alligators to eat him.* Get well soon, buddy.

Xanathar> I sent you an em. Hope it arrived.

TTFN!

**OBNOXIOUSLY LONG RP - SORRY!**
“I don’t get it,” Doug says, “You said you wanted to destroy the weapons, but you couldn’t. So why have you got them with you?”
“I met somebody, a Kalya named Rhoama. He was like a resistance leader. After my mother was killed, he got in contact with me. When I first came to the planet, they started training me to be a Priestess because I seemed to have a natural talent for it. Then after... well, Rhoama convinced me to stay in the Church so that I could get to the sword and the blade. When we realised I couldn’t destroy them, we decided to steal them and ransom them in exchange for making the Marnia reveal the truth. But,” Fleur shrugs sadly, “some Marnia soldiers... they attacked the people we were hiding with. Some of us managed to get away with the weapons, but I just don’t know about the others. Rhoama convinced me to leave, to go back to Earth and take them with me. He told me that he would find descendants of the First a Kalya and a Marnia, and when he did, we’d give _them_ the weapons and see if maybe history would repeat itself, that they’d do what the First did.”
“What happened?” Kitania asks gently. Fleur touches the medallion around her neck.
“The Marnia must have found out where I was, or maybe they just suspected I would go back to Earth. They sent out a party to bring me and the weapons back. The leader of the party, he told me.... they caught Rhoama. He’s dead.”
“What about the party they sent after you?” Lathrop asks.
“They’re not going to be a problem.” Fleur replies darkly, “I hope I’ve bought some time, but I doubt it. When they don’t report back, the Marnia are going to know, if they didn’t know already, that I’m here. That’s why I asked Wilek to keep an eye out for their ships. There’s other people like Rhoama. They’re doing the same thing he is, I mean, was. They’ve already found one suitable person, it won’t take them too long to find another. Until then, I _can’t_ let the Marnia get their hands on these weapons.”
“How much danger is Earth in?” Doug asks.
“They're not out to harm anyone on Earth - they only want the weapons, but they’ll do anything to get their hands on them. That’s why I need your help. I’ll fight the Marnia. It’s my battle, and my fault they’re here, so you shouldn’t have to risk your lives for this. But if there is a battle, and there probably will be, please, keep people away. I don’t want any innocent by-standers getting hurt,” Fleur sighs, and looks up at the Ravens, “I know I haven’t been the best person lately, but will you forgive me for leaving and help me?”
**END INCREDIBLY LONG RP**

Fleur - [newgoyle@hotmail.com]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 11:33:47 PM
IP: pig.cc.monash.edu.au

ok
someone sensitive- 1.00
Coyote- 50.00
Lexy- 10.00
Kaioto- 1.00
Cherry- 2.00
Skippy- 5.00
Mandolin- 1.00
------------------------
70.00

Coolies! *keeps the tally going*
Lexy - [lex@hnet.net]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 11:26:42 PM
IP: d081.hnet.net

Oh, yeah: I'd donate a buck for the Robby & Heather fund.
He's romantic, too
But don't hold your breath....Saturday, August 14, 1999 10:54:14 PM
IP: pppa124.connect.ab.ca

Paul, remember what happened last time someone insulted a friend of mine? Of course, this time the rage will be directed via email, but I guarantee it will be no less vicious. Shape up. NOW.


Someone sensitive - [2]
The time of my return draws nearer....Saturday, August 14, 1999 10:50:42 PM
IP: pppa124.connect.ab.ca

HERE Is my addy again!!!!

lex@hnet.net
Lexy - [lex@hnet.net]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 10:16:44 PM
IP: d081.hnet.net

Paul Nathans: Okay, bubba, enough is enough. All you have ever done since you first came in here is piss people off, and for some reason you've focused your hatred on Christine Morgan. She's a damn fine writer, but if you don't like her stories, fine. DON'T READ 'EM! That's as simple as it gets. If you want to "enlighten" her, send her some constructive criticism. The key word being CONSTRUCTIVE. But what did you do instead? You posted in a public place and bashed Christine. You don't pull that kind of crap and expect to get away with it. The best way I can illustrate this is by telling you my own personal reaction to feedback. If somebody tells me, "Well, this part works, but that part doesn't," that's fine. That's constructive, and it helps me improve the story and my writing in general, and I'm thankful for it. But if somebody tells me, "Your writing is lousy"--which you said about Christine's work--if somebody said that to me, I would kick his pathetic ass. I don't know how Christine will react, but I hope the punishment she chooses will leave you scarred for life. You've gone too far, bubba. And by the way, if you think Christine "trashes" the characters, then you've got your head up your ass. Yeesh! Not only are you an asshole, but you're completely full of shit.
Extremely Pistoff - [pistoff@outgun.com]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 10:06:24 PM
IP: wire-9.koalas.com

THANKS!!

Coyote- 50.00
Lexy- 10.00
Skippy- 5.00
Cherry- 2.00
Kaioto- 1.00
Mandolin- 1.00
--------------
69.00

GREAT JOB PPL!!!
Lexy
Saturday, August 14, 1999 10:02:27 PM
IP: d081.hnet.net

Lexy> you should have an e-m from me saying I'll be putting up five for the cause :)

On a note to all Dallas residents, it looks like the only Rocky Horror Picture Show theatrical group in Dallas is loosing their theater.

Small Furry Animals with Duct Tape has been doing RHPS out at the Walnut Twin theater in Garland for some time now. But I just checked out their website and discovered the theater they were performing will now be featuring Star Wars Episode One for their midnight matinee starting August 28...

While watching these guys do a x-over parody of the two films might be interesting (Darth Maul in garters and stockings?) It's safe to say it's most likely not happening... if your in the area it would be cool if you could come and show some support to these guys for these last two performances. Check my name link for more info...
Skippy the Klingon - [shakedwn@ultravision.net]
Transexual, Transylvania, In the State of Orgasm
Saturday, August 14, 1999 09:59:38 PM
IP: uv1-50.ultravision.net

*wipes a tear* *nods to Coyote* Yes, We would, and still will help you in any way we can *shakes your hand* thank you very much for your help

Coyote- 50.00
Lexy- 10.00
Kaioto- 1.00 ( as of now;)*
Cheery- 2.00
Mandonlin- 1.00
----------------
64.00

Great job ppls!!

*smiles at Robby* OH good im glad your not killing me..kai may have a bone to pick if ya did *smiles*

OK as of the specific details I purposfully waited for a while to post them. As of Now the best Idea is to send the money to my addy so that I can send it either to Robby or to Heather. This is to avoid giving out Heathers address and scaring her poor mother. But ofcourse If Robby is able, it would be best to send it to him.

Robby, is that ok with you? IF so..postEE *grins*

If not here is my Email me and I can hook up with you and give my address.

As for time limit..well THERE ISNT ONE so go nuts. The faster of course the better..but we dont wanna rush ya.

Again, thank you all for dealing with my insanity trying to get couples together..and also..dont give up Coyote ok? We are all here for ya..*wishes the best for you*

THANKS *will be back later* *half threat/half promise*
Lexy - [lex@hnet.net]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 09:32:22 PM
IP: d083.hnet.net

Coyote : **runs towards him and hugs him tightly** Two words : THANK YOU ! **hugs him** Anyway, Warner Robins is two hours south of Atlanta.
All money will be mailed to Lexy anyway.
Heather - [kheetor84@aol.com]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 09:26:54 PM
IP: 98a94b43.ipt.aol.com

Well....I dont post often due to some factors...but I feel that I must speak out now because of my respect for those Involved....

Paul> I shall try to be brief and as diplomatic as I can, my intention is not to: start,continue or ad to a flame war of any kind. This I must say, Im a fan of Christine's fiction and feel that she is a great author, because of her deep, detailed and belivable characters. The 'realistic feeling' of her universe and the great writing style. NOw I have not read much of Jewel's works...but what I have read is also great....and Im not going to compare the two of them...or any fanfic writers..... the point is that, although you were 'just stating your opinion' you were dooing it in a very agressive and deconstructing way...in public. This kind of behavior gets a bit under my skin......but thats my problem. The bottom line: If you dont like someone's work, attitude, habits...... then it is better to politely inform the subject in private...or not at all. Now lets all try to be polite adults here.
Frodo
Saturday, August 14, 1999 09:14:35 PM
IP: ras158.vortex.is

**enters the room, switching out the candles, then sitting in the big chair**

Not a lot this evening, but I can make do with what I've got to work with ...

Wilek, re: Clan Detroit: Actually, the main reason why I had them go to Detroit was because the city started out as Fort Michlimackinac ... *literally,* it was a fort. They were used to defend the fort against enemy forces (i.e. Native Americans and English), keeping the settlers inside safe. In other words, the fort was a North American version of a castle, which led them to naturally gravitate to the fort.
However, I'm unsure whether there were any similar forts further into the state. I'm pretty sure that the possibility exists for more of the French gargs to have settled around the state. If you can find a map of Michigan, check the amount of cities around my lovely home state that have French names.

Paul: I must concur with everyone else in here that you *are* obsessed with Xenogears. I have *yet* to see you post without mentioning it once in comparison to something totally unrelated. Now while some obsessions aren't as bad as others (for instance, my own two pet obsessions: Gargoyles and Cadillacs), you my friend seem to be campaigning to *live* in Xenogears. Take this as you will ... but sometime put *down* the controller and enter the real world.

Lexy: I must be thoroughly insane, but I'm going to contribute to your fund. **walks up to Lexy and counts out $50** For three reasons. One, Robby is a good friend. Two, Heather is almost like a sister to me. Three, because I know for sure that you'd do the same for me and Ravyn ... right? **looks expectantly**

Theresa: Okay, the details as I know it ... the trip is Heather going to Robby. Robby lives in San Antonio. Heather lives in Georgia, unsure about the area but IIRC it's north of Atlanta (right, Heather? Correct me if I'm wrong).

**sits back in the big chair, sighing and fixating on the candle's flame**
Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Saturday, August 14, 1999 09:07:44 PM
IP: modem89.i-is.com

hello, all
since I suffer a bad ear infection, I'll make it short

Paul Allen Nathans> Buddy, if there's something that can piss me off, it's insulting my friends. And you see, Christine Morgan is my best friend, somebody I regard as a sister.
You don't like her writing? fine, nobody couldn't please everybody. but the way you flamed her is pure rudeness in my book.
Everybody is free to explore the gargdom in his/her fanfic as it please to him/her.
In my opinion, Christine is a great writer, both of fanfics and professional writers as Will Gibson, Nigel Findley, Marion Zimmer Bradley or Ann Rice.
there's some ficverse I don't like, but then I just don't read them and leave their authors alone as long as they do the same.
I'm sorry if I sound tough and mean
but, as we say in french: "j'ai vu rouge".

now, on a more pleasant topic:
Garg 2K episode #17: Injustice For All: It's growing, guys, but goes a bit slower those days due to my health situation. but be patient. a trailer will be post soon. Won't it, Fred?


On this I'm off to bed. 7 pills to get before and sleep!

bye!

Denis "Wyrmwolf" De Plaen - [wyrmwolf@lft.be]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 08:53:35 PM
IP: dialup1309.brussels.skynet.be

Lexy lets get your plan in a little more detail. Are we sending Heather to Robby, Robby to Heather, or are we trying to get the two of them together for Orlando? What is our time frame and where is Hearther, were is Robby (Texas?ż I think I meet the evil one at the Gathering.) I love planning the future of the almost unsuspecting.

Auntie Starsinger the hopless romantic.


Theresa - [Starsinger@Webtv.net]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 08:10:39 PM
IP: proxy-413.public.paix.webtv.net

Hmm, haven't used my piccie in a while...

Paul Allan Nathans- Okay, I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt in this one case and assume for some reason you did not read the recently reposted CR rules. Go back to Wensday and read them. Among the rules is "NO FLAMES TO ANOTHER PERSON". Your blatant insulting of Christine strikes me as a flame, and I don't like it. I see that there IS an opinion of sorts in there, but it comes off as more of an insult in my eyes. I would say more, but others have already said it. You're recieving a first warning now from the CR Administrator.

And off that note, whether you admit it or not, you ARE obsessed with Xenogears. Yes, its a good game, but it is not by any means the story, game, or soundtrack to end all. I've played it, and while good, I've far more enjoyed
other books, (Ender's Game for instance) other soundtracks, (Final Fantasy 3, Tarzan, Land Before Time for instance) and other games. (Tetris, Unholy War, and Mega Man off the top of my head.) Get over it man, Xenogears is a GAME and should not be the center of your life.

Jenniren- Dark Rich Orange, despite being the color of my dead evil twin, seems to work well with the Asrial pic. And since Lonny is dead and never coming back, I say go with it.

Jaden- If more people visit Station 8 I won't insist.

Anonymous- Geez, a bit of patience, please! TGS is not putting out any more episodes at the moment, but Dark Ages season 2 is nearing completion and will be coming soon.

Sorow- Okay.

Lexy- The charity drive is a nice thought. A bit embarrassing, but a nice thought. I won't kill you for it, indeed, the method you chose to present the idea in gave me a chuckle. I'll put forward just about whatever I have at the time. (But sorry, not giving up my comic books! It costs far more to get them in backstock, AND they're harder to find!)


Robby
Saturday, August 14, 1999 08:02:47 PM
IP: spider-to044.proxy.aol.com

anonymous>> Please have some patience. It's a very slow day for this place. If you choose to include your e-mail addy people will reply to you privately. If not, please have some patience and courtesy to those who are here. I just got off an eight hour shift and one of the first things I do is check the comment rooms and help newbies out.

Paul>> Ever since you arrived in this comment room all you have done is trash Christine. In case you haven't noticed, you upset Jewel very much with your negative remarks. I have read Christine's work but not yet Jewel's. That's only because I don't feel ready for them yet. Almost everyone WITHOUT exception thinks very highly of of her and her writings. They also think equally high of Christine's.

The problem with you is you are so stuck in your stupid Xenogears universe that's all you think about and compare even your real life to it. Grow up and wake up. If your whole life revolves around a stupid game, you are ill. You are obsessed and you don't really have a clue to what's going on outside that game.

Fanfic by it's very nature is written by and for fans. It is not written for just one person. IF you don't like someone's work don't read it. Plain and simple. But I warn you, don't keep trashing Christine.
I feel that you still don't have a clue to the Goliath and Elisa relationship. Even in the show they were showing that it was possible for to different species to find common enough ground to actually be in love with one another. One of the earliest clues was "Eye of the Beholder" where Elisa was in costume and said "I've wanted to do this for a long time." Even before that in the episode, Goliath was holding her hand when she'd let him know about the werefox's attack. If Goliath is one of the pivotal characters so is Elisa. She is his point/counterpoint in life. She is the balance that he needs in the new life.

Many fanfic writers do write about romance. Some of us are hopeless romantics and we like to read about that love between people. Not all fanfic writers do Goliath and Elisa. Christie Smyth Hayden does Lexington/Tina and Brooklyn/Avery. Except for a few brief paragraphs in her stories, she writes almost nothing about Goliath and Elisa.

Skydance and Lisette write G&E. Others write their own characters into the equation. I read each author's writing on that author and that author alone. I do not compare aside from did I like the story or not to any other author.

By the way, can you even answer ONE post without something from that stupid game. I don't think so. Can't think an original thought if it's not from that game can you.??żż

Starsinger the less than diplomatic.


Theresa - [Starsinger@Webtv.net]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 07:15:34 PM
IP: proxy-343.public.rwc.webtv.net

**looks in the shadows and smiles at Lexy** Thank you everyone. This would mean about to Robby and myself. **looks at Robby** If only I can get him out of his depression.
**frowns**
Heather - [kheetor84@aol.com]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 06:19:40 PM
IP: 98a94b43.ipt.aol.com

THANKS!!!

Mandolin- 1.00
Kaioto- 1.00
Cherry- 2.00
Lexy- 10.00
----------------
14.00

thanks!!

*keeps tally at home* remember ppl HONOR SYSTEM HERE *grins* i expect nothing less of you guys *grins*
lexy
Saturday, August 14, 1999 05:35:11 PM
IP: d122.hnet.net

Anonymous> My God, and I thought I had no patience! It's a Saturday afternoon, and you couldn't wait more than three hours for someone who's knowledgeable about TGS to get through all of his/her real-life garbage, make it to the computer, get online, load the room, and answer your question??? This is a COMMENT room, not a chat room, and most people can't find the time to get on and check it every twenty minutes.

As for your question - if you're referring to The Gargoyles Saga, Season 2 of Gargoyles, Pendragon, and Timedancer have ended. The TGS staff is TRYING to get Season 2 of Dark Ages out and we're working on story arcs for Season 3. Keep in mind, the TGS staff is comprised of fans of the show who are not paid to do this and often have to juggle time along with full- or part-time jobs as well as classes. Hey, I'd love to blow off my job and my education and do nothing but write fanfic, but you know what? I'd be broke, uneducated, and Mom would kick me out if I tried to pull something like that.


Paul> Christine trashes the characters?? Ouch! If you have a problem with her writing, why don't you EM her more constructive criticism rather than posting all that in a public forum? Now I'm betting Christine has a thicker skin than me, but as an aspiring writer, if someone posted something like that about my fanfics, I'd be in tears right now. I love both Christine and Jewel's writings for different reasons, because their writing styles are entirely different. I also know a few fanfic writers whose stuff I'm not thrilled with, but I'll send them criticism privately. I don't care WHY you don't like Christine's writing, I'm just surprised you're so upset about the poll. You don't need to justify your opinion, just why you express your opinions that way.


Lexy> I would be happy to contribute to this fund. :)

Now where was I? Oh, yes...

**BOWFINGER REVIEW!**

Okay... to anyone who's turned off by the apparent "stupidity" of the trailers, don't be. Mostly, the ads show Murphy as Jiff, the delivery boy lookalike of Kit Ramsey, Murphy's other role. Murphy is even funnier as Ramsey himself, a top action star who's a completely paranoid basketcase.

But I'm getting ahead of myself here. "Bowfinger" is a sharp, funny satire of Hollywood - everything from Scientology to Method acting gets blasted here. Yes, there is some stupid humor, but in context it works. One scene to worry about: don't let impressionable children watch Jiff running across the freeway. It's a hysterically funny (and kind of scary when you think about it) scene, but not one you want to imitate. But the rest of the movie had me laughing my ass off. Go see it, it's worth the ticket price.

**END REVIEW!**

Doug> Ack! I'm so sorry to hear you lost your job, and because of DOWNSIZING? Geez...

Okay, a friend of mine is sitting and reading, waiting for me to finish this up so we can leave. So that's all for now.
Mandolin - [weird_web@hotmail.com]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 05:31:02 PM
IP: pm3-3-ppp35.iximd.com

ALRIGHT PPL great job! We already have pleadged 13.00 in the last hour or so! Great job!

Lexy- 10.00
Cherry- 2.00
Kaioto- 1.00 (thus far *grins)

*looks at Kai* YES you did donate *glares*

THANKS for your support so far!
Lexy
Saturday, August 14, 1999 05:29:56 PM
IP: d122.hnet.net

hi all!!

you know, if its ok with all of you I'll stick with this piccie

lexy< I think that would work!! I would totally get a dollar or two for them, I mean, I got to see how happy you and Kai were right??*lol* as for Lex having experience being a dad because of his experiences with Alex, I think he would have more simply because Alex had magic that he has to learn to control, you know?

Coyote< wow, I hadn't heard that Columbine was openening up again! with all those cameras and security guard they must be geting, I think I would agree with you, metal detectors wouldn't hurt.

traveler<I don't know what tapes you're talking about, but if you're still looking for them look under the couch cushion, thats where I find the majority of things I lose *g* that or in the kitchen cupboards

I'm still really new at this so if anybody has any tips, that would be very nice, thankee!
Bye all!!

cherry blossom - [Chryblsm15@AOL.com]
WI, US of A
Saturday, August 14, 1999 05:23:51 PM
IP: abd1e6d2.ipt.aol.com

Seeds of Change Is the latest ep. You just have to wait till they make some more *L*
Lexy
Saturday, August 14, 1999 05:23:03 PM
IP: d122.hnet.net

Where do you find the new episodes. Are they in the Current Episodes place, because I haven't been able to get any new ones since Seeds of change. What's up?
Anonymous
Saturday, August 14, 1999 05:19:37 PM
IP: filter.burgoyne.com

Ill answer that ..I guess..the new eps come out on a daily basis. Say like a new ep of Gargoyles will come out late sunday, I dont know what the days are for the other eps. but that is how it goes. Thanks
Lexy
Saturday, August 14, 1999 05:06:21 PM
IP: d122.hnet.net

HEY, SOMEBODY WANT TO ANSWER ME PLEASE INSTEAD OF TOTALLY IGNORING MY QUESTION???? WHERE ARE THE NEW CURRENT EPISODES, HAVE THEY NOT MADE THEM YET, OR CAN I JUST NOT GET THEM ON MY COMPUTER????? PLEASE SOMEONE TELL ME!!!!!!!!!!
thank you
Anonymous
Saturday, August 14, 1999 05:01:58 PM
IP: filter.burgoyne.com

Paul Allen< Ok first off I understand that you are mearly giving an opinion and are not trying to throw rocks and I will respect that. But I dont think your evaluation is fair at all. First off KNOWONES FAN FIC fallows the show. THEY arent supposed to. That is the point of it being a FAN FIC it is THE FANS fic they can do as they wish. DO you also judge fics that are crossovers? Gee..gargs never had animainacts there..boy this sure is a bad fic. NO its not. It just happens to be different. Fanfic is there to sustain us from the lack of the show. Not to reproduce it in its entirety. You can judge her writing in fanfiction in that way at all. IF anything. If you want to look at her writing skills you had better be judging, "Curse of the Shadow Beasts". Only that would be a fair evaluation. Comparing her unique fan fic to that of the Orginal show is silly. I havent read this other authers works, and Ive no doubts it is well written. Better? well I cant say. But I still think U have a right to your opinion ofcourse..but the way u are comparing is wrong.
Lexy
Saturday, August 14, 1999 04:41:40 PM
IP: d122.hnet.net

Traveler-I know you were poking fun at me too. I know you probably wanted a reaction. Therefore I intended to not give one. I defended the Game, and I will do so whenever necessary. The Game is the best story out there, its my opinion, and I am not obsessed. I just like Stories.
My comment on the XENOGEARS Music, too, is based on my opinion. I like Music, not modern music, actually, but plenty of other types. XENOGEARS Music is my favorite Music. Don't insult something you know nothing about, please.
As for your attitude about emotions, and my opinion of it, if you have paid a lot of attention you'd know why I compliment the Game. Totally realistic characters, wonderful Music, incredible story. So on. I Quote from it a lot because of the great lines.
As for calling me names, well, I've got a Reply here: Takes a fool to know a fool. <----- If that actually offended you I'll apologize.
I would advise ceasing to insult something you know nothing about. As much as you think I'm taking this to far, and I'm not, in my opinion, plenty of people love XENOGEARS as much, or more, than I do... Well, keep in mind that you know nothing about the Game, so you cannot insult it.
I do not worship the Game either. Yeesh, you can't just say things to someone when you don't even understand what the point is. You don't insult people on misinterpretations.

Posting Absence-I was busy with other aspects. I finally checked the Comment Room today.

Kaioto-I only skimmed the Post, so I may have misunderstood part of it, but it seems you're trying to explain your opinion on weaponry. First of all, the weapons don't slay people in most cases, unless by accident. Its the people who hurt each other. Not all people do, though... You might've said this, but I'm getting this part clear to support what may come after.
People hurt each other because some people like to. Those who do do. Others unintentionally hurt others. Mutual coexistence isn't exactly so easy. As for hurting... There's no light and dark, they're colors, they don't always represent good, and evil. Keep in mind that in STAR WARS, the Dark Side of the Force was originally used for good, until the Sith warped it.
Humans hurt each other because they get hurt or have reasons to hurt. Each person has reasons to not hurt or to hurt. Not everyone does.
If that's what you were showing then consider this a supportive commentary, if it isn't, consider it a Reply.

Christine Morgan's Writing Versus Jewel Faulkner's Writing:
I haven't mentioned this before, because I won't say something derogatory, but since this was brought up, now I need to state why I view Jewel Faulkner's stories as better. So I'll give both sides of the viewpoint.
I didn't intend to insult anyone before, I just intended to give my views of the Poll. Now, however, I am giving my explanation, so if someone feels insulted, ask for an apology, and I'll give it. Insult me and you'll be ignored or politely responded to as I see fit.
First of all, I have no superiority complex. Secondly, I hold no grudge against Christine Morgan. Third, Jewel Faulkner is a better writer, I didn't like seeing Christine Morgan beat her because she, although she writes well, trashes the characterization in many, many cases.
She's ruined the personalities of many of the characters in the show. Furthermore, she doesn't even keep with the GARGOYLES Theme, she focuses mainly on romance, which was never a strong point of GARGOYLES to begin with. She messed up the whole concept of Elisa and Goliath's relationship, made the characters do things very unbelievable, and turned them into people who seemed to care only about romance in many, many cases where they would not have. Plus, the aspect of physical relationships was brought up way too much. Not one of the characters, save maybe Brooklyn, cares about what anyone looks like, and in CONFESSIONS, that was going too far with Brooklyn.
Most of the time I can barely stand reading any of the stories, the only one I think I've really read was BREEDING SEASON, because it said Season Finale, and I did want to know how good she could do with a Season Finale. All in all, it was okay, but there were still plenty trashed aspects. Nevermind Hudson barely able to maintain composure in a certain scene with Delilah when she wants him to help her have children. That's very out of character.
As is every single mating insinuation scene that used the original characters. New characters she can shape as she sees fit, but with the original characters... They're way out of character. Not one of them would act as they did in those cases. Nor would there be the prospect of a physical relationship anywhere anyway save perhaps with Brooklyn. Again, though, CONFESSIONS takes that too far, he would not have done what he did.
She writes well, but she has trashed the characters so much that I do not like her writing, and I don't read it anymore. The last piece of her writing I read was BREEDING SEASON. It was okay, but that was really the only one I wanted to read. The others... Well, I'm not reading any after because I don't want to see the characters trashed anymore.
Nor the overusage of the romance, nor a physical relationship in the romance aspect, which is also severely trashing the storyline.
Jewel Faulkner, on the other hand, from the start, took the GARGOYLES Theme of finding a place to live, a reason to live, and what it means to live. She created great characters. Better than anything Christine Morgan has done, although the characters alone don't make her writing better. If she'd trashed the characters from the show I might not have been too amused. However, her creating better characters, and this one is definitely opinion, made her writing much better.
She kept with the theme of life. She made a beautiful tapestry out of that theme, out of two characters, and out of what's happened to them. She made them incredibly realistic, something Christine Morgan has done, but again, I already stated why her writing's lousy, in my opinion. Jewel Faulkner was better at showing emotion, and had better characters. The tragedies and the constant struggles to live didn't cease, each situation was dealt with, and worked through, and the theme of life wasn't yet lost. The situations of the characters were very much in keeping with the theme of GARGOYLES, another aspect that makes Jewel Faulkner's writing much better. There was real emotion in any romantic aspects, Christine Morgan had some, but concentrated mostly on physical relationships, which mean nothing in truly caring for someone. Jewel Faulkner had physical relationships in the stories, but they were various sides to the relationships, and didn't become anything major at all, except when used as plot elements, like Mark Adams in portions of LUX PERPETUA, Christine, and Alexander in MISERERE MEI DEUS, and Christian's nightmares, and how they were handled at the start of APOKALYPSIS. The original characters were handled very well, there's one exception, but that's just my own view on how Titania would react to what happened in the stories. Well, in APOKALYPSIS.
The characters are extremely well done, the plot twists are great, the emotions are shown on a full scale, the theme of GARGOYLES is recounted fully, and made even greater than anything in the actual show. LUX PERPETUA, PART II was simply beautiful, MISERERE MEI DEUS, and how it dealt with a final resolution to how Christine seems to often run back, and forth from people, with no reason to live, how it dealt with why Mark really cares about her, the whole redemption part... Despite Jewel's protestations to the contrary, things did happen in MISERERE MEI DEUS.
Granted, Chrstine's still partially running, I haven't read PART VI yet. But she lost her family, can anyone blame her!? Humans aren't perfect, she can make plenty of mistakes, and she certainly has. Thinking that taking lives was really the sole reason she had left was touching in how it showed how depressed she was. Many people latch onto constants like destruction and ending lives when hurt. Christine thought that taking lives was the reason to live then, her reason to live, and responded accordingly. Owen may have halted this, for a time.
The stories are very, very beautiful, and very, very moving. I'll be reading APOKALYPSIS, PART VI, upon getting more BREATH OF FIRE: MYRIA'S LEGACY done. I'm hoping for a lot of things to happen, namely, the Fates getting trashed for manipulating others' lives. Not harmfully, obviously, I don't like violence. If it comes to that, though...
Even if they don't work out, I'll still like the story. Once again, the characters are really, really good. The only original characters better belong to Mieu Sedai's REBORN AGAIN and XENOGEARS.
Hope's one of my all-time favorites. How much she gives up for the people she loves is really cool. Considering the general decadence of society, seeing someone like her in an 'Earth World' is really cool. She's obviously no perfect angel either, but she's the GARGOYLES' Athenaverse's closest thing to a perfect angel right now.
She understands how to live, what living is for.
The following Quote:

"People support each other to live... That's what makes us happy... So share that happiness with others... And please, Lacan, live!!"-Sophia
XENOGEARS

That emphasizes what it means to live very well.
You try to keep on living, and you live by being supported by others, and by supporting others. Hope understood this.
The other characters, too, were great in their emotional depth, despite their perceptions of life. Hope was an example, and her character depth is shown very well.
She's just an example/analysis of a character.
All of the characters have incredible depth. The writing is wonderful, the best of all the GARGOYLES Fanfiction. Scott Iskow has the best interpretation of the original characters, his is just as good as Jewel Faulkner's, but he shows them more, so that's why he wins on that aspect. Discounting who shows them more, they both tie. Jewel Faulkner is the best GARGOYLES Fanfiction Writer in my opinion, and I will stand by that.

Jewel Faulkner-Why I didn't Send you Electronic Mail is that I didn't get around to it. GARGOYLES Fanfiction isn't exactly my top priority, I probably would have Sent you Electronic Mail eventually. I got around to Sending Electronic Mail to Scott Iskow, I would have gotten around to Sending Electronic Mail to you.

Goliath and Elisa-Their relationship isn't as important to the main theme of the story. Actually, neither were Fei's, and Elly's, Kitainia. Their relationship wasn't as important as the 'humans supporting each other' point.

Doug and Kitainia-Have you finished LUNAR II: ETERNAL BLUE yet? Don't forget to check your Save Files after winning, in case you forgot me mentioning this before.

"It is for this very reason, because humans have this wretched 'will', or whatnot, that humans must continue to live in a state of imperfection! 'As is', 'as will be'... It is impossible for humans to live in a state of mutual understanding!"-Krelian
"Well, that's okay, too. Being imperfect is what makes humans live by helping one another. That's 'mutual understanding'. That's 'unity' and 'love'! I'm glad, no, I'm proud, to be human!"-Fei Fong Wong
XENOGEARS
Paul Allen Nathans - [LacanPanother@worldnet.att.net]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 04:30:37 PM
IP: 60.morristown-03-04rs.nj.dial-access.att.net

*walks in and takes her seat at the podium* *clears her thought loudly* Laides and gentlmen of this comment room..Have you ever had a really dumb idea? So dumb..so Crazy..so Radical that It may just work? Well my friends..I have had such a thought just a while ago. Let me explain. You all know our good friends Heather and Robby right? The poor lil couple that cant see eachother? OH THE NIGHTS they have cried! DO YOU FEEL guitly? YOU BET YOU DO! Do you want to help them?? YOU BET YOU DO! Am I leading you on _just_ a little here?? YOU BET I AM! But what is my point you ask? OK OK Ill get to it..my point is..that these two cant see eachother unless TWO things happen. 1) Heather needs to get good grades on her report card..she can do that herself. 2.) They need to save up 286.00 cash. Now..Heather can give up her comics and books for a while..that goes for Robby too..and Heather can get that job at Office Max..oh sure..but is that enough??? HOW ARE WE the comment room going to show our support to this couple! Well I propose we have a fundrive!! THATS RIGHT ! Fellow CR'ers unite! "Donate a doller" Thats right! Donate a doller for Heather and Robby fund! Am i joking? NO IM NOT! Is this compleatly crazy? YES IT IS! And to show im a compleat pycho I hearby donate not 1 but 10 dollers to this more then worthy cause! We are asking humbly that you send a minimum donation of a doller to help Robby and Heather finally meet in person! What better a cause for that old rinkled doller in your pocked hey?? We ofcourse do not expect to earn all the money off of donations..but hey..it is a help as small as it may be. SO show your support! A fallow up post will come later after I find out how compleatly crazy you ppl think we are. If you go along with it, then we will put up an addy for you to send this cash to. THANK YOU for reading this! Your support is needed and very appreciated! OH and if Kaioto, Robby, Or Gorbesh (sp) kill me for this post..please remember me as the crazy girl in the back that loved Lexington! THANKS AGAIN! *runs out*

Lexy - [lex@hnet.net]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 03:22:49 PM
IP: d122.hnet.net

* Test!*
Trying to see if I can do this..
Bronx Wyvern - [Bronx4me@aol.com]
Saturday, August 14, 1999 03:05:54 PM
IP: spider-to044.proxy.aol.com

Well, I hope everyone ELSE had a good morning cause I woke up and everything bit my ass at once! *sigh*

Robby> Shut up :)

Wilek> I had that dream a couple months ago after I had watched all my tapes on a sudden gargoyle spree. When watching Awakenings Pt 5, I noticed how good Brooklyn looks in glasses *without* the lenses. Since then I always thought he'd make a really good college professor or some other studious degree. And then I thought of my brother and...BAM! Doctor Brooklyn, expert surgeon! He'd look really good on the set of ER :)
SOROW
Saturday, August 14, 1999 02:32:38 PM
IP: usr12-dialup114.mix1.irving.cw.net

Hey, is it just my computer, or have they stopped making episodes for a while?
Anonymous
Saturday, August 14, 1999 02:20:49 PM
IP: filter.burgoyne.com

Wilek Nereus> You'd think that but you aren't remembering how imune fey are to human weapons like silver bullets, wooden arrows, grenades, steel cannonballs, and spitwads.
James Birdsong - [LennexMacDuff@yahoo.com]
San Diego, CA, USA
Saturday, August 14, 1999 09:41:47 AM
IP: dt049n74.san.rr.com

Hi all!!

Delphi:Thank you for telling me what Zoog Disney is.:)

Warpmind:why do I have a feeling we'd be able to get a buttload of laughs from the surroundings, should we ever meet? I get a very distinct feeling we could do a lot of good in this world. Or bad, depending on the flip of the coin. Of course, considering we're pretty much on opposite sides of the planet, you in Australia, me in Norway, it'll have to wait a while. Or maybe we meet at G2000? I'll try, for all it's worth. **Starts polishing the shotgun before visiting the bank**>>I'd love to get to go to a Gathering one of these days but being a minimum wage earner I will have problems getting arline tickets.:(

lucid dreaming:I think I've had these but Im not sure,I often get dreams where I can repeat segments of the dream over and over again until Im happy with it,but most of the time I wake up when I realise it's a dream.

Doug:Sorry to hear you lost your job.:(

Aaron:(Reads G2001 plans)*LOL*Cool!:)

Welcome to all newbies:)


**THE JOYRIDE**
Everybody in the hearse watches as the grenade goes off and spreads a greenish gas all over the Police and army personel and one by one they are overcome by violent siezures and fits of swearing,effectively paralizing them.

"Now we go in!"said Jack slamming his foot to the floor sending the hearse rocketing towards the mansion and strait through the front door sending cement,wood and glass flying in all directions with the hearse finally comming to rest in one of the living rooms.

"Everybody out!"said Jack as the Joyriders got out and began to search the rooms looking for the govenor and the remaining Backstreet Boys...

**TO BE CONTINUED**

C'yas later!!
Xanathar
Melbourne, victoria, Australia
Saturday, August 14, 1999 07:58:48 AM
IP: 203.29.192.74

****BEGIN RP!!!****
"That's a very impressive creation you have there." The evil scientist says as he walks up behind Thailog and his companions. Startled Thailog turns and says, "You have five seconds to tell me who you are and how you got in here!"
"How I got in here was easy for a man of my intelligence," replies the new comer. "...and as for who I am well lets just say that you've already met two of MY creations. Namely Tracker and Hades."
"Ah. So you're their master. I must tell you that your little monsters have not been very successful in dealing with our enemies."
"Well neither have any of yours I might add, but you know the old saying...'At first you don't succeed, try and try again.' This time with your help we will win."
"Tell me more." Thailog says with an evil grin.
To be continued.
****END RP!!!****

Jenniren-<Lucid dreamin> That's the term I was trying to think of. Thanks.

Robby-Well if you insist.

13th Warrior and Sixth Sense-I must see these!

See ya later!

Jaden - [jaden12@hotmail.com]
Los Alamos, CA
Saturday, August 14, 1999 01:57:26 AM
IP: pm0-21.vpop1.avtel.net

So do I. I was just trying not to panic. I've already done enough of that over these tapes. If I never Find those tapes again I am going to go crazy. I'm going to bed now , but if anyone has a frw comforting words for me when I wake up , maybe it'll prevent me from pulling my hair out. Good night my rookery brothers and sisters.
traveler - [goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Saturday, August 14, 1999 01:28:29 AM
IP: liverpool-143.comnetcom.net

**RP!**

[In the Avatar of Ganon's hangar bay, the mysterious new arrival, a heavily modified Naboo N-1 has just landed and is being closely watched by the security team. Strangely, the canopy doesn't open--a hatch directly beneath the cockpit opens and a mechanism deposits a familiar black hoverchair onto the floor, a hoverchair which trundles in the general direction of the team. It's Darth Jashin. "Interesting. I don't usually get this warm a welcome from the kinds of places I'm in the habit of visiting." Dark Eternal: "It's not exactly a welcome, Lord Jashin. I get the distinct impression that you're not trusted here." Jashin: "Little me? <chuckles evilly> I understand, though; we of the Sith do have a bad reputation--one that I'm afraid most of us have done much to deserve. But no matter." He finds the highest ranking officer present, which turns out to be Commander Khesaat. Jashin: "I would speak with your Administrator." Khesaat: "I'm afraid you'll have to make an appointment." Jashin (a little more authoritatively): "I will speak with your Administrator." Khesaat: "You will speak--" Jespe activates a device on his belt. Jashin: "What in--" Jespe: "Force-blanking device. Same thing we use in de cells where we keep Dark Jedi. No mind tricks on de senior staff." Jashin: "<sigh> Very well; tell her I'd like to see her at her earliest convenience." Khesaat: "Very well; I'll have Jespe assign you a room for now." Jashin: "Thank you. Come." With that, he proceeds out of the hangar bay, Dark Eternal following close behind...]

**END RP!**

Y'all probably want to know exactly why I wasn't in last night with my usual clockish precision. Apparently, my ISP decided to move their servers to a new location late last night, right when I was about to post. I was unable to connect for EIGHT ****ING HOURS. Guess what's about to happen.

**ISP DEATH!**

[The crack monkeys at Wilek's ISP are slaving away, wondering how next to inconvenience their customers...when a bunch of strange-looking and heavily-armed individuals in black jumpsuits with red pentagram commbadges breaks in the building through every possible entry--the fire escape, the doors, the windows, the skylight, everything, taking the staff hostage, including a fellow who for reasons that may become clear is named Jason Murphy. When the soldiers have secured the area, one speaks an all-clear into his commbadge, whereupon Wilek strides in wielding a gauss cannon. Wilek: "I have been having the *weirdest* day." Wilek shoots one of the tech support people in the head. Wilek: "First, I am denied access to the internet for almost an entire night." Wilek slashes the throat of one of the sysadmins, who turns out to be Mr. Disconnect. Wilek: "Then, I manage to oversleep. LONG ENOUGH TO MISS REBOOT. AGAIN." Wilek tosses Jason Murphy out the window of the tall building. Wilek: "Then, I am caught in a storm. WHILE THE SUN IS SHINING. Granted, it looked cool, especially the rainbow right in front of my house, but, well, I still have to kill y'all on principle." As if on cue, Wilek and the pentagram squad put on gas masks, and then Wilek produces a grenade. Wilek: "This is a specialized gas grenade. The wonderfully clever little concoction within will first render all of you immobile, and then mutate you, slowly and painfully, into twisted abominations that are in constant agony, incapable of mobility or coherent thought, knowing only an infinity of torment. Have fun." Wilek tosses the gas grenade into the midst of the staff and watches it do its evil work...]

**END!**

<sigh> This is all rather strange, since Friday the 13th is usually a paradoxically lucky day for me. <shrug> Oh well; maybe I'll have better luck next time...

Fire Storm> <<Mr. Disconnect: Did this character effectively replace the CR Lawyer for mindless destruction, or is the CR Lawyer still cannon fodder?>> Well, that depends. Mr. Disconnect is the fellow who we all blame for computer/electronic troubles. The Lawyer...well, we have little reason to beat him up anymore. That was recreational; DC's deaths are *payback*. >:) $Besides, the Lawyer kinda redeemed himself a while back.$ <<The Omen: Ok, I saw the first one, and it was pretty good. Is it really worth it to see all the sequels?>> I saw the last half of the second one, and it's rather good (I'm looking for MP3s from the soundtrack).

Warpmind> <<guess what? They found out that it does apply to all situations, save the situations where one intends to prove its existence.>> Hm...that alone is proof of it. ^_^

James> <<Even better quiston: What would happen if it went off on Avalon?>> The nuke? I'm thinking, no more Fey. >:)

Aaron> <<maybe an empty trenchcoat filled with a swirling blackness, and a pair of red eyes.>> Hm...I saw a picture just like that in Werewolf: The Apocalypse. But it was in black and white, so I don't know if the eyes were red...As to what I'd turn into with the Eye Of Odin...Imagine a cross between me, a Specter, a Net Spider, and a Garou (all World of Darkness creatures). <shudder> <<In future in may be wise not to let Smith and Wesson be the events planning committee.>> I wonder if they're available for birtday parties...<<Is there, perchance a similar spell for other animals, like lawyers?>> You'd have to skin a lawyer for it. Have fun. >:)

traveler> <<I don't know were to write the story , were to type it down ] . Maybe this will clear up my problem . I don't have a computer . I never have. I'm not using a computer right now. I'm using web t.v.>> Err...I'm not sure you can even write fanfic on those (although I could be wrong)...<<I could've swarn that I saw someone [an adult I'm sure] get up in the middle of the night, when I was sleeping over at my grandmothers' house , Go into the livingroom [were I had three of my tapes, the ones with my favorite episodes] and then go into the kitchen and throw something in the garbage.>> WHAT...?! >:( To say that stinks would be a grave understatement. I hope you can find and tape those episodes again.

Batya> <<Keep to one POV throughout a whole story? Why?>> I agree. I have a series of novels written in first person format. By at least four of the characters; the POV switches every chapter or so. But they're great novels. <<Archetype posts! Cheesh, I forgot all about those... Um, I was up to "Shadow", right?>> I think.

Bronx> <<Was there a time any of you had a really cool Gargoyles Dream? And if so... what was it about?>> Er...I rarely remember my dreams, but if the ones I *do* remember are any indication, then I HOPE none of my dreams involved gargoyles. My dreams make Skippy's Freudian Star Wars Teletubby pizza orgy look absolutely normal. ;P <<This was to my benefit when I realized I was dreaming because I could now control it.>> <long, stunned silence> Miss, you just described lucid dreaming. And here I thought it was little more than a myth...If I could control my dreams...I could see everything...plan out a fic scene and *see* it happen...how does one go about doing this...? <<Don't use unbrellas (that's not hard seeing USA doesn't have any rain to offer)>> Heh...you weren't at my place today. ACK. <<how do you post midis? ;_; I forgot how>> Upload them to your web space, then enter their URL in the URL box. If you don't have web space, then go to whatever site they're on, right click the link to the MID, click Properties, copy the URL, and paste it to the URL box.

All newcomers> Welcome! Permanent CR membership costs only the teeny tiny price of your soul--I mean, your sanity. >;P

Gyre> <<PS queem? Am I the only one who makes typos?>> Heh...kidding. :)

Delphi> <<Yes, I've had a few, mostly about Goliath & Elisha, best not to describe them, wrong rating.>> You've had those kinds of dreams about Goliath and an ancient prophet? Ew. ;P j/k

Kaioto> Wow. Wonderfully written essay there. :) And I'm glad you and Lexy had such fun. ^_^

Spacebabie> <<what would Sevarius do if he got his creepy mitts on some alien DNA?>> Ooh...hm, it kind of depends on the species of alien. I just know he'd combine it with garg and Loch Ness Monster DNA.

David G> <<Usually, I just have nothing to write (generally timed for a period when I have lots of time, and a desire to write). Now, I know what I want to write, I just can't find the energy to do it. When I finally get in front of the computer and open the file my concentration shatters. Interesting dust motes can distract me. It's pathetic.>> You do that too? <sigh> It's why my next fic has taken so long...<<I did the re-write, and before they got back to me, the magazine folded.>> Um...ack. Sorry to hear that...I wonder if Mr. Disconnect had anything to do with that...<<You might get the chance to watch a Rennie spontaniously combust.>> Been there, was responsible for that. >:) <<my weekends are going to be full for a while, so, since I'm trying to kick the Internet-at-work habit, you might not see so much of me anymore.>> Ack. Oh well, at least you'll be having fun. :)

Coyote> <<And other dreams I've had, while wholly inappropriate to put into fics, have been ... rather interesting. Let's just say that they involve Ravyn in the form Wilek writes her and leave it at that.>> o_O' Heh...thanks...I think... :) <<To get the entire impact of the Unseelie storyline, read from about the midpoint of TGS Gargoyles season 1>> Which reminds me, I never got around to reading most of season 1...BTW, your Detroit Clan is mostly descended from a French garg clan...is it possible that this original clan might have an offshoot elsewhere in Michigan? Just wondering.

Stephen> Ack, sorry to hear of the rejection. But at least they liked your story. :)

Pistoff> Another moving and well-written treatise on the state of our culture today. There seems to be a lot of that in here. More proof of the superiority of the CR dweller over mere mortals, I suppose. ^_^ As for the kill-or-be-killed mindset...I'm afraid it's a little more common than it should be. A friend of mine has described his experience with the public educational system as an 'apocalyptic hellscape'; he dreaded every morning that he had to go willingly to a place where he was certain his body would be found someday. (And the excessive homework didn't help matters.) I'm just glad he wasn't into black magic and such, or I'm certain no one from that school would still be alive. <<It's strange, but once you close yourself into a particular fanfic universe, if you play it just right, you can push the envelope to infinity.>> <maniacal laughter> Oh, if you only knew... >:)

Jenniren> <<I want to fly up in the sky and look down at the earth as if from an airplane, but nearly always a ceiling appears and blocks my way. I suppose it is psychological - a metaphor for the story of my life.>> ACK. That sounds so sad...

Ironwolf> <<This went on for a week until well lets say it had a weird and really twisted ending, and no villain deserves what I did to Freddie K, but he should not have killed her.>> That sounds so kewl...do you remember enough of it to post it here? :)

Doug> You and Kit are leaving for now? Oh well, at least you won't be gone long. :) <<Dominos let me go on Tuesday of this week (God, I hate downsizing).>> <sigh> Sorry to hear about that, and I hope you can find a new (and better) job soon. <<It also helps me when I write new characters to imagine a certain actor doing their voice and/or role.>> You do that too? :) I've assigned ideal voices to most of my fic characters, and it really helps to keep their voices in mind when I write them. <<you're right, the battle between Seth and the Dragon King (not saying which one he'll fight yet) will be one heck of a fight.>> Which reminds me...does anyone here know much about dragons? I'm considering incorporating a grand council of dragons into my fics. Specifically, in that one Timedancer ep with the baby dragon whose name just flew out of my head, how old would she be, biologically, in the present day?

Lexy> <<Well..I guess I would just like to hear from those ficcy writers out there. Why did you make lex the way he was?>> Err...I haven't really written about him; I'm more concerned with my own characters and the CR. :) As for his mate...[Unable to speak further, Wilek laughs in the chilling manner exhibited by Joseph Stalin just before having most of his own senior staff executed.]

SOROW> <<and from another dream, Brooklyn is expertly performing surgery on one of Lex's robotic arms (VERY bloody).>> <sigh> Why can't I ever have dreams this kewl...and logical...

Robby> <<As far as the "As above, as below" phrase for beaked gargoyles, genetically speaking it shouldn't work that way, but considering how gargs vary anyway... Who knows?>> Well, the main reason I consider it impossible is...think about it: How would non-beaked gargs procreate? They couldn't. So, if the species survived at all, there'd only be beaked gargs. <<Scooby Doo- They WERE druggies.>> As were the people who created that show IMHO...

**JOYRIDE!**

[Wilek throws the grenade as Miriam activates the shield...then begins chuckling in a vaguely malevolent manner. Wilek: "You know, Warpmind...the last guy who said something of that effect to Miriam...they're still scraping his liquefied brain matter off the CR wall." Warpmind casts a concerned glance at Miriam, who is monitoring the shield's power consumption. Warpmind: "Really? When was that...?" Wilek: "Before you came to the CR. He was a clone of me so we were going to kill him eventually anyhow, and he wasn't on our side, so you're probably safe. But still...it was *so* amusing..."]

**END!**
Wilek Nereus
Saturday, August 14, 1999 01:05:36 AM
IP: tnt-2-09-56k.portsmouth.zoomnet.net

Well, so we have a Lex conversation now. I've been thinking up a story where there is a human that is somewhat of a mage. But the only thing she can do is to chang her form. There was a spell placed on her that allowed her to do this, but with a few limitations. The limit is 15 species, but once she's chosen a few forms, she can change parts of those. for example she might be able to have the eyes of a hawk on a bat. Another limitation is that there have to be three constants. One that she chose was her eye color. The second is a necklace she wears everywhere, and the final contant is being a female for every form. I don't know if she'd go with Lex or not.

I was planing on having her try the gargoyle form to see if she was able to. She'll be a pale blue with bright blue wingspars, black hair like Elisa's and bright blue wingspars. Her wings will be shaped like Goliath's, and her eye ridge will look somewhat like a rams horns. She changes her outfit along with forms (otherwise it'll be a bit awkward) So she wears an outfit made out of a cut-up oversized grey T-shirt that reaches to her knees and is tied around the waist with a leather belt. I say cut-up because she cut squares out of the bottom to make a pattern that looks like the top of a castle. Somewhat like this:

/\_/\_/\_/\_/\

What I need to know now is what to name her. She is a human after all, and she'll have two names, a first and a last.If you have a suggestion, send it to me under the title "Name" and give your suggestions within. I plan on doing a drawing of this to send to the archive along with my story.

( the way I plan on her meeting the Manhattan Clan is that for fun she changes into this form and repeatedly heads to Central Park at night to practice her flying and attracts a crowd. You get the idea. I have a wonderful idea for an experience with any gargoyle hunters. I'll sum it up in a few short words.

Shot with dart. Assumes younger form. Tricks guard. Let go. Tracker dropped in river. Meets bullies. Patience gone. Bulldog attacks bullies.

Happy Imagining.

-Marina
Marina - [marirose@excel.net]
Friday, August 13, 1999 11:21:04 PM
IP: shb0233.excel.net

Xanathar: You're right, people probably won't change in our lifetime. We can hope...but I'm too cynical to believe it's possible.

Jenna: Thanks. :) I'm looking forward to hearing what you have to say on the subject.

Aaron: About your Rules for Friday the 13th--#2, Avoid drugs and alcohol...well, does caffeine count? ;) And #3, Avoid sex...I've bee doing that for eight years, but not voluntarily. :( And #5, Stay out of the woods...well, half of the places I deliver to can be classified as "woods"... ;)

Doug: Domino's cut you loose? Those evil bastards! Good luck finding another job, hope it's not as difficult where you live as it is where I live. And we'll miss you and Kitainia while you're gone.

How would Lex's other-ficverse mates would react if they found out he was a cyborg? Well, he's still fully organic in Gargs 2K...but if he ever does become a cyborg, Cornelia would probably think it's pretty cool, since she's so into computers and gadgets--and she's his mate, anyway. She'd be glad that he's still alive, if he were so severely injured that he required extensive cybernetic augmentation.

Lexy: Good questions. As for why we might think Lexington is a bit naughty, well, he's a hacker, basically. Hackers are known for getting into mischief and messing around with things (though that image is largely romanticized and mythological, rather than actual fact). Just speaking for my own characterization of him in stories such as "Sit on my Interface," he knew that his computer was the best weapon in his arsenal, enabling him to come to his friend's defence without putting himself or his mate or his friends in any physical danger. I definitely see him as mischievous on occasion, even when--or *especially* when--inflicting damage on people who mess with his friends. :) As for your question about Lex's mate: In my ficverse, Cornelia (okay, I hope this isn't too much of a spoiler, but I'm sure a lot of people have guessed it already--Cornelia is the "Gargoyles 2K" version of Asrial) has always been a tinkerer and a builder, constructing all kinds of gadgets and stuff. When she found herself on the eve of the 21st century, she immediately wanted to know about current technology--and who better to teach her than Lex? That's how they hooked up, and immediately realized they were soul-mates (they immediately "clicked" and this lead to a number of incidents that earned Cornelia the nickname "Horny Corny" :). Lex does the programming stuff, and Corny has a gift for the hardware side, building gadgets--but she also has a knack for programming. Their idea of a fun evening is playing Duke Nukem or Quake or Half-Life, or writing code, or constructing some kind of device, and so on. I guess you could say they're the Gargoyles 2K equivalent of The X-Files' "Lone Gunmen." :)

Robby: Heh..."Slammarino!" is a reference to a little TV show called "21 Jump Street." I remember seeing an episode in which some of the guys went bowling and Jonny Depp yelled "Slammarino!" whenever he made a strike. His buddies got rather annoyed with him, if I remember correctly. ;)
Pistoff - [pistoff@outgun.com]
Friday, August 13, 1999 11:13:46 PM
IP: wire-24.koalas.com

*Peers In* Wow... it's so quiet in here..

question> how do you post midis? ;_; I forgot how
Bronx Wyvern - [Bronx4me@aol.com]
Friday, August 13, 1999 10:47:17 PM
IP: spider-wa011.proxy.aol.com

**Robby comes in and maims DC for all the computer troubles he had last night, but doesn't touch his evil, nastier twin CD because well... CD he doesn't want to mess with.**

Well now, I've missed nearly two days of CR stuff now... Grr...

Lotsa newbies all of a sudden... Interesting. I was used to seeing a newbie every week or two, but several people showed up in a couple of days along with a lot of oldies who haven't posted in quite a while...

Jaden- Its not that I particularly want everyone to VISIT STATION 8!, its more a matter of the fact, it needs the traffic and as room Administrator here I feel its almost my job to try and help our sister room. So...

VISIT STATION 8!

Pistoff- "Slamarino"? WHats that from?

Wilek- Nightday is the result of me starting to say the other night, and then realizing it was the other day.

Coyote- haven't had a chance to read the latest WCC fic, been busy with school and computer glitches...

Fire Storm- For using the DumlaoX picture you are... I dunno... Can't think of a punishment. its not a ban worthy thing, and I hardly use the thing anyway... Um... Slap on the wrist?

As far as the "As above, as below" phrase for beaked gargoyles, genetically speaking it shouldn't work that way, but considering how gargs vary anyway... Who knows?

TGS based fanfic- As Patrick said, its encouraged, as long as credit is given where its due.

**Throws rotten fruit at Xanathar** That joke deserved it.

Aaron- If I got the eye of Odin, there's no telling what I'd turn into. To be honest, I'd rather not contemplate it.

Scooby Doo- They WERE druggies. Between the "Mystery Machine" with those trippy colors, Shaggy and Scooby always being jumpy and hungry, the scooby snacks and the time period, AND the fact they called the dog DOOBIE... Well...

Batya- The reason certain, really good authors and artist didn't end up in the poll is two fold. One- there are very prominent people like Christine and Christi who take lots of the votes, but also... Not enough people voted! Between the two rooms there's at least 65 visitors, and most likely more. When only 32 voted, well. That hurt... Meybe next year...

Warpmind- You couldn't find a copy of "We Are The Champions"? Off the top of my head I can think of a dozen sites that have that song in various lengths. Care for me to do my duty as CR DJ and give you a link to one or two?

SOROW- Eh, school is gonna be a breeze this year. I don't even have a class last hour... I'm redefining the term "Senior Slide"...

Zoog Disney? Um... Okay...

Dreams- I remember them occasionally, but always forget them fairly quickly. Nothing ever garg related I don't think.

Mates for the trio- Heh heh... You should see who I mate Brooklyn up with in my fic cycle... (I'm gonna have to do a final, full scale edit on that one of these days, write the final chapter, and put it up...)

Jenniren- Do you realize Pale Rich Orange is my dead evil twin's text color? Rich orange is mine...

Aaron- Interesting G2001 plans... I like 'em!

Lexy- Dang, I *really* need to post my fic series... SInce I did it totally independantly without ever coming online and no clue who Greg Weisman was or any of the other online stereotypes like Lex meeting a girl over the net... The female I pair Lex up with is rather different than all the rest... But nothing compared to who Brooklyn eventually ends up with...
Robby
Friday, August 13, 1999 07:27:37 PM
IP: spider-wj084.proxy.aol.com

Doug> <<"My Frankunsteen monster." "Frankenstein?" Zale asks. "Isn't he one of our occasional opponents?" "Not Frankenstein, Frankunsteen! (cyber cookie to whoever is first to get the in-joke.)>> The movie Young Frankenstein? :)

Real post later. [Wilek gazes in the general direction of his ISP and giggles psychotically.]
Wilek
Friday, August 13, 1999 07:26:37 PM
IP: tnt-2-01-56k.portsmouth.zoomnet.net

HAPPY FRIDAY the 13!

Aaron> Thanks for the kind wishes! I'm feeling much better now...but...this whole medication thing I'm having to go through is scarin' the crap out of me! I'm glad there are people here I can talk to!

Gargoyle dreams> As far as this topic goes... the moment I realize I'm dreaming about gargoyles, I wake up! It really pisses me off, I guess I get too excited! I really don't remember what the whole dream is about, but I remember fragments. For example, I recall one scene where there is a huge flood in Manhattan and Goliath breaks his leg... and from another dream, Brooklyn is expertly performing surgery on one of Lex's robotic arms (VERY bloody).

Jackal> Please post! PLEASE!
SOROW
Friday, August 13, 1999 07:16:54 PM
IP: usr11-dialup300.mix1.irving.cw.net

Hmm Seems todays topic would be a possible mate for Lex. I created one named Miranda,she is the shortest female and becasue she is short she was the last of the females for the guys to drool over on Avalon. She likes Lex for his intelligence and because he is such a sweetie.
Spacebabie - [Spacebabie76@yahoo.com]
Orlando, Florida, U.S.A
Friday, August 13, 1999 07:03:37 PM
IP: ts002d37.orl-fl.concentric.net

Aaron: Be my guest. ;)

Interesting, they just showed a bit on the news about Columbine High School preparing to re-open for the first time since the shootings. They're really prepared to the point of overkill now ... they've nearly quadrupled their security precautions. But they don't have metal detectors ... the administrators state that metal detectors would make school seem "more like a prison." (Yeah right, like 28 security cameras and uniformed armed security personnel doesn't already. :P)
Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Friday, August 13, 1999 05:54:26 PM
IP: modem59.i-is.com

Last post before I go for the weekend.

Coyote> Whatdya think, should we send Ace that events schedule?

Later.


Aaron - [JCarnage@Yahoo.com]
San Antonio, TX, USA
Friday, August 13, 1999 05:38:49 PM
IP: ppp-48.tnt-1.sat.smartworld.net

*L* ya that would be funny..*giggles* *waits for more responses*
Lexy
Friday, August 13, 1999 04:45:45 PM
IP: d100.hnet.net

Ironwolf- <Great minds think alike> I like to think so!!:)
jenna
Friday, August 13, 1999 04:35:10 PM
IP: unknown-31-157.glm.com

Opps and here I thought I was being original oh well great minds think alike. ;) must catch up on cr
TGS is in a good position to do this. A Scottish female injured and needing modern science as well as stone sleep to cure her. Hudson would be ecstatic to see some of the old ways being kept alive by a clan of Gargoyles. Hmm lex baby siting Alex the Scott female showing curiosity over a human child cause she has never really seen one. Hmm they starting spending time together hmmm. Ironwolf looks up uhh why are all these Creativity demons flocking around me. Uh ahh no really I am busy umm somebody…….. help

Ironwolf
Friday, August 13, 1999 04:27:15 PM
IP: host-209-215-9-51.cha.bellsouth.net

Iron wolf-- said some similar comments about Lex's mate-- look below.
Jenna
Friday, August 13, 1999 04:10:52 PM
IP: unknown-31-157.glm.com

Lex> You know I thought I would throw in 2 cents on this. Every one is doing a teckie girl for lex. Well just to be evil how about opposites attract. “the theme from moonlight or is it moon lighting?” What if lex hooked up with one of the Scottish clan’s females? A very aggressive woodsy female hooking up with a sensitive teckie male! A mate that will not let him sit and brood all the time, but be the type of gall that would light a fire under his tail to get him moving. It is just a thought from the guy that brought you the evil Broadway form dimension x.
Ironwolf
Friday, August 13, 1999 04:09:21 PM
IP: host-209-215-9-51.cha.bellsouth.net

THANKS C The Bando and Jenna! Good insights there *nods* I very much agree with all that was said. Especially that comment by Jenna with Alex. I think Lex would be a good Father..sure hed have his problems like everyone else..but really..he seems to be very good with children..ppl who are good with kids are usually good with most kids in general. I also agree that being with Alex gives him some edge or atleast practice with children which could make him handy around the rookery. As for him thinking of the others as they begin to start their familes..ya..poor guy..hes gonna feel so left out..*decides not to go to far on a ramble* *thanks everyone again* BYE ill be by later;) keep um coming fan fic writers or readers or both!
lexy - [lex@hnet.net]
west bend, wi, usa
Friday, August 13, 1999 03:39:04 PM
IP: d114.hnet.net

Whew!! Been crazy here!! I still want to add my two cents to Pistoff's and Kioto't statements, but will do that later-- as the question about Lexy won't be so involved, I'll talk about that now.

I have specific plans for Lex (but no! I won't give any spoilers)-- right now it is unclear as to weather or not he'll get a mate. But the type of mate I think would have to have a respect for his knowledge. A mix of opposites would be interesting, instead of a shy female lets have one who is brash and agressive,tomboyish, and above all blunt. This would allow some play of his gentleness.

You all will laugh at this, but where I work I there is a guy who reminds me alot of Lexington. NO I'M NOT KIDDING! His name is Lincoln (won't give the last name). He works in the MIS--the computer dept that takes care of our computer problems worldwide with the company. Like Lex, he is very short (sbout 4foot 11) and young--the youngest in the company barely 21 I think.He loves computers and is on them when ever possible. He is very sweet and kind of has that sheepish, but charming, shyness about him, like Lex. Even his voice reminds me of Hernandez's who did the voice for the green gargoyle. Also having met Thom, who was just very sweet, helps me picture the character a lot better.

I see Lex in my stories as being sweet,but still shy. As for "going to the dark side", well we all can stumble and fall- so Lex is no exception. But I really don't see him as ever being as terrible as he appeared in FT. I hope to bring out more of a sense of his humor than was in the show.

I think there is a part of Lex that may feel a bit insecure to his size. But I don't know if it would be as bad as it was shown in Reprisals in TGS-- I don't see Lex as having the same degree of self-loathing that was shown.

I think Lex's relationship with Alex should be explord, and I intend to do so. It could be that with Alex, Lex for the first time begins to think about mates and more specifically hatchlings- either of his own, or belonging to Angela and Broadway. His incliation to nuturance, makes me me think he would be a good father.

**laughs to self** And it just occured to me that Lex and Lincoln both have names that begin with "L"!!
Jenna
Friday, August 13, 1999 03:17:30 PM
IP: unknown-31-157.glm.com

Whew, I'm posting an awful lot today. Well, as long as I'm doin' it this way ... **switches out the candles**

Lexy: The only mate I can speak for fer sure, dontchaknow ;), is Pontiac ... maybe her personality will give ye an idea of my interpretation of Lex.
Pontiac is one of the younger Clan Detroit members, from the same rookery as the Clan's leader (Mustang). She's always been fascinated by all things mechanical, especially cars ... growing up in a junkyard might do that to ya. Anyway, using the assumed name "Lynn Pontiac," she applied for and was awarded an SAE mechanic certification about 25 years ago ... something nearly unheard of: a *woman* (well, female) who was a certified mechanic! ;)
When Lex arrives, she passes on a lot of her mechanic knowledge to him. In return, he gets her involved in all matters regarding computers, acting as her tour guide around the 'Net. It's basically their tech-headedness ... albeit in two vastly differing fields ... which draws them to each other. It's also partly because Lex fascinates Pontiac, being an outsider and all ... when I drew up her character sketch, Pontiac was the only one of the Detroit clanmembers who had left Detroit (up until the other three ... Mustang, Dodge and Buick ... showed up in New York looking for her in "Faces of the City.").
Their daughter looks like she may have the potential of being a tech-head, as well, though in a much different field than her parents. What the field is remains to be seen ... but right now, if I write an older Cadillac, she's going to have more in common with our friend Gunjack than she will with her parents. :)

Doug yet again ;): I just read your post fully ... don't know why I missed it the first time. Sorry to hear ya got downsized, friend. Here's hoping you have luck finding new employment, and they *don't* downsize ye again.
Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Friday, August 13, 1999 02:00:02 PM
IP: modem59.i-is.com

*runs in*

OOH OHH were having a LEX discussion! *beams* ok heres a question..When we look at Lex's Fic mates ie. Aiden, Tina, Pontiac, Liz etc... what does that say about how WE think of Lex. I mean, we got to see a little of Brooklyn on the show..hes a hopless romantic for sure;) and Broadway..hes a sweetie..course we already knew that. But what about lex? Aside from that lil short intanglment with Angela..(which was purly monkey see monkey do) any Lex/mate involvment we have had to creat for ourselves. What im getting at here is, anything we write about Lex and his mates is ALL from us, the viewers and fans. SO what does that tell us about how we view him. I mean..why do we think lex is a bit naughty as a mate? Is that because on the show and in most things Lex just isnt all that he seems..? The lil innocent guy er-go:P (sp) must be adventerous?? (sp) What does it tell us about what kind of mates we have for him. They all know lots about tech. and are usually a mixture of quiet and funloving with that behind the sceens stuff ie. Aiden and magical blunders Tina and her naughty side..etc. Kinda a good likeness to Lex if you ask me.

Well..I guess I would just like to hear from those ficcy writers out there. Why did you make lex the way he was? Was it because that was your take on him..or do you believe that from what we saw he IS infact that way just never got a chance to show it. Same question for Lex's mates. Why are they the way they are? Did they just seem a likly match to his personality..or do you personlly think that is the kind of girl hed go for..and why?

THANKS! *runs out*
Lexy - [lex@hnet.net]
West Bend, WI, USA
Friday, August 13, 1999 01:44:21 PM
IP: d088.hnet.net

What would Tina do if she found out Lex had cybernetic implants?
Well, in my stories, he doesn't have the implants, however, he does have a really cool 'speed suit' based on something the military's been developing. Tina's another computer geek so she'd probably be fascinated by Lex's cybernetic implants. Lex, on the other hand, would be forever hiding her tool kit. Tina has this nasty habit of disassembling small appliances when she's frustrated. *laughs* I suspect that Lex would always want to stay on her GOOD side!
Spike
Friday, August 13, 1999 01:07:40 PM
IP: pppt19-113.ght.iadfw.net

Coyote> Sounds like a plan to me.

Doug> Really? I was hoping they'd stick with the original title.

Later.


Aaron - [JCarnage@Yahoo.com]
San Antonio, TX, USA
Friday, August 13, 1999 12:34:58 PM
IP: ppp-120.tnt-1.sat.smartworld.net

Sorry for the 2x post ... but I forgot something!!

Doug re: Lex's mates: Pontiac *does* know about Lexington's cyber enhancements ... though it's a scene I haven't written yet, when she first met him she was saving his life because in his exhaustion, the weight of the implants was making him sink into the Detroit River. She knows everything there is to know about him, and it doesn't faze her one bit ... she'll still stand by his side, whatever happens. He's brought her the most happiness she's ever known, both with their love affair and mating and with Cadillac, so there's no way the cyber implants will ever come between them.
Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Friday, August 13, 1999 12:34:21 PM
IP: modem59.i-is.com

Bronx: If ya want rain, go to either Michigan or Arizona. (It's been raining all morning here, and from what I understand Arizona is still in the middle of its annual "monsoon season.") As for all the suggestions that have been given on what to avoid ... I say the same thing I do when I state that my *lucky number* is 13:
DEFY SUPERSTITION!! :)

Doug: Glad you liked "Team Bravo." I *was* slightly worried about Rachel's characterization, as I've already received one piece of feedback telling me someone was "disappointed" with their character's development in "Team Alpha." Considering that some of the characters are better developed than others, unfortunately stuff like this is gonna happen. **sigh**
Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Friday, August 13, 1999 12:29:17 PM
IP: modem59.i-is.com

**RP TIME!**

The screen opens with the computer room of the bad guys' secret base. "Okay, Tyl," Corax is saying to his partner. "I sent the message." "Good," the other evil hacker nods. "Soon Gubio and his pals will come like flies to honey." "One question. Why'd it have to be who did this?" "Because, Corax, my friend, you are the only one of us who the Ravens could get a message of defection from which they'd believe." "Oh. Well, that's brilliant!" "Isn't it?" They share a fiendish laugh.

Meanwhile, on the Avatar of Ganon, Fleur is still about to tell the others what she's been up to during her absence. "Listen," Kit says to her, "you don't have to tell us everything if you're nervous about it. We just want to know what happened to you, and be sure that there's no new threats coming because of where you went." Fleur looks away and sighs. "It's nothing," she tells them. "There's just a lot to remember. Can you please hang on while I try to get it straight?" Doug nods. "Alright." He then turns to make a post.

**END RP FIRST BIT**

Greetings. Just so you all know, this is the last post Kit and I will be making this week. This afternoon we both have to jet off to visit our families again before school starts (we tried to convince them this was unnecessary, but, well, you know how families are). So we won't be back till Monday, hope you can survive without us till then. :) $ The RP is of course NOT suspended during our absence. $

Fanfic Progress: Yes, I know I got Part One of Protected Species done MUCH earlier than expected. Hope many people will still read it. :) I also want feedback, five stars from some anonymous reader is not enough! But you all know that. Anyway, I'll start on Part 2 when I get back from my visit and proceed on that much more slowly due to school starting soon. If anyone's wondering why I got the first part finished so suddenly, it's mostly because Dominos let me go on Tuesday of this week (God, I hate downsizing). I have more free time now, but the loss of my job is still a pain. <shakes head> Oh well, on to replies.

Sleepy Hollow, 13th Warrior: Both these movies are definitely on my list of must-see. Especially the second one. Glad they decided not to call it "Eaters of the Dead."

Mandi: You'll probably beat us to the Bowfinger review, so go right ahead. We'll be seeing that movie when we get back, if we see it at all (some of the trailer jokes look a little too dumb to enjoy). If nobody else reviews it when we do return Kit or I will have a review of Brokedown Palace, though (it looks like a good movie).

Trio's Mates: I know in my ficverse, Broadway and Angela are together (I kept it because I was absorbing all the original eps, and because I agree that they're right for one another). Brooklyn has Sata, and Lex has Aiden, too. Though my Aiden has experienced significantly fewer magical accidents than the official one in Christine's fics. That's probably 'cause she's developed the character more. :)

Speaking of Lex's mates, I'm wondering something. How do you think his various mates and/or best friends in all the ficverses (Aiden, Tina, Pontiac, Liz, etc.) would react if they found out he had cybernetics a la the TGS Lexington? Just curious about this. Personally, I think Aiden might be a little disturbed by them at first but then keep caring about Lex just the same, cybernetics or no. Pontiac probably is able to see them as a part of Lex and not a bad one, while Liz would probably think they were really cool. :) I haven't read too many of Spike's non-TGS fics, so I'm not sure about Tina.

Religion and the Illuminati: I agree that few of them are probably that religous. They have too much worldly power for that (personal power in this world and immortality often make one not care who holds power in the next life or even if there is one). I also think there are some Society members who see religion as just another means to control the masses and no more than that (losers).

Traveler: Yep, you're right, the battle between Seth and the Dragon King (not saying which one he'll fight yet) will be one heck of a fight. It's not going to happen for a long time, but when it does. :) As for Matt and Nikki's relationship, I can't tell you any more than Kit already did. We'll see more development on it in the upcoming "Repurcussions." The clan will also encounter the Punisher in that one, and the last T-Fisk infiltrator robot Kingpin left behind will be handled somehow. :)

**SPOILERS FOR COYOTE'S TEAM BRAVO**

Coyote: Good job on your latest story. I really liked the scenes with Rachel (you had her perfectly in character and developed well, kudos). Good development on Graeme too, the scene where he took Caligo's sword and took out Zanthe was excellent. Also liked how you developed the relationship between Ravyn and Alex, hope to see some bits with Ravyn and you soon. :) Overall good job on the fic, keep up the great work!

**WCC TEAM BRAVO SPOILERS END**

Kaito, Lexy: Like everyone else, I'm glad you two finally got together and had such a good time. Hope you can see one another again very soon. Kaioto, thanks for posting those words on hate and self-control. Like I told you on IM last night, I completely agree. Trying to blame tools rather than people and impose restrictions usually only compounds the problem. We need to change ourselves and stop hating each other if we are going to get past the violence and move ahead.

Batya: Yes, you were up to Shadow, if I recall correctly. I'm interested in seeing your Archetype posts again too. :) Oh, and welcome back!

Characters' Voices: I try to make the characters sound like they do on the original Gargs show when they speak in my fanfic too. Except when the situation requires them to speak differently or I want to develop them further like Coyote said in one of his posts. It also helps me when I write new characters to imagine a certain actor doing their voice and/or role. I've already mentioned a few examples. (O'Neil is Christopher Walken, Seth is Kurt Russell, Rachel is Rachel Leigh Cooke, and so on. If anyone's wondering, I'm not certain who'd be doing most of the new characters in Protected Species. Moro is Elijah Wood, though. I'm pretty sure of that. :)

Gargoyles Dreams: I've had a few. Most concerning Kit or Elisa's gargoyle forms, or Angela. :) Some, though, have spawned characters and stories. Nikki originally came about as partly the result of a dream. She's the only example I can think of right now.

Fleur: Hope you're able to come back and talk to us again soon. If you're having DC trouble again, kick him a few extra times for us during the revenge. :) $ Oh, and when you do come back, we hope that you will please tell us a little about what happened to you during your RP absence. We're very curious about it. :) $

That's all till we get back. Later, everybody, and happy Friday the 13th. <waves>

**RP RESUMES**

"Okay," Fleur sighs as Doug finishes. "I'm ready now." The Ravens crowd in closer to listen. "It all started..."

Meanwhile, back in the enemy's secret base, Dr. Ed Edison and his very straight-backed assistant Igor (who defies stereotypes) are standing in their laboratory next to a huge mass of equipment. In the center, hooked up to several electrical devices, is a large body covered by a white sheet. "Why have you called me here?" Thailog asks Edison as he and General Zale walk in. "I've created a new soldier for us," the completely mad scientist laughs. "My Frankunsteen monster." "Frankenstein?" Zale asks. "Isn't he one of our occasional opponents?" "Not Frankenstein, Frankunsteen! (cyber cookie to whoever is first to get the in-joke.) This monster will be much stronger than Frankenstein and completely loyal to us. I shall now give it the spark. Throw the switch, Igor!" The assistant does so and Edison grins as electricity arcs through Frankunsteen's body and he begins moving. Soon the sheet is pulled away from his eyes, revealing a really stupid-looking face dominated by a rictus grin. "It's alive!" Edison screams in delight. "It's alive!!" Thailog and Zale look at his creation and then each other, raising their eyebrows as they wonder about Frankunsteen's usefulness. The screen goes blank.

**TO BE CONTINUED, END RP**
Doug - [frostfire@mail.utexas.edu]
Friday, August 13, 1999 12:23:53 PM
IP: pool-207-205-237-144.dlls.grid.net

Aaron<<Today is Friday the 13th>> If you don't mind I would also like to add:

1) Stay away from black cats, even if you have one
2) Don't use unbrellas (that's not hard seeing USA doesn't have any rain to offer)
3) Avoid walking under ladders
4) Please, if you see a purple liquid in a vile hanging around... don't open it!

Jaden> Yup, I've also experianced dreams when I knew I was dreaming.

That's all for now!

"Twidle blane and Twidle brain? If it's all the same I'll play your game!"

Bronx Wyvern - [Bronx4me@aol.com]
Friday, August 13, 1999 11:59:11 AM
IP: spider-wm032.proxy.aol.com

Aaron: ROTFLMSAO!!
While it probably wouldn't be as enjoyable as *that* itinerary ... y'think if we pester Ace enough about it we can get her and her buds to put together a bid? ;)
Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Friday, August 13, 1999 11:51:29 AM
IP: modem59.i-is.com

Aaron wanders into the CR, nails a horseshoe above the door, and starts passing out four-leaf clovers.

For those who've forgotten, it's Friday the 13th today. So just follow these simple rules, and things should be okay.

1. Avoid people named Jason.
2. Avoid drug and alcohol use. (*That* should be difficult)
3. Avoid sex. (See note above)
4. Do not go to camp.
5. Stay out of the woods, especially woods in Maryland or New Jersey.

Geez, I'm starting to sound like Randy in Scream.

Is there anybody besides me who'd kill to hear David Warner say "You call Dragon, Ogre, Giant Bat a divination spell?"

Gyre> No, you're hardly the only one who makes typos. I made a terrible one yesterday, which Warpmind was kind enough to point out.

SOROW> Hope you feel better.

Toku>Speaking of Valujet, technically they don't exist anymore. They bought out another Florida airline with a better saftey record and changed their name. The same airline, BTW, that some of us will have to fly to get to G2K.

The Sixth Sense> I won't do a review per se, since that would require spoilers, and this is a movie like The Crying Game or The Usual Suspects that you should see cold. If there were any justice in the world, there would be Oscar nods for Bruce Willis, and the kid. 4/5 skulls.

Coyote> Yes! G2001 in Portland! I'm with this all the way, and I've even taken the liberty of drawing up an events schedule.

Day One.

Morning: No events, just a meet and greet in the hotel lobby, so we can all get to know each other before the festivities start.

Afternoon: Official Greg-type stuff; Q & A sessions, videos, movie update(postponed another year)

Evening: Full-contact midnight basketball.

Day Two.

Morning: Panel discussions. "Car Theft", "VW Maintenence", and "Why American Beer Sucks."

Evening: Lobster bake, followed by the costume contest and G2001 swimsuit calender shoot.

Day Three.

Morning: Strip down, grab your clubs, and head off to the links for the Official G2001 Underwear Open. 18 holes, or until we get bored, of golf in you skivies.

Afternoon: End the con with the Official Outklaw "Party Til You Puke" Beer Party and Drinking Contest. Party lasts until we run out of beer, or the cops show up, whichever happens first.

Note: In future in may be wise not to let Smith and Wesson be the events planning committee. And I have to go now before Wagner and Caligo kick my @$$.

Later.

Aaron beats a hasty retreat, whistling INXS' "Building Bridges"


Aaron - [JCarnage@Yahoo.com]
San Antonio, TX, USA
Friday, August 13, 1999 11:42:21 AM
IP: ppp-120.tnt-1.sat.smartworld.net

Dreams> all my dreams are at some point lucid. I either get mad bored or frustrated and take over. As for Gargoyles the only time any uh lets say hero has every been in one of my dreams is just once and every hero was in this dream, and I do mean every heroic figure I have every read or seen was in it. The really weird part is it was a serial dream I would wake up and the next night the dream would pick up form where it left off. This went on for a week until well lets say it had a weird and really twisted ending, and no villain deserves what I did to Freddie K, but he should not have killed her. So has anyone else had a serial dream?
Ironwolf
Friday, August 13, 1999 11:24:43 AM
IP: host-216-78-83-34.cha.bellsouth.net

Is there anyone else here that lives around the chicago area[I live only 20 minutes away myself]. The closest one in the near future being in ohio. That sucks. No-one in my family would go that far for a gargoyles convention exept for me. I guess I could hitchhike all the way there.
traveler - [Goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Friday, August 13, 1999 11:00:49 AM
IP: proxy-443.public.paix.webtv.net

Pist off and Kioto-- I was very moved by both of your arguments-- I myself may contribute later, but for now I would be too inturupted in my train of thoughts.
Jenna
Friday, August 13, 1999 10:34:10 AM
IP: unknown-31-157.glm.com

Quickie reply ...

Indiana Traveler: The location of the Gatherings is decided at each Gathering, when a bid party puts in its bid for a particular city and gives its promises. The reason why the Orlando group won the bid for next year is ... well, because the Orlando bid was the only one. The word on the 'Net right now is that bids are coming together for Cleveland and Los Angeles ... and if Cyrway follows through (and I told her I'd back her up if she tried it), possibly one for Portland, Maine.
Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Friday, August 13, 1999 10:32:00 AM
IP: modem59.i-is.com

Jaden - you asked [has anyone had a dream when you know you're dreaming?]

Yes. I believe the technical term for it is "lucid dreaming" - where you realize you're dreaming and are then able to control the dream. I haven't had any recently. But when I had them I realized the dream was usually more interesting when I didn't try to control it too much. (I wonder if there's some sort of moral lesson in that.) Anyway, I don't usually try to control my dreams anymore except to make it so I can fly. I have a lot of flying dreams where there is a ceiling. I want to fly up in the sky and look down at the earth as if from an airplane, but nearly always a ceiling appears and blocks my way. I suppose it is psychological - a metaphor for the story of my life. :(

Pale Rich Orange is today's color.


Jenniren
Friday, August 13, 1999 09:59:44 AM
IP: user-2ivf2bi.dialup.mindspring.com

Hello, everyone. This is my last post before I can access the internet from the school I'm attending! ALL JOYRIDERS, PLEASE HELP ME GET ALL JOYRIDE EVENTS BETWEEN NOW AND MY RETURN! And sorry I yelled, but this was fairly impotent... um, important.

All right, you primi... no, wait, that was Bruce Campbell's line.

Listen up, looks smart, etc.
As I am now moving forth back to the college (I think that's the equivalient level, US terms) I may not be able to post quite as often as I have this summer. And if I get as much as one - 1 - comment the likes of "and good riddance", I'm plausible to go ballistic. Then again, I may not.

Xanathar, why do I have a feeling we'd be able to get a buttload of laughs from the surroundings, should we ever meet? I get a very distinct feeling we could do a lot of good in this world. Or bad, depending on the flip of the coin. Of course, considering we're pretty much on opposite sides of the planet, you in Australia, me in Norway, it'll have to wait a while. Or maybe we meet at G2000? I'll try, for all it's worth. **Starts polishing the shotgun before visiting the bank**

Reverend Attila: Please e-mail me a character description for the Joyride page. I'll need it to update the cast. By the way, pardon the pun, but I've got a feline you might have some extraordinary powers hidden under that fur.

Well, catch ya later, gotta meet the bus in 45 minutes, and the bus stop is half a click away, uphill.

Have a great weekend, averyone of the oh-so-noble CR.

**Pulls the pins out of two hand grenades and shoves them down DC's throat, just for the heck of it.**
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Friday, August 13, 1999 09:39:20 AM
IP: mp-217-241-82.daxnet.no

Interesting Mandolin and by the way nice ending for Blair Witch even though like you said it wasn't originally your idea but you posted it here not the other guy so you rock. (does Bill S. Preston and Ted Theodore Logn excellent sign with one hand)
James Birdsong - [LennexMacDuff@yahoo.com]
San Diego, CA, USA
Friday, August 13, 1999 09:33:55 AM
IP: dt049n74.san.rr.com

All right , now I'll really be compelled to read faster. Questions, who decides where the next gathering is , who are the makers of the gathering, and is anyone in this room involved in the bid. I know it's a long way off , but I have to be sure I'll be at one some day. Also is there an admission price? because I read something about someone getting free admission for winning a contest or something.Oh well , I must be patient.
There's something that has been bugging me about the series . something that has not been told by Greg Weisman. My question , Has anyone written any fanfic for what Demona and Macbeth did when they woke up on the skiff after the avolon episodes? It just seems to me that there was no real way for them to wake up without seeing each other and ripping each other apart . And if they woke up in daytime what did they think of each other then. And did anyone write any fanfic for what King Aurthur did when he woke up , I don't think he went strait to England. Too many questions. And if no-one used these ideas [which probaly hasn't happened] one of you more gifted writers can have them , or one of them. I don't plan to use them.
traveler - [goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Friday, August 13, 1999 09:32:51 AM
IP: proxy-323.public.rwc.webtv.net

Goodmorning all
Thanks for the morning jollies

Xanathar>>Zoogdisney, hang on while I check with the expert in our house...Okay its a place on the internet where kid's can play games, chat, vote for music videos etc, etc, etc brought to you by Disney. My ten year old thinks it's a cool place.

off to work
have a great day everyone


Delphi - [cmiller@magiclink.com]
Twin Falls, Idaho
Friday, August 13, 1999 08:47:53 AM
IP: 207.14.195.142

It's Friday! It's Friday! Yay!

Expect a review of "Bowfinger" tomorrow, if Doug and Kit don't beat me to it. :)

Lexy and Kaioto> Glad to hear your time together went so well. All together, now... "Awwwww." Seriously, I'm happy to hear it all went so well.

traveler without caps> <<Does anyone know if there is ever going to be a gathering in chicago?>> We won't know until the bid party at G2K wraps. The location of the next con isn't decided until the end of the convention itself. <<Can anyone tell me who the Unseelie are?>> Well, yeah, but it would completely spoil the end of Season 1. Go to the Season 1 Gargoyles episode archive and start with "To Restore Amends" - the first episode, I think, where Nicholas Maddox has some impact on the plot. It's more fun to get caught up from the beginning rather than just have someone spoil the entire season arc for you.

James> << I never dream >> Good heavens, I hope that's not true. REM sleep - dreaming sleep - is important to mental health, but I don't know specifically what or why. Hey, it's early. Being unable to recall your dreams supposedly indicates a lack of zinc in your diet. (And for those who are wondering: half of that was learned from Pop-Up Video.)

With all the talk about alternate endings for Blair Witch, I felt compelled to post this. I didn't write it; Peter Milan posted this to the BtVS creative newsgroup, and, well, I thought the CR would get a kick out of it.

THE BUFF WITCH PROJECT

WILLOW: Well, here we are in the Black Hills of Maryland. Hopelessly lost and stuff. And all crammed into one small tent.
XANDER: Yeah, that wasn't real bright of us. Why'd we do that?
WILLOW: Uh...a prophecy?
XANDER: Yeah, that oughtta do it. Go with that.
BUFFY: Sssh! Did you hear that?
[There are noises outside. Suddenly, something tries to reach through the tent. Buffy walks outside. There is the sound of a massive ass-kicking.]
BUFFY: Hey, guys, come on out!
[The others hop outside: Buffy is standing over the unconscious body of a witch.]
XANDER: Geez. Anticlimactic much?
BUFFY: Well, so much for that.
WILLOW: Did anyone bring marshmallows?

Again, Peter Milan wrote that, not me. ;)
Mandolin - [weird_web@hotmail.com]
Friday, August 13, 1999 08:47:27 AM
IP: ch164-10.apgea.army.mil

Hi all!!

Warpmind:**Walks in and throws a banana at Xanathar**
That joke WAS that bad, dude.>>Yeah it was wasn't it,I was in a wierd frame of mind last night.:)BTW I did like that idea you had about adding that stupid guy from the library to the list of targets for the joyride>:)

Bronx Wyvern:Was there a time any of you had a really cool Gargoyles Dream? And if so... what was it about?>>I've had many dreams about Gargoyles sadly I either don't remember them or can't repeat them in this comment room,I had this dream about Demona earlier in the week only she was visualy distorted,I'm nearly always in the third person in my dreams(exept for those terrifying one's were I get sucked out of an Airlock into space)

Pistoff:(re: Zoog Disney) Yesss! Right on! Hmm...another future target for the Joyride, folks? :)>>Sounds like a good idea to me,just one question,what is Zoog Disney?(other than a really cr@ppy name):)

Kaioto:Welcome Back! and your thoughts on violence and responsibility were very true.

Pistoff again:Instead of dealing with the root causes of these problems, everybody wants to ban books, CDs and movies. They would rather ban trenchoats than take responsibility for the real problems. They scream "gun control!" when they should be teaching kids about right and wrong from the moment of birth. If people would just take responsibility...but that's probably wishful thinking.>>*claps* I agree with you,but people will never change not in our lifetime anyway.

C'yas later!!
Xanathar
Melbourne, victoria, Australia
Friday, August 13, 1999 08:11:50 AM
IP: 203.29.192.74

Warpmind: I didn't say it was something you'd expect *only* from a soldier. My point was that it's something that you'd expect *more* from a soldier than from a minimum-wage employee. Or, at least, that's the way it should be, but apparently isn't. I mean, that's supposedly the difference between the military and the civilians. A soldier literally goes through hell, from boot camp on to the battlefield--but all I do is deliver pizzas. I shouldn't have to have the "kill or be killed" mindset, but I have it anyway. And that's what makes me so nervous....

BTW, cool quote. :) Very good point, there.
Pistoff
Friday, August 13, 1999 05:46:32 AM
IP: wire-20.koalas.com

Catching up on "old" comments, finally managed to get to read Kaioto's post... brilliant.

Those are some excellent points on vital questions of society and what is wrong in our world. And Pistoff - you do have a point about that "it's him or me" mindset. I'm partially inclined to agree; I too would instantly enter that frame of mind, but I disagree about it being only expected from soldiers. That mindset is our heritage from the days when we climbed down from the trees, when we wore untreated animal hides, and clubbed women in the head when we wanted to get laid (yeah, ok, maybe not that, but still). It is our natural drive to survive that has an effect in those situations. Of course, with the development of guns, that heritage has been greatly perverted. Alas, looking out on humanity today, I myself hold little hope for any solution to this mess... it's already gone too far (heck, the Judge Dredd movie, albeit as rotten as something that's been in the gutter for a decade, showed a likely future for the planet, maybe with the exeption of the post-nuclear war stuff). I'll add the best quote at the end of my post.

Oh, and Kaioto and Lexy: Happy for ya both. May your lives be happily intertwining in the great weave of time.

Hmmm... noticed Christine was icked out by "The interrogation of Princess Leia"... I'd say she never saw the story called "The Adventures of Onan the Barbarian". Now THAT was disgusting. And don't ask me for it, I only read it once, and only partially. *Shudder*

By the way, I liked "Alone", Fire Storm. Maybe a tad too... morbid for my tastes, but it was quite well put together. So, can I borrow Sara? *Suck up Deluxomatic*

Ok, gotta go. And now for the quote:

"Me, I hate guns. But if everybody's got'em, I want to get my hands on the biggest there is."
-Michael Garibaldi, Babylon 5
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Friday, August 13, 1999 04:17:18 AM
IP: mp-217-219-124.daxnet.no

Lexy and Kaioto: Glad you were finally able to spend some time together, and that you had such a good time. :)

Kaioto: Excellent points about hatred and violence and apathy. I've spent the past five years doing a job that can get me killed at any time, in any place. I know a woman who's got a nephew in the state prison because he ordered a pizza and then killed the driver who delivered it. Why? Because he wanted a pizza and the twenty bucks the poor guy was carrying. There was another case, a few years ago, when a pizza guy was killed--because the guy who killed him just "wanted to know what it feels like" to take a life. A long time ago I accepted the fact that every delivery I go out on could very well be the last time anybody sees me alive--and a long time ago I made up my mind that if such a situation arose, I won't go down easily, and if I am killed, I will do everything in my power to take the son of a bitch with me, until I draw my last breath. And for this I get paid minimum wage.

I haven't actually sat and thought about this for a long, long time. And when I do think about it, it's quite frightening. Not only the danger I'm in, but also the mindset that it created. The chilling thing is, when I really ask myself if I'm prepared to take another life if I found myself in this kind of situation, my answer is yes, absolutely, without hesitation. If it's me or some mugger, if there's no other way, then I'll do what I can to take him out, before he takes me out.

This is the type of thinking you'd expect from a soldier, not a minium-wage delivery guy. That's what scares me. Look at what I've become. My innocence and good-naturedness were taken from me, and all I get in return is $6.65 per hour.

Instead of dealing with the root causes of these problems, everybody wants to ban books, CDs and movies. They would rather ban trenchoats than take responsibility for the real problems. They scream "gun control!" when they should be teaching kids about right and wrong from the moment of birth. If people would just take responsibility...but that's probably wishful thinking.

David G: Good point about relaxing the rules. But the rules also constrain you. It's a tricky thing, but the rules should at least be able to bend a little. By imposing the "one POV only" rule, the editors are removing options for the writers, and the writers ultimately get punished for something they had nothing to do with.

Also, good point about fanfic having constraints. It depends on how it's handled, though. It's strange, but once you close yourself into a particular fanfic universe, if you play it just right, you can push the envelope to infinity. If you can make the characters talk and act as they did in the TV series, then you can do just about anything with them.

Sorry about that magazine that folded just after you did the rewrite. I always thought that kind of perfect timing only happened to me. :P As for destroying the entire publishing industry, hoo-ah! Count me in. I'm completely fed up with those bastards. :)

Stephen: Sorry about the rejection. Believe me, I know exactly how you feel. Hundreds of times over. :(
Pistoff - [pistoff@outgun.com]
Friday, August 13, 1999 03:42:20 AM
IP: wire-20.koalas.com

Hellu.

Fire Storm: I *know* why Spike refused to lend me Avery, thank you. Actually, she also mentioned not being so severe in her policy when it came to the mor peripheral characters, but never mind that. I do not look for alterniverse mates for the Trio just because I'm too darn lazy to come up with them myself. Heck, in my 'verse, Broadway's happy with Angela, Lex is someday gonna discover that Manxine wants her paws on him (pun intended), and I'm plotting out a chick for Brooklyn. All those three are (mostly) without outside help, save a tad of inspiration. The reason I'm looking for outside mates is I'm making a *crossover*, where one mate for each of the Trio is sucked into my fan-universe from their own, by some freak magical and scientific accident. Naturally, they would be returned to their own 'verses eventually, but the Trio would not really be entirely the same. So, seeing as though you crafted a mate for Broadway, may I borrow her for my crossover? I plan no extragavanza for either borrowed character, no majore events to scar them for life, or anything like that. Please? *Manga-sized eyes looking up at Fire Storm*

Well, gotta go, gotta pack the last things for the trip back to the dorm tonight... I'll be offline all weekend, and probably at least until wednesday, or so. It will be Hell.

"Pardon my French, but Merde!"
-Unknown
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Friday, August 13, 1999 02:30:26 AM
IP: mp-217-229-220.daxnet.no

Greetings all...

Some sort of good news. I got a reply from Marian Zimmer Bradley's Fantasy Magazine, concerning my first submission in the realm of Professional Genre Fiction. Essentially, my story "Goldeneyes" was considered a good story, but it didn't have the 'feel' of what she normally publishes in her magazine. So, while it was a rejection, it was a positive one at least.

Just wanted to share. :)

Maintain and Check Six!
Stephen "Coldstone" Sobotka, Jr. - [scififangargoyle@yahoo.com]
Spokane, WA, USA
Friday, August 13, 1999 02:16:20 AM
IP: m168.ieway.com

I know, long post about almost nothing , and look at me I'm writting again as soon as I sent the last one. I'd better stop and get some sleep . Maybe tomorrow I'll find something else to ramble about . Good night , my rookery brothers and sisters in clan internet.
traveler - [Goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Friday, August 13, 1999 01:56:17 AM
IP: proxy-313.public.rwc.webtv.net

Thanks again coyote. I'd better read faster to catch up to the current episode.
Does anyone know if there is ever going to be a gathering in chicago? Dallas and Tampa.At least I'm closer no than when I lived in California.And if 2001 turns out to be in L.A. I'm going to feel very angry. I already feel left out from the first four. At least I am closer to the general area. Actually, I'm wondering how far I am from the centerpoint of Dallas, Tampa, and New york. One of these days , when you guys go to the gathering , I'll be there , And that's if my mother or one of my aunts would take me if it ever does come around here . I am the lone gargoyles fan in my family. Actually , no-one else in my family [exept for my yonger cousins , the oldest of which is 11] would ever have anything to do with this show . It annoys them that it is my favorite show. I could've swarn that I saw someone [an adult I'm sure] get up in the middle of the night, when I was sleeping over at my grandmothers' house , Go into the livingroom [were I had three of my tapes, the ones with my favorite episodes] and then go into the kitchen and throw something in the garbage. I don't know what it was but when I woke up I only had 4 out of my 7 tapes . I didn't say anything at the time because I wasn't sure , but now with almost half the series gone to me I am very careful were I hide my tapes these days.I envy all of you with parents or friend that like the series as much as you do . Whenever I speak of the series to my mother she always changes the subject. usually it's about something she likes. I hate that.
traveler - [Goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Friday, August 13, 1999 01:49:44 AM
IP: proxy-313.public.rwc.webtv.net

Mary Flanders- Gargoyle stamps- Must find, must buy!

Bronx Wyvern- You woke-up just as you start to glide? That's a terrible time to. I've had dreams of gliding ever since I was a kid. Sometimes as a Gargoyle and sometimes as a person or some other being like a dragon. Sometimes I would just jump in the air and float down and other times
I could actually feel the wind on my face and wings as I flew above the ground. I love having dreams like that.

Speaking of dreams, has anyone had a dream when you know you're dreaming? I used to have them all the time and it was like I could make anything I wanted happen. Nowadays when I realize I'm dreaming I usually wake up.

Well, now I think it's a good time to try to dream. Night!
Jaden - [jaden12@hotmail.com]
Los Alamos, CA
Friday, August 13, 1999 01:45:37 AM
IP: pm0-18.vpop1.avtel.net

Warpmind: Don't worry about Spike not letting you borrow Avery. She just dosn't allow people to use her characters. I asked her if I could borrow Avery for a bit part and she didn't let me. It caused me to create a new character that I now has a complete back story for and plan on having in future stories. (Read the disclaimer in my story 'Alone' (Linked here))
Christine, on the other hand, let me borrow Aiden, Jerrico, and Elektra, but I only used Aiden and Jerrico. (Christi's refusal of Avery led me to rethink Broadway's mate, so I made a new one.)
I kept Aiden and Jerrico ONLY because it was a single story, and have changed my mind on Lex and Demona's mates.
So just look at that as the best possible thing that could have happened. Create your own characters, and expand your mind.

Coyote, Warpmind: Hey, I created a charcater named Sara as Broadway's mate. Warpmind, I suggest that you possibly combine other authors characters, not model after a single character, and make a new mate for Broadway.

Patrick: Thank you for your input. I did plan on asking the author also, but I felt I should also ask about TGS quoting policy, just to be safe.

Bronx: Cool gargoyles dreams? CONSTANTLY! (Alone... other as-yet-unpublished ones.) I try writing down the cool ones. My FAVORITE is one where everyone at a Gathering (As in G99) are turned to gargoyles and we all have a night on the town.

Jenna: The only problem with hearing the characters is you can actually start to hear them say things they would never say in the show.

Nuke on Avalon: Hmm... Well, I am in the party that believe that fae are effected by the detonation of a nuclear device. I think all would die. The aftermath radiation, on the other hand... I am not sure HOW it would effect fae.

USA.NET: I HATE it when I am only able to access my mail once every week!

REAL gargoyles: You know... lets just say for a moment that there ARE real gargoyles and they are waiting until they think they will be accepted by humans. When we can barely accept our selves, like all the shootings and news reports say, they would probally think that we would NEVER be able to accept them.

Sevarius and Alien DNA: Have a field day. He would probally map it, then just try everything he could with it.


<PRAISE//GIVER OF WILL>
Fire Storm - [Night-Flame@usa.net]
Friday, August 13, 1999 01:34:13 AM
IP: t2-31.visitus.net

**enters the room, switching out the candles**

Hmm ... the start of two good polls here, though one of them I've seen before. :)

Cherryblossom: Greetings. Feel free to leave yer sanity at the door. :)

Aaron, re: Eye of Odin: I'll stick with my answer from the other room ... the Eye would turn me into a bizarre cross between Stephen King and Dale Earnhardt. :)

Batya, re: speech patterns with canon characters in fics: If ya look at my cycle, all of my shots with the canon characters I have tried to stay true to their speech patterns established in the show, with only a few exceptions. (The biggest of these exceptions was Alex Xanatos' admonition to his father to ask Oberon for help: "If Oberon wants to save his sorry ass, he'd better pay up when you call in his favor.") Any deviation from established speech patterns in my stories has been situational, or in some cases my attempt to do some further characterization on the older characters.

Bronx, re: gargoyle-related dreams: As I've stated here before, some of my fics have come about *because* of dreams I've had. And I'll have more ideas stemming from my fevered unconscious working their way into stories ... the final WCC story ("Threnody") will have a lot of this, as I've played out the end of the war in my dreams several times, with several different outcomes.
And other dreams I've had, while wholly inappropriate to put into fics, have been ... rather interesting. Let's just say that they involve Ravyn in the form Wilek writes her and leave it at that.

**sighs briefly, looking to the candles' flames, then continues.**

Kaioto and Lexy: I'm happy for you two. Really. Through my own despair, I am not one to deny you your happiness, and I am thoroughly thrilled you two were able to meet at last.

**sighs again**

Indiana Traveler: To get the entire impact of the Unseelie storyline, read from about the midpoint of TGS Gargoyles season 1 (Nicholas Maddox' first appearance, I can't recall the ep title right now) on. Hope that helps.

**surrenders to his loneliness, sighs, sitting in the big chair and fixating on the candle's flame**
Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Friday, August 13, 1999 12:58:44 AM
IP: modem36.i-is.com

Jenniren>(When you dreamt you were Goliath, did you have feeling in your wings? ) Actually when I had that dream I was Elisa in gargoyle form (it's okay, I failed to mention that in the first place ^_^) Anyway, it's been awhile since remembering if I felt any sences in my wings, but I think it's a definete yes. It was a weird feeling, like an extra few pounds added onto your back, and I could feel that also.

Very Weird!

"Twidle blane and Twidle brain? If it's all the same I'll play your game!"

Bronx Wyvern - [Bronx4me@aol.com]
Friday, August 13, 1999 12:15:35 AM
IP: spider-wj042.proxy.aol.com

Oh, that is a good pic. I would have perfered his current self though.Maybe from now on I'll write in a different color too .
traveler - [Goliath01@ hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Thursday, August 12, 1999 11:45:46 PM
IP: proxy-333.public.rwc.webtv.net

I have never seen this pic,I hope it's good . I'm supprised that it's the only goliath picture, there should be more. Sorry everyone that I keep asking dumb questions. I know it's probaly annoying the hell out of all of you . there's still so much I don't know about fanfic writting [mostly the actual writting, I know how to write stories , but I don't know were to write the story , were to type it down ] . Maybe this will clear up my problem . I don't have a computer . I never have. I'm not using a computer right now. I'm using web t.v. Does anyone else own web t.v. and if you do , do the same rules apply ? And I'm using a pretty old t.v. one that doesn't show two or three inches of the top and bottom .
Can anyone tell me who the Unseelie are? I'm trying to read all of them in order but everyone is talking about them.
Come on , most of you were probaly like I am when you first came here, right? Thank you to everyone who has helped me get used to this.
traveler - [goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Thursday, August 12, 1999 11:43:03 PM
IP: proxy-333.public.rwc.webtv.net

[sfx - blood curdling scream]

Sorry, tension breaker, had to be done. I'm having a very strange case of writers block. Usually, I just have nothing to write (generally timed for a period when I have lots of time, and a desire to write). Now, I know what I want to write, I just can't find the energy to do it. When I finally get in front of the computer and open the file my concentration shatters. Interesting dust motes can distract me. It's pathetic.

Oh well, anyway, here's some comments.

Gargoyle Dreams - actually, I think I have had one of these. It's hard to say, my dreams are usually in third person, but with a very sympathetic character. Other times they're these incredibly twisted things that seem to make perfect sense at the time, and I can remember them in the morning, but not in any way that makes sense. The one I'm thinking of now was one of the weird ones, and Anton Severius played some role. It was something totally odd, like he was the clerk at a bookstore. Like I said, weird.

Fanfic vs. Original> I've done both. Pistoff's comment about having a set world is worth some additional comment. On one hand that makes things easier, because you don't have to build the whole world. On the other hand, you're somewhat constrained, because some elements that you'd really like to use just don't fit. I guess it depends on what your individual strengths as a writer are.

Lexy and Kaito> glad things worked out.

Pistoff> Just a couple of things, The way publishers want their manuscripts formated is kind of stupid, but nothing like trying to do a paper in MLA format. Be glad you're not in Grad School. Also, to some extent the strictness makes sense, because once you start relaxing the rules, where do you stop?

About the multiple POV thing, that's weird. I do stories with two or three POV's all the time, though never more than that. I guess a lot would depend on how you handled the transitions. Of course, none of my stuff has ever been published either. I think I'm under a curse. I had an article accepted, the editor just wanted a few changes. I did the re-write, and before they got back to me, the magazine folded.

I gotta start submitting again. Maybe I can destroy the whole publishing industry, and we can start over.

For all you Texans, or at least the ones who live near Dallas, Hawkwood Fantasy Faire opens this weekend. What does this mean to you? Simple, the cast is pretty cool. I'm friends with some of them. The weather is warm. You might get the chance to watch a Rennie spontaniously combust. And there's cool stuff to buy.

Oh, it aslo means my weekends are going to be full for a while, so, since I'm trying to kick the Internet-at-work habit, you might not see so much of me anymore. If I'm out of the loop for a couple of days, don't worry. I'll be back. (and don't think I didn't hear you mutter 'too bad', you in the back of the room)
David G. - [david_goodner@yahoo.com]
Arlington, TX, USA
Thursday, August 12, 1999 11:11:51 PM
IP: pppa60-fortworthb5-5r522.saturn.bbn.com

Bronx Wyvern - [Was there a time any of you had a really cool Gargoyles Dream? And if so... what was it about?]

I've had a couple of interesting gargoyles dreams - interesting to me anyway. One of them was very long and elaborate and involved the entire Manhattan clan - one of the few "epic dreams" I've had in my life. Maybe I'll post one of these dreams tomorrow if there's interest, but I'm too tired right now.
One question I have for you - I've never dreamt I was a gargoyle, but I have dreamt I had wings. They had no feeling in them. I could move them, but I couldn't feel them stretch out or feel the air beneath them when I used them to fly. It was very distressing to me in the dream, and I wondered about it when I woke up. When you dreamt you were Goliath, did you have feeling in your wings?

Batya - [What makes you think that Demona's decision was influenced by Titania? :) ]

I'm not really sure how to interpret the smiley, but it was at the end of "The Darkest Hour Part 2" - the business with Titania and the witchlight after Demona's conversation with a mysterious "other" outside Elisa's window.

...And I'm also interested in your archetype posts.

Jenniren
Thursday, August 12, 1999 10:38:37 PM
IP: user-2ivf54t.dialup.mindspring.com

*wonders is she actually did spread good vibes*

Hi Cherryblossom

Geez there is a HUGE ant on my keyboard *squish* its gone sorry folks it was like on of tose S.American ants.

Gargoyle Dreams? I had one a few nights ago... I had like alien DNA infuse with mine so I had like these healing powers where I could heal someone's wound within 15 minutes, Ok and Lex,Bronx,Angela and Demona were in it and we were riding Captin Conpaceter's ship from ReBoot..In otherwords it was weird.

Wcih leads to aninteresting topic. what would Sevarius do if he got his creepy mitts on some alien DNA?

Spacebabie - [spacebabie76@yahoo.com]
Orlando, Fl, U.S.A
Thursday, August 12, 1999 10:16:03 PM
IP: ts004d09.orl-fl.concentric.net

Well, I guess I should post too.

**I'll just warn off the newbies and anyone else not interested in Lexy and I meeting from this section of the post, OK?**

Well, I'll start out with saying that I like flying, but I hate planes. Give me a good old pair of eagle's wings any day, even gargoyle wings will do. Machines, bleah! I don't know the people that build or maintain the things, and I always have visions of ValuJet dancing in my head. The only thing worse than flying for me is trusting a loved one on one of those things … It is hard to think Lexy-chan will have to do what I did this Christmas.

Well, when I got in on Wednesday, it was all I could do not to run through the gate. I was ALIVE. What was more, I was in Wisconsin. God willing, I would see Lexy-chan waiting for me. I looked out, scanned the seats and pathways as I shuffled out of the way. Nothing … maybe they didn't get to go to the gate. I walked along, but something nagged me. I turned about and scanned the masses of people and seats. Still couldn't see … THERE. Lexy-chan was pearched next to the airline counter, far side from where I'd left, at about 90 from where I left. Still, she was hard to miss and easy to hug.

What struck me as most odd was the ease in which we fell into walking and talking to one another. Sure, we were both scared as heck, but we found it very easy to talk when we could since we were used to each other's voices.

Thursday was odd, but pleasant. West Bend is a city in population, but it is laid out like a town, a small one at that. Everything is a long, flat walk from one place to the next. Visiting Lexy's friends was an interesting hike. I must say, however, that meeting Lexy's friend Vicki's mom was nothing I was warned about. I can seriously appreciate people being protective about Lexy, but it is still awkward to walk into an friendly little pseudo-interrogation. Still, I came out with minimal scrapes and bruises. One of the oddest things in the world for me is talking with Evangelical Christians. I like them, but I often disagree with them about matters of dogma. To ME, this is hardly something to get upset over, but I've learned to step lightly around being dragged into direct confrontation and yes or no questions. It is a lot like fencing. Trying to put a good foot forward while not agreeing with someone is tough.

Eating with Lexy-chan was a pleasure, pure and simple. Sitting and walking were much the same. It seemed like we always had something to say, and when we didn't, words just weren't necessary. She also has nice taste in friends. They were all nice to get along with. I even started off on a good foot with her mom. I found it all very remarkable.

It struck me as odd how many things happened just the way we thought they would. For one thing, I told Lexy I'd sing. I did. She said if I did, she'd beat me up. Well, she pounded me a couple of times.

Leaving was torture. Even now, it hurts inside. We were rushed apart at the last minute, and now we have to wait so long. I know it sounds like a shmuck thing to do, but I keep wondering in moments of fancy whether or not I could find a counter part to my school in Wisconsin … *sighs* I know … can't do that, but it still hurts. I can't find options. This just isn't fair. I'm happy for the time I had, but it is truly a horrible thing to be so denied after tasting such wonderful company. I cried on the plane. *sighs*

**end reporting**

Hm … the news got me to thinking today. This last shooting in LA, another White Supremicist. Of course, around here, people are still yowling even more loudly for gun-control. I got down to thinking and came up with a question: "What about self-control?"

We live in a world where hatred is a common thing. Human beings hate. All of us do, to an extent. Hatred and apathy are the too mechanisms we have constructed to make it emotionally and psychologically simpler for us to wuss out on our responsibilities to one another.

Touching more directly one hatred though, what is the one thing that all these major shootings like Columbine all have in common besides guns? Hatred. Hatred also links these shootings to other accounts of murder and assault chosen and performed by people of capable minds. It even continues on down through most willful violent crimes. It continues down into the everyday slights in the way we treat one another. Into a tit for tat mentality of vengeance and petty power struggles.

In our world, hatred is becoming more and more accepted. Angst driven subcultures of self-hatred thrive in a general sense of despair. Racist and exclusive communities continue to draw in more and more people willing to blame and persecute faceless others for the evils in their own lives. Religious orders galvanize to draw lines in the sand between "us" and "them." Others simply throw up their hands and tell everyone else to F*** off. Our humor is heavily dependant on hatred, as is our entertainment value.

However, these trends have waxed and waned throughout the course of human events.

However, in America today, life is pretty darn cheap. Abortion, execution, wars, all seem so removed from reality that the loss in human life is neglected by the majority of people who claim to make up the most informed nations in history. Yes, the gun itself along with most ordinance weaponry and anti-personnel devices have contributed to the cheapening of life. We can never unlearn the ways to kill. Taking away legal rights to guns won't stop violence. It means that only criminals and the government will have weapons. We need to learn how to deal with (or in this case without) hatred.

Most who argue for gun control in my state also argue to support abortion, and oppose most organized religions, while promoting some form of atheistic, socialistic agenda. They have basically established themselves for a huge system that promotes order, freedom, and safety by neutering everyone. In the same hand, their political agendas rely most heavily on creating and exploiting strife between socio-economic classes, races, and walks of life. Instead of dealing with hatred, people wish to keep us from acting. This also, however, cripples our capacity for good acts. Their answer whenever the topic of hatred comes up boils down to this: "Make everyone the same. Stop examining our differences. Be ignorant and stop making judgments or choices of any kind."

What it comes down to, is that this system can not, and will not work.

The answer to stopping violence is to stop hatred and dehumanization. Education - not brainwashing - will contribute - not completely establish - to the solution. Individuals must change the way we look at one another, and how we conduct ourselves. We must recognize hatred in the way we treat one another, and seek to root it out when we can. It isn't OK to go through life holding grudges against the people who gave you swirlies in middle school. It isn't OK to go through life blaming "the gays" or "the jews" for your life not adding up to what you wanted it to. Eventually, you may have to confront an opportunity to lash out. I certainly hope, that when human beings come to those crucial moments, the majority who choose not to, make their decisions not because they are too cowardly, but because they realize there is something intrinsically wrong with wanted to hurt other people, that there is a sickness of the soul involved with taking a life.

I think it is foolish what the leaders of our political, media, and religious establishments try to sell us as solutions to our violence woes in America. We do not need religious brainwashing or big brother to fix this mess. We need individual accountability and moral responsibility. We don't need to have our capacity to think or act handicapped. We need to start caring about the lives of others again.

Looking back at some harsh words spilled over the year in the CR, I also came to realize something. The way people tend to argue is generally hate-based. When people come into conflict, more often then not, they try to take out the opposition on the other side more readily than support and justify there own stand point. Proclaiming your adversaries ignorant or immoral is often simply intellectual euphemism for name-calling.

We use guns and bombs and weapons of mass destruction because it is powerful, it is quick, even though it isn't the best way to resolve a conflict … because it is the Dark Side of the Force. We use this kind of hate-based opposition because it is powerful, because it is quick, even though it isn't the best way to make a point … because it is the Dark Side. We use these kind of manipulative, freedom-hating solutions to the consequences of poor choices because it is powerful, because it is quick, even though we know it isn't the best solution … because it is the Dark Side. We make many small, hateful or ignorant choices everyday, because we can't be bothered with the effort of making the right, responsible, considerate choices … because it is the Dark Side.

Once we get used to the Dark Side, it's insidious way of thinking poisoning our minds a little too far, when we've likewise cheapened life and morality to such a ridiculous extent as in America, is it any wonder we have such violence? No, it really isn't. Maybe that is why is never surprised me as much as some.

Hatred destroys. Taking away the tools for safety is an act of fear. Fear is also the Dark Side. Beware the fine line between safety and fear. Beware laziness and ignorance of thought, of letting others think for you. Beware the Dark Side.

"Once you start down the path, forever will it dominate your destiny."
- Yoda, "The Empire Strikes Back"

I guess I was in a Jedi frame of mind, eh?
Just something to think about, both in the respect of large issues (like national policy), and in the small ones
(like choice of words when talking to one another). Think about it.

Toku Kaioto - [kaioto@yahoo.com]
Boston, MA, USA
Thursday, August 12, 1999 09:52:13 PM
IP: 1cust112.tnt2.brockton.ma.da.uu.net

hi all
I'm kinda in the process of picking out a piccie that I like so don't mind me
Xanathar< I live in a mad house so I'm quite used to it, but thanks for the warning anyways!
you know, I think the comment room moves faster than the chat rooms at times?
how often do some ppl come in here?every hour? *lol*
Dreams< i have never had a dream about Gargoyles, but then again maybe I have and I just don't remember it, I forget a lot of my dreams within 15 minutes of waking up.
Planes< I love planes and everything about them, even those big commercial ones that are held together with chicken wire (I think thats what it was).
Well, I have to go, bye!!



cherry blossom - [Chryblsm15@aol.com]
WI, US of A
Thursday, August 12, 1999 09:14:51 PM
IP: 98ad643c.ipt.aol.com

Goodeve everyone

Dreams>> Yes, I've had a few, mostly about Goliath & Elisha, best not to describe them, wrong rating.

Just finished Skydancer's fic's and found some I really enjoyed. Wheeu, there is alot I have not read yet, rolls up her sleeves, well the only way to get things done is to dig right in... Heads back to fanfic archives...see you all later, oh and if I get lost in there, someone come dig me out.
Delphi - [cmiller@magiclink.com]
Twin Falls, Idaho
Thursday, August 12, 1999 09:07:57 PM
IP: 207.14.195.181

Wilek: Good point about Goliath and humor. Though some types of humor are universal. Goliath might not laugh at the Three Stooges, but he would probably bust up if he ever witnessed the absolute stupidity of my customers. ;) No, on second thought, he would probably just stare in utter shock...

Starsinger: Thanks for coming to my defense. Sorry about your family problems, too. I hope everything works out okay. Sorry I didn't mention this earlier, too, but I was somewhat...distracted. :( I think you have a point about working with the public too long, though... ;)

Something else I forgot due to distractions: Thanks to all who voted for Gargs 2K in the fandom poll. After my experiences with the editors and agents in the publishing world, this means a lot to me. :)

Fire Storm: (re: Zoog Disney) Yesss! Right on! Hmm...another future target for the Joyride, folks? :)

Aaron: What would I turn into if I put on the Eye of Odin? That one's easy--Jack Hammer. :)

traveler: The discrepancies between TGS and Future Tense are probably brought about by Future Tense being a dream created by Puck, who was making things up as he went along (rather sloppily, too ;). I remember Owen being surprised in one of the TGS episodes when something from Puck's dream actually happened....

Batya: Well, the POV thing is something I learned from experience. I had submitted a number of stories which had multiple POVs, sending them to a number of different magazines. Every last one of them was sent back with the same comment--single-POV only. Apparently, the editors had the idea that multiple POV can only be used in novels, and that if you're writing a short story, you have to use only one POV character. It's one of the "rules." A rule which I think is pure, unmitigated bull$h!t. Obviously, multiple POVs work in short stories, as many fanfic authors have already proven here. Thing is, the publishing business has a certain set of rules that they don't like anybody to break or even bend. It goes along with the stuff about manuscripts being double-spaced, with the page numbers beginning on the second page, etc. etc. There's no logical reason that you shouldn't put a page number on the first page, at least none that I can think of, but magazine editors don't like it. It's ludicrous, just like the POV rule, but that's the way the publishing business works. Even so, I've spent ten years following the rules, and it's gotten me absolutely nowhere. So screw those people. Next story I send in will have multiple POVs whether those bastards like it or not. ;)

Oh, and one of the things that makes fanfic "easier" than original fic is that you already have a background setting and characters that have been introduced long ago. You can just dive right into your story with a minimum of "setup" stuff. In original fic, you have to create a whole new world for your characters, and you have to make it believable while still putting in enough character development and plot to make the story "complete"--but you have to do it in 7,500 words or less. Also, if there are any loose ends when your story is over, the editor probably won't accept it. In fanfic, the readers are more willing to give you time to develop whatever plot threads you leave hanging at the end of your first story. As far as a magazine editor is concerned, there may never be a second story, so they want everything wrapped up in a nice, neat little package with a pretty, shiny ribbon on it. These are among the many reasons I'm getting fed up with the entire publishing business....

And I agree completely about the Star Trek novels. A few are pretty good, but a lot of them are no better than a typical romance novel.

Gyre: <PS queem? Am I the only one who makes typos?> Noep. Uh, I mean, nope. heh... :P

Dreams: I hardly ever remember mine. But then, considering what routinely goes through my mind when I'm awake, that may not be a bad thing, after all. :)
Pistoff - [pistoff@outgun.com]
Thursday, August 12, 1999 08:55:44 PM
IP: wire-5.koalas.com

I'm going to try to make this quick since I'm not feeling so hot. I had to go home sick today from school and I missed practice. I've gone to the doctor and she's finally agreed to put me on birth control *sigh* Damn hormones...

Angie & Pistoff> Thanks for apologizing to each other. HUGZ

Robby> Sorry your first day of school started with a bad omen. Just keep up the good spirits :)

Welcome cherry blossom! Hope you feel comfortable in here...

Kit> Thanks for the luck! I need it.

Jackal> Please post to us! We're getting really worried! please please please please...
SOROW
Thursday, August 12, 1999 08:51:06 PM
IP: usr11-dialup169.mix1.irving.cw.net

Theresa> preciously
James Birdsong
Thursday, August 12, 1999 08:01:46 PM
IP: dt049n74.san.rr.com

Dreams> never had one involving Gargoyles, I did have one involving Luke Skywalker, Princess Liea (with the big buns), the Teletubbies, and lost of pizza getting thrown around. It's really way too Freudian so I don't even want to think too hard about it....
Skippy The Klingon - [shakedwn@ultravision.net]
Thursday, August 12, 1999 07:54:33 PM
IP: uv1-59.ultravision.net

little traveler - When you get a page is to big to load message that means the size of the file not that you can make it smaller. There is one file that is around 700k in the archieve and I cant' get it to load for love or money. Just try reload. Otherwise dump your sent mail and discard file to get more space.

To get colors or images just click on the little gray oval and scroll down until you find an image or color that you like. (But not DumlaoX)

James Birdsong everyone dreams. You just may not remember what you were dreaming.

Starsinger
Theresa - [Starsinger@Webtv.net]
Thursday, August 12, 1999 07:30:51 PM
IP: proxy-363.public.rwc.webtv.net

Shameless Plug Alert!

Since it was getting long, and I felt inspired, I have posted Part One of my new fic "Protected Species" at GFW. Go read it if you like, hope you enjoy.

More tomorrow, including answers to all the current topics.
Doug - [frostfire@mail.utexas.edu]
Thursday, August 12, 1999 06:13:43 PM
IP: pool-209-138-162-216.dlls.grid.net

Heheh.. me again, I forgot to post about my Gargoyles dream that I had recently...
I was in NYC on a random rooftop when suddnenly I realized I was Elisa in this dream. This was to my benefit when I realized I was dreaming because I could now control it. Anyway, all of a sudden.. Brooklyn dropped down and explained to me that Goliath was being held hostage and Brook needed my help... Just when I jumped off the rooftop, I spread my wings... *pouts* and that's when I bloody woke up!

"Twidle blane and Twidle brain? If it's all the same I'll play your game!"
Bronx Wyvern - [Bronx4me@aol.com]
Thursday, August 12, 1999 05:36:03 PM
IP: spider-tr071.proxy.aol.com

What would happen if Hiroshime sized nuke were detonated on Avalon, an interesting question indeed. The bomb dropped on Hiroshima had a a yield of about 12.5 kilotons, a rather small bomb by today's standards. The island would not be vaporized, but the detonation would be a significant event. Look on the bright side, since Avalon is separated from the mortal world, no fallout problems for Earth.

PS queem? Am I the only one who makes typos?
Gyre - [wseeley@epix.net]
Thursday, August 12, 1999 05:02:38 PM
IP: fltg3-ppp1.fltg.net

Hello, all...

These topics seem a little old by now (interests in topics seem to fade by the end of the day in this comment room...), but I'd like to still add my two cents.

Brooklyn -- I can easily say that he's my favorite of the gargoyles. His attitude is interesting and complex, and lean, but muscular, bodies are what I've always fallen for... (and while I'm on the subject of lean bodies, does anyone else out there spend minutes drawing a picture in their mind, and admiring it, of Gabriel from Jewel's Lightning Crashes? Mmmmmm....) But, while he's an attractive and intriguing character, I've never obsessed over the gargoyles of GARGOYLES. Personally, I'm more of a Xanatos/Owen/Fox fan ('specially Owen.... I's what ya might consider one of them Oweninte nuns...). But, I'm also a strong believer that every character from the show has their own place within the grand scheme of things. Not one would be nearly as effective or fascinating alone as they are with the rest of the cast to complement and support them.

But, damn.... Xanatos is oooonnne sexy piece of man-flesh, is he not? (I forgot to mention that goatees drive me nuts, too *grin*)

Artemisia - [aptemisia@yahoo.com]
Austin, TX, USA
Thursday, August 12, 1999 04:44:27 PM
IP: dial-49-39.ots.utexas.edu

Bronx Wyvern: nope never had a Gargoyles type dream. I never dream
James Birdsong
Thursday, August 12, 1999 04:34:19 PM
IP: dt049n74.san.rr.com

Yeah bronx , I dreampt that I was goliath and was on patrol .Then all of a sudden I saw a tiny little light , like a star ,but moving.Then it came rushing torward me and I tried to move but it was like I was stuck in the air. and right when it was inches from my face it flew strait down . the little light hit the ground and formed what looked like a black hole . I was sucked into it and the only thing that I could hear was Dean Devlin saying "I am Satan , I will destroy everything that is gargoyles".And then all of his little disney executive minions came out and laughed like Mickey Mouse. And then Satans' wives[Christina Agiulara and Debbie Gibson] came out and started singing. It was terrifiying. Actually I think it's obvious that everything after the part where I got sucked into the hole was all made up,but wouln't that be the most terrifiying nightmare ever?
traveler - [goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Thursday, August 12, 1999 04:20:13 PM
IP: proxy-353.public.rwc.webtv.net

Checking in temporarily...

First, to those of you who suggested various Queen songs for the Joyride page, after I mentioned "We are the Champions": Did you really pay attention to which page on the site I thought of it for? It was the *cast* page, not the RP page. Oh, well, couldn't really find "Champions" anyway, so we'll stick with Roxette for the time being. Maybe I'll place a Star Trek theme there later. ;) Or possibly Ghostbusters... naah.

Bronx: you mentioned a cool Gargoyles dream; I haven't had one yet, but does a nightmare of Army of Darkness count? It was Terrible, with a capital T, and beyond! It was starring *JIM CARREY* as *ACE VENTURA*! **Shudder**

**JOYRIDE**
Warpmind looks up ahead, pondering a solution. A wicked grin slowly spreads across his face.
"Oh, and Wilek, I'll pass on those Borg implants. What I have seen of their stuff, it's nanocircuitry, but this lil'ol thingie is picocircuitry: there's circuitry on molecular level in some places. Well, to deal with this, we'll use Atila, if it's okay."
Reverend Attila looks up at Warpmind questioningly.
"If you just carry these to the guar.... Ohhhh, sheeeeeet. I've lost my cigars."
Warpmind looks backward. A huge explosion illuminates the night sky where the concert once was.
"And it would appear someone found them."
Miriam's voice is dripping with contempt.
"Any other bright ideas?"
Warpmind thinks for a minute.
"Sure, think you could bring up a 17000 terrawatt energy shield from the DeVille to surround both cars?"
"Yes, why?"
"Oh, just something I got from a friend in CIA recently... ever hear of something called Tourettes Syndrome?"
"People who suffer from jerky movements, often accompanied by foul language and screaming?"
"Precisely. Three years ago, the CIA developed a Tourette Grenade, sending out a shockwave inducing Tourette-like symptoms on normal people. The pulse gun version is highly favored for public humiliation. You may activate the energy shield at your convenience. Preferrably after the grenade is thrown."
Warpmind digs into the backpack, finding an odd-looking grenade.
"Ah, here it is. Now... Wilek, can you throw? My aim is near perfect, but I never managed to gain distance... you just pull out the pin and throw it toward the guys over there, then Miriam will activate the shield. Won't you, lovely?"
Miriam eyes Warpmind with a look like a cold wind over tundra.
"Sure."
**TO BE CONTINUED**

Well, gotta go.

**Throws a few axes in DC's general direction, just for kicks.**
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Thursday, August 12, 1999 03:26:15 PM
IP: mp-217-230-245.daxnet.no

hmmm--well see how this combo looks!

JEB and Batya--- Thanks for answering my question, guys! I really appreciate it!

Batya-- you made some good points about characters in fanfics-- I really try to make the characters sound like they did in the show, really try to "hear" there voices as I write. (Listen to the voices in your head)j/k--or sometimes I'll watch an ep with character in it I want to focus on.


Jenna
Thursday, August 12, 1999 03:08:19 PM
IP: unknown-31-157.glm.com

*Bronx comes out of lurking*

Hi everyone, just checking in :)

Question> Was there a time any of you had a really cool Gargoyles Dream? And if so... what was it about?

"Twidle blane and Twidle brain? If it's all the same I'll play your game!"
Bronx Wyvern - [Bronx4me@aol.com]
Thursday, August 12, 1999 02:48:30 PM
IP: spider-wl083.proxy.aol.com

Yeah, I definitely need to come back here more often. :)

Pistoff> Keep to one POV throughout a whole story? Why? (I mean, as long as you make it clear when you're switching POVs and all....)
I don't really consider the "rules" for fanfic writing to be looser than those for original fic. If anything, they're tighter; in addition to telling a good story, you have to keep the characters and the world consistent with their portrayal in canon.
Okay, I'm aware not everybody does this. But it's always seemed to me that if you're not going to write stuff that feels like canon, you might as well be writing original fiction. I've read some stuff on the 'fic archive that's truly exquisite storytelling, but it just doesn't feel like Gargoyles to me. Same problem with Star Trek novels; some of them are terrific fiction, but they're just not Trek. (And of course, some of them are just really, really bad. Poor ideas, poor characterization, and almost no command of language at all. To think that some writers get _paid_ to churn out those things! It's enough to make a fanfic writer cry.)

Wilek> Sane? Me? Naaaaah. :P

Jenniren> You wrote: "Titania wasn't able to help Elisa directly because of Oberon's law. She did help Elisa by influencing Demona..." Hmm. Interesting. What makes you think that Demona's decision was influenced by Titania? :)

Jenna> "Children of Stone, Daughter of Eve" was written by my all-time favorite cohort, Constance Cochran.

Speaking of which -- the story "Tomorrow And Tomorrow" (I can't _believe_ it got into the top five! Wow!) was actually the first story I did that _wasn't_ co-written by Constance. That one's just mine. :) (And it got into the top five! Wow! ... But why isn't there anything by Merlin Missy in that category?)

Kitania> Archetype posts! Cheesh, I forgot all about those... Um, I was up to "Shadow", right?

traveler> You wrote "As most of you know , future tense is turning out to be a prophecy instead of a dream." Well, not exactly. The major event in Future Tense, Goliath's failing to return from the Avalon tour until decades later, wound up never happening. Likewise Broadway getting blinded in the battle with Servarius and the Ultra-Pack, and so forth. Certain elements of the Future Tense visions have been happening, true, but other elements have been flatly contradicted by events.
So I wouldn't worry about Brooklyn and Sata. :)

Filk demon of the day: "One More Night In Hollywood" as a BtVS filk -- "One More Night In Sunnydale". (Why and O why do I come up with these things?)

G'night, rookery sibs. You know I love you.

Batya the Toon
Thursday, August 12, 1999 02:41:41 PM
IP: 67.new-york-40-45rs.ny.dial-access.att.net

FireStorm>ink-stamps that you color. :)
Mary Flanders
Thursday, August 12, 1999 02:16:24 PM
IP: ramp-1-12.ucdavis.edu

Completely pointless post, but no way was Shaggy a speed freak. He was way too mellow. Shaggy, and Scooby, were both stoners. That's why they rode around in that trippy van, and had the munchies all the time.

Later.


Aaron - [JCarnage@Yahoo.com]
San Antonio, TX, USA
Thursday, August 12, 1999 01:48:31 PM
IP: ppp-33.tnt-1.sat.smartworld.net

Flame war> guys and gals lets take a break and a deep breath and let this one be blamed on a misunderstanding. It happens and things get taken the wrong way. Heck me and Aris Katsaris had a misunderstanding that almost turned into a flame war because I overreacted to something he said and he misunderstood something I said hell difference parts of America talk differently and one phrase may mean something in one area and something totally different in another and we have multiple countries here. I thought she was only being sarcastic; me and my friends cut up and same stuff like that to each other too (yea she forgot the smiley face, but I have heard the phrase “have you been drinking” to mean “what are you talking about”. oh btw Angie did you steal part of that line about being the Goliath defender form sailor moon or am I just crazy). Lets take it easy we are all friends here Ok? And speaking of friends I too worry about Jackyl’s silence so it looks like we got more to worry about then us bickering ( I blame the heat it just to hot) so come on if you are lurking drop a hi

Scooby Doo> He dose share the spot light, and dose get some credit, but that speed freak shaggy keeps stealing the majority of it. Look what those kids do to him. look a monster send the dog as bait to capture it. Poor guy, but those Scooby Snacks sure are tasty though so at least he eats well.

And Now to stop another flame war before it starts.

Traveler>you were a little heavy handed with Paul weren’t you? yea it was a parody and we should be able to laugh at ourselves but look the above flame war started by people defending characters in gargoyles. Your post just; well it reminds me of a post by a certain doctor not to long ago. What if I posted a parody of Gargoyles called Stoners making fun of the show. I would bet good money I would piss people off. You admitted that at leas part of the reason you wrote it was to piss him off and well that is kind of wrong and like I said reminds me of the actions of the psyche test. Yea I get tired of hearing about the game, and well I thought the game was only so so, but hey that’s my opinion and yes you are entitled to yours just as Paul is entitled to his, but lets not make fun of each other’s likes and dislikes. The real world dose that to us enough as it is. We don’t need to be turning on each other too.

Ironwolf
Thursday, August 12, 1999 01:06:25 PM
IP: host-209-214-40-117.cha.bellsouth.net

Can someone help me . I was reading seeds of change when it said that that page was too big to be shown completly. is there someway that I canreduce the size to read the rest?
Also there has been something that has been bothering me about the relationship between the t.v. show in the fanfic series. As most of you know , future tense is turning out to be a prophecy instead of a dream . But is it possible for it to be flawed. In Goliaths' dream Brooklyn and Demona were mates. This is the part that puzzles me because if it's supposed to come true [the prophecy] then what happends to Sata? Have the fanfic writers not acknowledged this? Or is it because Goliath and Eliza came back that a few detailes . And maybe when the war comes he won't be so cold . And does this mean that he will be scrawny when the war comes [sorry I shouldn't have said that].
And I have one more thing to say. It seemes to me that in a small way the pheonix gate was plotting against them when it took Brooklyn. If Brooklyn didn't find sata and Broadway didn't mate Angela , then lex wouldn't have been so lonly as to befriend someone he didn't know much about [like the pack] , and he wouldn't have been turned into that half gargoyle half cyborg in the main fanfic series. It seemed to me like it was[or the female voices] were getting some small revenge for Goliath using it without a mind. They were making the prophecy come true by making lex lonely. And for you that think think That I'm just rambling nonsense your probaly right . If anyone understands what I am saying , thank you for reading.
And can anyone tell me how you guys get the pictures?
traveler - [Goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Thursday, August 12, 1999 12:26:27 PM
IP: proxy-523.public.rwc.webtv.net

Warpmind: Okay, 's just an odd offer, I had no idea. As far as Broadway goes, sadly my Broadway *is* a version mated to Angela. Fact is, the only non-Angela mate of Braodway I know of is Elektra.
Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Thursday, August 12, 1999 12:02:35 PM
IP: modem28.i-is.com

Coyote: Thanks for the offer, but if I can't get Aiden, there is not much point, as I need her specific personality as a plot element. Y'know "Oh, no, what have I done NOW?" except that it's not her fault. If you know what I mean. Of course, if you have a mate for Broadway there, who is not Angela, I'd be interested...

Later.
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Thursday, August 12, 1999 11:51:34 AM
IP: ti24a03-0014.dialup.online.no

Shoulda put this one up with the earlier one ...

Warpmind: You mentioned Aiden there ... if Christine doesn't let you use her, do ya need a backup? Because I'd be more than happy to let ya use Pontiac. (click on name link for the character info I have on her and the rest of Clan Detroit)
Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Thursday, August 12, 1999 11:40:38 AM
IP: modem28.i-is.com

Okay, okay, you got me. I can't spell to save my soul. Forgive me.

Later.


Aaron - [JCarnage@Yahoo.com]
San Antonio, TX, USA
Thursday, August 12, 1999 11:11:13 AM
IP: ppp-33.tnt-1.sat.smartworld.net

**Walks in and throws a banana at Xanathar**
That joke WAS that bad, dude.

Aaron: Good thing I can... barrow? Uh, I think it's "borrow" Sata, chum. Anyway, I think I might (and not forgetting those oh-so-ever-improtant credits-where-credits-are-due to the marbelously rocking (pun intended) TGS staff.

Now, I'm still looking for someone who wrote in a mate for Broadway... any help accepted in deepest gratitude. **Looks around with pleading eyes**

Later, guys, gotta open them library doors, now that the shift begins.
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Thursday, August 12, 1999 10:54:56 AM
IP: ti24a03-0014.dialup.online.no

Lex in can't hardly wait . Whenever I think of a gargoyle in another flick I get this image of goliath as James Bond with eliza an demona in skimpy little bond girl dresses on either side of him. Or broadway in an Angus type film with angela as Melissa La fever , lex as troy , hudson as his grandfather, and Brooklyn as the star quarterback. If any of you have ever seen angus you know what I'm talking about.
traveler - [Goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Thursday, August 12, 1999 10:28:59 AM
IP: proxy-523.public.rwc.webtv.net

Aaron walks in, turns DC to bite-sized chunks with a chainsaw, and tosses the pieces to his pet jackals.

Robby> The SAAS meetings are the fourth weekend of every month. As soon as I get better directions to the new meeting place, I'm e-mail 'em to you. As to a lesson from Those Who Hunt Elves.... Um, the guys with the ego get elven warrior babes? I'm not sure that was what you were going for.

Wilek> Is there, perchance a similar spell for other animals, like lawyers?

Warpmind>You could barrow Sata. If not, Coyote suggested two of Brooklyn's other mates. As for other mates of Broadway, I'm stumped.

Firestorm>Yes! Another AOD fan. I just watched it last night, and I couldn't help but think "good movie, just needs some gargoyles" Of course, no battle scene involving a castle seems complete anymore without a thunderous rendition of the gargoyles theme, and the sound of swooping wings. Aaron shudders as he is possessed by a three headed Creativity Demon carrying the Pheonix gate, a chainsaw, and a model of Castle Wyvern.

We've tried casting AOD with the gargs, but I'm not sure we ever finished. Any ideas people?

Offsubject, has anyone here seen Can't Hardly Wait? That'd be another fun one to cast with the gargs. I can just see Lex getting tanked and kareoking Guns and Roses' "Paradise City"

And speaking of Seth Green, you know who'd make a really cute couple? Scott Evil and Harley Quinn. They've both got that smarter then their bosses, "Why don't you just shoot him?" thing goin' on.

Random survey: I saw this last month in the other room, (See Robby we do visit) but it didn't get much response. What do you think you would turn into if you put on the Eye of Odin? I'd probably turn into one of my fic characters, or maybe an empty trenchcoat filled with a swirling blackness, and a pair of red eyes.

Wish JackaL would post.

Later.


Aaron - [JCarnage@Yahoo.com]
San Antonio, TX, USA
Thursday, August 12, 1999 10:13:26 AM
IP: ppp-89.tnt-1.sat.smartworld.net

Just a quick clarification post this morning ...

Wilek, re: Okali's status: Normally she isn't a vampire, but specifically for WCC she asked to be one. It's really hard to explain, but ... recall that during recruitment I asked folks to pick sides in the fight. When it came to Okali and Tara ... they chose to be opposed to *both* sides. So they may show up later with Okali drinking from Rokkans, ya never know. ;)
Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Thursday, August 12, 1999 09:55:20 AM
IP: modem28.i-is.com

Gyre- Even better quiston: What would happen if it went off on Avalon?
James Birdsong
Thursday, August 12, 1999 09:43:08 AM
IP: dt049n74.san.rr.com

After watching 'The long kiss goodnight" traveler comes into his room , humming bjorks' "hunter". He stares at the computer screen when he realizes that he made a mistake. he quickly logs in and goes to his favorite site and hopefully corrects by telling everyone that when he said the "cage" and "metamorphosis" as being the episodes in which Brooklyn tries to be Maggies' friend. He telles everyone that it was "metamorphosis" and "kingdom". He makes a sigh of relief. I'm writting this before reading other peoples' comments. I know at least one of you caught my mistake.Getting out of this room after reading all of the comments now , I should be back soon.
traveler - [goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Thursday, August 12, 1999 09:20:34 AM
IP: proxy-313.public.rwc.webtv.net

Hi all!!

To all of you who are returning to school may I offer my sincere condolences.

SOROW:I wish Jackal would post and tell us he's alright, cause I'm having doubts that he's "just peachy".>>So do I,I'm starting to get a little worried myself.

Mary Flanders:Gargoyles stamps!*Drools*Must...Find...Stamps!:)

Robby:(Reads Wizard of OZ spiolers)*ROTFLMAO*and thank you for letting us know about Deuce oh and thankyou for putting up the CR rules as well.

Lexy:Welcome back!

cherry blossom:Welcome to the Nuthouse.:)

Warpmind:Aw, man, here comes the bloody humans... again.>>tell them to go have a shower and wash all the blood off themselves:)*Xanathar Ducks rotten fruit thrown in his direction*Hey the joke wasn't that bad!:)

C'yas later!!
Xanathar
Melbourne, victoria, Australia
Thursday, August 12, 1999 07:57:14 AM
IP: 203.29.192.74

Patrick Toman: So you reckon me borrowing Sata is ok? *wipes off forehead** Oh, good. I was afraid I'd have to search through a gazillion series for a mate for Brooklyn, too. Of course, now I still gotta somehow "get to know" a mate for Broadway. She's out there... somewhere...

Um, pardon the cliché-ish comment there.

Still busy at the library, but I think I might get a break long enough to look for David G. Maybe.

Later, everyone.
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Thursday, August 12, 1999 07:02:06 AM
IP: ti24a01-0035.dialup.online.no

TGS encourages the writing of fanfic based off the TGS universe. We ask only that you acknowledge TGS in the credits / headers / disclaimers just as you would Disney and Buena Vista Television for the original show. If you wish to quote directly from a TGS episode, since you would be directly inserting someone else's work into your story, my personal feeling is that the polite way to do it is to ask the story author and get permission to use the clip.
Patrick Toman
Thursday, August 12, 1999 06:16:55 AM
IP: abd16565.ipt.aol.com

Well, I'm at the library, "working" again, as usual. You gotta love them summer jobs, eh?

Okay, no response from Christine yet on whether or not it's okay for me to borrow Aiden... but that's probably gonna come soon. And Spike refused *sob, sniffle* to let me borrow Avery. Aw, heck, she had a good reason, no hard feelings... only now I gotta find external mates for BOTH Broadway AND Brooklyn... maybe Sata, if that's okay with the honorable TGS staff (I gotta pick some that I have studied through existing literature). Well, off to search and beg for permission, guys, just a few remarks first:

Wilek: the term "Murphology" isn't mine. Indeed, it's an actual science, the study of WHY Myrphy's law applies. And guess what? They found out that it does apply to all situations, save the situations where one intends to prove its existence. Ouuurgh...

Angie: Hey, you know something? When you managed to tick off Pistoff, maybe you should have finished with something like "why aren't you sharing with the rest of us"? Just a thought, not to be taken seriously.

Aw, man, here comes the bloody humans... again.

Later.
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Thursday, August 12, 1999 05:44:05 AM
IP: ti24a03-0012.dialup.online.no

CRAP! Sorry about that. BIG picture mistake! I was looking to see if there was a picture named DumlaoX AND Deuce, and I forgot to change it back.
Fire Storm (Sorry about the mistake below. HONEST!)
Thursday, August 12, 1999 05:05:31 AM
IP: 216.90.45.179

TGS Copyright information: Ok, I have a question: What is the rules and regulation for using TGS material in a fan-fic? I understand about the use of characters, but for one example, I have written a long (100 page) fan-fic with the basis in a TGS episode. Now, I plan on using (But, for legal reasons, I may change this (READ: Rewrite the text in question) at the request of TGS), SOME of the text written for the story. SOME I left the way it was, but for the most part, I changed what happened. I can give the exact example if TGS requests it. Would this be a problem? The text in question is at MOST 4 pages (Taken from the near the end of the story).

Now, if I were to include that the story was written for TGS, include a link to both the TGS main site AND the link to the story, PLUS giving credit to the people mentioned in the by-line, would this be ok?

Mr. Disconnect: Did this character effectively replace the CR Lawyer for mindless destruction, or is the CR Lawyer still cannon fodder?

School: My first day is August 26! YEAH!
(HEY! For me, this is GREAT! For the first time in three years, I am going to college!)

Avalon Mists:
<Fire Storm takes a quick look at the stories he has written lately, but hasn't posted yet.>
Hmm... G or PG? Hmm... Lets see... <<SPOILER CENSORED BLEEP>>, sex, descriptive violence... HEY! HERE'S ONE! Hmmm...
Nope. Sorry. My mistake. ;)
Besides... I am happy with one up there.
Now it is my turn to step down to let the less fortunate have a chance... (to get squashed by me!)

Winners of the poll: I may not have heard about it until it was over, but congratulations to all. From what I read of your stories, you all deserved it!

The 13th Warrior: GOTTA see that one!

Demona Testosterone Legion: Hmm... Na... ELISA as a gargoyle. YOW! But as far a Demona goes, I like her MUCH better than I like Angela as portrayed by the show and TGS.
Christine's version of her, on the other hand, is at least more realistic, less 'perfect'.

Brooklyn: Hey, I have to admit he is pretty cool, but if you look at who people like, it isn't really wierder. Some women LOVE Duncan McLeod (Oberon knows why), some men like Brittany Spears (Mainly because she is a slut. Sorry Jackal, but she is).
Hell, *I* like women with VERY short hair.
(More examples: Watch Jenny Jones. There is NO accounting for taste when it comes to love.)

Brooklyn Question: As above, down below? Your comments, please.

The Omen: Ok, I saw the first one, and it was pretty good. Is it really worth it to see all the sequels?

Army of Darkness: Speaking of sequels...
So BAD I loved it!

AAron: Speaking of which...
Todd> Wait a minute. Goliath fights an army of zombies in the Devlin script? Aaron conjures a mental image of Goliath, missing
his right hand, brandishing a shotgun.
"Alright you primative screwheads! This is my boomstick!"
You forgot a few:
"Let's Rock."
"Shake it, baby!" (To Elisa)
"Groovy." (When GOliath first wakes up in NY)

Zoog Disney: Just GOTTA say this:
"Lock and Load"
GET RID OF IT! Who needs music video's on Disney? I mean, I paid for Disney NOT for music videos (Thats what MTV2 is for), but for the animation.

Devlin (Devil's) Script: Oberon help us, if that is more than a rumor, I doubt that even most HARDCORE fans would see that movie!

GB, Atilla: Well, I personally hate it when the temperature inside seems colder than outside in the winter and hotter than outside in the summer. (Heater broke one winter. The teacher that complained about sweaters at times excused students to get thier coats.)

Swearing on a bible: Ever seen Fried Green Tomatos?

Mary Flanders: Gargoyles stamps? As in sticker-stamps or ink-pad stamps?


<PRAISE//GIVER OF WILL>
Fire Storm - [Night-Flame@usa.net]
Thursday, August 12, 1999 05:04:04 AM
IP: 216.90.45.179

**RP!**

[In the Avatar Of Ganon's control room...an officer at one of the control boards reports something odd on the sensors..."Sir, something just came out of hyperspace." Khesaat: "What is it? Has it identified itself?" "I...I can't even detect it; all our sensors are showing is that a hyperspace exit occurred. That ship must have impressive stealth shielding--someone just requested permission to dock." Khesaat: "Have they identified themselves?" "No, but they don't seem hostile either. Do you think we should inform the Ravens?" Khesaat: "No need to alarm them while they're on break. But send a full security detail down to the hangar bay, then let our mysterious visitor in. By the way, who did we appoint as the permanent security chief, to replace Dark Eternal?" "Um...Lieutenant Jespe, sir." Khesaat: "Good, good. Have him go with the others; I'll meet them down there." With that, he boards a turbolift and takes it to one of the docking bays...]

**PAUSE RP!**

Mandolin> Ack. Sorry to hear about your troubles with the IRS. When I take over the world, the government will acquire its money by auctioning off the possessions of those who are killed by my virus that kills everyone below a certain IQ. >:) <<at 11:30 everyone is going out to Flying Point Park for a pizza party to thank me and the other two summer hires here for what we've done.>> Wow. Not every job blesses you with co-workers like that. :)

Jenna> <<I hate to say it guys, but I do notice a awful lot of quarreling in here-- or is it just me?>> I noticed! Has there been a full moon recently? It does this kind of thing.

Heather> ACK. My condolences; I've heard freshman year is the worst. <hugZ>

Ironwolf> Hm...I had no idea doggies got the short end of the proverbial stick so often...the closest thing I have to a dog in my fics is a wolf mutate...hm...maybe the Annwn clan needs a doggoyle or two...

Aaron> <<I can now be clothed from head to foot in the skin of a dead cow.>> You know, I think that's part of a spell that causes cows to think you're one of their own...cuts down on stampedes, but watch out during mating season...

Warpmind> <<For the record, I plan neither violence nor...well, more "adult content" stuff to appear in the fic>> Shame, that; nothing spices up a Morganesque scene like the sudden appearance of a serial killer. [Forfexx: "You rang? <hehehe>"] >8)

Pistoff> <<It would be nice to see him burst out laughing at least once, after seeing/hear/reading something amusing>> Perhaps he doesn't get our humor. He *is* from the 10th century, however well he may have acclimated to ours. Humor was different back then. (If it existed at all...) <<Picture him riding a roller coaster next to Elisa, looking extremely uncomfortable while she is whooping and having a good ol' time....>> Heh...I can just see him tearing off their restraints, grabbing her, and gliding off, muttering something about 'getting us both killed'. >;)

Theresa> <<Who walked out on her mom and step-dad last night because they kept ragging little sister who was trying to be nice and fix dinner. And whose mother insulted her one time too many in the course of the 'discussion'.>> ACK. I'm sorry to hear about that; unpleasant behavior from relatives can be so hard to deal with. <hugZ> <<You know people, the only reason I think we're all acting like idiots is either the eclipse or we've been working with the public too long.>> Hm...this could explain a lot....

Traveler> <<Why at your local black market Khaos Inc. store of course, in the video game section, right next to Soylent Green: The Eternal Spleen Saga: Complete.>:))>> I take it that this is the same place where I can get Final Flatulence 7 and Snapplevania: Symphony Of The Afternoon? <G>

SOROW> <<I wish Jackal would post and tell us he's alright, cause I'm having doubts that he's "just peachy".>> You too? I'm getting worried. He doesn't post *too* frequently, but he's not usually gone *this* long...

Gyre> <<Now imagine he's showing his *queem* what he build, and her reaction when she realizes exactly what was constructed>> Ooh, this could be interesting...er, what's a queem? ;D

**WCC SPOILERS**

I wasn't aware that Okali was a *vampire*. O_o Absolutely fabulous, as I've come to expect. :) (I can't wait to see what you've got in mind for Cocytus. >:) )

**END**

Coyote> <<Murphaic? I've got to remember that one ...>> Heh...although it's not quite as good as Warpmind's 'Murphology'. ;)

Robby> Masterful work defusing the various debates. :) <<I got an e-mail from Deuce last nightday pointing me towards a pokemon website with info on the MewTwo movie. So he's reading the room well enough to know I was looking for info on this. He's still around, he's just not ready to post yet.>> I'm very glad he's still here, even though he's not posting just yet. :) Hey, what's Night Day? Sounds like a pretty kewl holiday. :) Kind of reminiscent of the Festival Of Rowdain, actually...

Lexy> Glad you got to meet Kaioto. Now maybe he'll come back and give an equally detailed report. ^_^ <<Worried because I am one of those paranoid ppl that freak out about airplanes.>> You too? I will NEVER board a commercial aircraft. Those things are held together with chicken wire and Gungan tongue mucus. Remind me to inflict the Japan Incident upon y'all someday. <shudder>

**RESUME RP!**

[Khesaat arrives in the docking bay in which the visitor has been instructed to land. He is surprised to see Dark Eternal here as well. Khesaat: "Come to welcome our guest?" DE: "Not quite." The squad then sees the visitor's craft approach the hangar bay. To their great surprise, it is a very antiquated Naboo N-1 fighter, repainted from its outlandish stock yellow-and-silver paint job to a more subdued black-and-burgundy. A deep voice at the head of the team observes, "Dat must have been one impressive salvage job; most N-1s aren't in good enough repair to even get off de ground." Khesaat: "I take it you're a classic fighter enthusiast, Jespe?" Jespe: "Yup. I had dis *sweet* vintage R-41 I was restoring back at home; I had to put it on hold when I joined de officer exchange program." Khesaat: "Remind me to introduce you to Wilek's friend Coyote when all this is over..." The time for idle chatter abruptly ends as the fighter touches down in the hangar bay, and the security team snaps to attention as its unknown pilot emerges from his craft...]

**END RP!**
Wilek Nereus
Thursday, August 12, 1999 03:56:39 AM
IP: tnt-1-11-56k.portsmouth.zoomnet.net

Mary: Gargoyles stamps?? Ohh, man! **starts scrounging up spare change...**

Robby: Marvelous. First day of school and the buses are 3 hours late? That's a perfect way to start things off, isn't it? :) My condolences. And about me being brave...well, it could be that, or I could just be completely bug$h!t insane. Or maybe just desperate for money in an economy that sucks like a Dirt Devil. Basically, when I first started my job, I just went out and did it because I *had* to. After a while I just ran out of things to be afraid of. My job is great for desensitizing you to things like annoying customers and fear of death. ;) Oh, and I hadn't thought about Goliath's weight. hehe Well, there are a lot of things Elisa could do to try to loosen him up a little. Maybe go bowling with him or something. Just picture Goliath hurling the ball, then pumping his fist and bellowing, "Slammarino!!"

Owen being stiff: Well, I do remember that time in City of Stone when he showed a bit of emotion--when he was about to talk into the phone and noticed that the cord was severed, his eyes popped out a little...

TGS staff: That many people? Whoa...

Lexy: Welcom back! Good...god! You may be giving Traveler some competition on post-length. ;)

Angie: Okay, it's cool. I'm sorry, too. Let's just get on with our lives.
Pistoff - [pistoff@outgun.com]
Thursday, August 12, 1999 02:04:10 AM
IP: 207.48.109.31

****BEGIN SHORT RP!!!****
"Geez, I'll never understand why people like these vidoe games so muc..." Suddenly Jaden's character is killed while he's in mid-thought. Furiously Jaden puts in another quarter. "YOU WILL DIE FOR THAT!!!!" He screams at the machine and an unusual batter starts.
****END RP!!!****

Lexy-You freak out about planes? Why? I think it's fun to be so high up in the sky...maybe add a little turbulence to keep things from getting boring.

Robby- I have the strange feeling that you want us to visit some place, but I can't figure out where. Hee Hee Hee.

I'll post more later.
See ya later!
Jaden - [jaden12@hotmail.com]
Los Alamos, CA
Thursday, August 12, 1999 02:03:59 AM
IP: pm0-41.vpop1.avtel.net

I'm sorry everyone I didn't mean to start anything. Pistoff, I am SORRY. Okay? As for that "Have you been drinking? Been sippin' back on Granpa's old cough medicine?" thing, it wasn't meant to be taken literally. It was just a paraphrase for "What have you been sippin' off of?", which is something that me and my friends and my peers at school use. No one takes(took)it literally 'cause they knew I wasn't literally suggesting that they were DRINKING.(obviously, you didn't) It's supposed to mean "WHAT? What in the heck are you TALKING about?!" Well, I guess I'll have to explain what I mean when say certain things. Geez.
Thanks, Aris, for trying to come to my defense. I didn't really think he was insulting me or anything in that post about calling people ugly would make me feel better about myself. I was insulted when he threatened to gnaw my skull or something like that. I AM SORRY EVERYONE. Sorry, sorry sorry, sorry, sorry, infinite sorries. JUST FORGET THIS WHOLE THING STARTED. OKAY, PLEASE? LET'S JUST PUT IT BEHIND US.
Angie - [Goliathgirl@yahoo.com]
USAThursday, August 12, 1999 12:38:33 AM
IP: dial80.b2.tnt4.wa.freei.net

Hi all!
I don't think I 've ever written in here before, but I'm going to now! Just in case you guys don't know, I'm Vicki (she actually spelled it right!). Kai is a sweetie just in case anybody was wondering. From what I heard about Kai and my mom's talk, they covered everything *l*. I'm gonna go to bed now! bye!
cherry blossom - [Chryblsm15@aol.com]
WI, US of A
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 11:41:19 PM
IP: 98a7de74.ipt.aol.com

Okay, did a bit of searching and found what I was looking for. I've made one or two minor updates, but otherwise, these are the same rules from November as I pretty much belive Dumlao had a good idea of proper rules when he made them. Read and follow these rules newbies, and oldies, refresh your memories.

-Everything is welcome here to be posted except pornography, pornographic links, useless spam, viruses, and flames to another person (which would start huge flame wars). Breaking this important law the first time warrants a warning from me. A second time this law is broken by the same person, I will give a severe warning, announcing to the room that the law breaker is in danger of being banned unless they appologize. The third strike, and a person is banned. The unbanning of said person can only be done directly by me and it's gonna take a lot for that happen. But like Dumlao, it takes a lot to tick me off in the first place, let alone merit banning.

-Role Playing (RP) or any variation therof is allowed in here without only a couple restrictions. The RPing MUST be accompanied with text about something else NOT related to RP. Preferably, at least half of a post should be topic related, and no more than half should be RP, but there is quite a bit of leniancy in this as I see fit. The other restriction is that it does not involve gratuitous descriptions of sex (i.e.- you can have Demona shoot someone's head and play strip poker but you can't have her run around in the nude for no apparent reason.)

-Anytime RPing is done, it must be accompanied by a header and an ending indicating that RPing is being done. This header and ending is to be done in all caps, accompanies by asteriks, and double spaced.

-Anytime spoilers for ANYTHING, be it movie, comic, TGS or fanfic, it must also be accompanied by heading and ending warnings done in all caps and accompanied by asteriks. Exceptions will apply with age and total group familiarity.

-All comment room pictures can be used by anyone posting except one pic: DumlaoX. That is the CR Administrator's personal pic and used only when the CR Adminstrator posts. However, chivalrous responses are expected to anyone who claims a picture as theirs, as some people do tend to have a personal claim to a pic. This has not been a problem as of yet, but I'm insuring against future cases.

-For the most part, this is a PG room. This means no cussing or overly zealous sexual content. The room is allowed to stretch into PG-13 standards when appropriate and handled in a mature fashion. If you feel the need to express anything with more mature content than that, there IS an adults only comment room.

-Final rule: ENJOY! These rules are just meant to keep order. Usually no one here intentionally breaks them or goes too far, but there have been a few situations in the past. This is mostly just to give an official word on things that have been questioned around here.
Robby the CR Administrator
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 11:25:44 PM
IP: spider-tp074.proxy.aol.com

Well, Id first like to start out by thanking everyones kind words to me and Kaioto. Thank you. Your support and comments are welcomed and appreciated:)

Well first Ill explain what went on since last week wensday..

Wensday- I woke up half worried out of my mind and half excited. Worried because I am one of those paranoid ppl that freak out about airplanes. Neither Kai or me like them at all. So the worry of him leaving this earth befor we were able to meet nawed on me all day. I guess..id just feel awful guilty as well. Excited because I was finally going to meet the person I loved.
That day a lot of things went wrong..Murphy's law i guess (sp?) I woke up to find the car in the shop for the fourth time in one month and my mom refusing to barrow my friends car. She felt it was rude and that with her luck it would explode. Even though..the car was insured and my friend was the one who suggested it several times. Well, we went to the shop to pick it up and surprisingly it was fixed..or..so they said. We didnt trust it one lil bit so we drove it around town to make sure. It kept making a weird screaching sound..but nothing exploded so my mom felt safe enough to drive to Milwaukee and back to get Kaioto. I was not so convinced So we decided to tell him when he called so that if he ended up stranded in a place he'd never been before ..hed know why. That ofcourse made him uneasy. I felt bad telling him that just befor he had to get onto a plane no less..but not telling him could have been a bigger mistake. We said goodbye and mentioned seeing eachother later..for real this time. Then my mother and I drove to a department store in town since there was an outfit there i had put on lay-away to wear specifically for meeting Kaioto. WELL..the ladies looked and looked..then came back and admitted they had lost my stuff. So I had to rush to check if what I picked out was still in stock and in my size. It turned out there was only ONE shirt left and it was my size..and I was able to find the shorts as well. It took up a lot more time then planned since I had to try on the other things I had put on hold, the things I wasnt wareing but still buying. Im an odd size.
We went back home again so I could change and then we were off. I dont really remember what I was thinking on the drive there..mostly it was, "Please dont stall, Please dont stall, Please dont stall!". Thank God it didnt. When we arrived there at the airport then I began to feel the butterflys in my tummy. The sounds of the planes taking off and landing and seeing Ppl reuniting and hugging made the expirence more real. We checked the screens for the flight status and it turned out that his flight had been delayed from 8:45pm to 9:32pm. So there we were..mor then an hour early. My mom went into a book store and I went to wait faithfully at the Gate.
Well, an hour went by pretty darn fast as I stood there and squinted trying to scan the outside darkness and ignore the indoor reflections that kept getting in the way. finally, the guys that lead the plane into the correct dock with those lil lighted sticks..they came out and began to wave them around. I looked and looked but the plane wasnt to be seen. It took quite a while to finally get the plane into veiw. I took my last deep breaths and then stook stiff as a board watching the ppl unload. I was to the side. I did this so I would see him before he saw me. I examined every person off that plane..doing mentle checks quickly. "nope..femal..nope child..nope black hair..nope wrong build." Finally..I found the match. I knew it was him the sec I saw him. I stood, still frozen and waited for him to notice me. But..to my surprise..instead of walking out of the line of ppl and then looking around for me..he kept walking..kept walking right out and down the hall and twords the stairs. Well, I wasnt quite sure what in the world he thought he was doing..he had never even been there befor *shrugs* Well, I walked out further so he would be able to mabey get a better veiw and see me. That didnt work either. I guess I just figured Id let him go..see how far hed go and see if I had to fallow him and give a swift kick on the rear to get his attention. *shrugs* be fun anyway.
As he was walking away, he turned around to take a look behind him. ( he says its cuz he felt like he missed something) He didnt seem to see whatever he was looking for, he had turned to look while still walking, continuing to walk, he turned back and as he was doing so he gaze met mine. He paused for a sec scanning me, then gave me a friendly point and began walking twords me. As he approached me I asked him, "Where did you think U were going??." He told me something about finding his lugage and how he didnt know Id be allowed right at the gate. To which I responded, "Without me?" and "ofcourse they let ppl here..all places do.." Well anyway, we were both pretty paralized and walked side by side but stifly. He rambled a bit, I assumed he was just nervous, and I found it cute. I just held my hands in a tight grip to my frount and spoke little. We walked down to get my mother and after they shoke hands we went to retrive his luggage. Then we went outside to the car. We had parked in the upstairs garage and had found a perfect spot RIGHT out in frount of the doors so we just walked right out and into the car. Kaioto sat on the left of me and we held hands together in the backseat as he made observations of the highway, skylines, roadside stores and decor, and answered my mothers polight inqueries of how his flight went and so on.
When we got into town we went directly to the Food store (Pick N' Save) and shopped since we hadnt for a long time. Kaioto was polight and fetched my mother a shopping cart since they werent any indoors. Then my mom went on ahead and I shopped with him. By then, I felt very used to him..it was like shopping with any of my other friends. I was glad to see us getting along right off like that. We picked up some items and Kaioto was forced to purchase 4 bottles of grap Fruitopia. My mom wanted him to have them..I guess two just wasnt enough *g*
Kai finally appeased her, we went to the check out and then went off to his hotle to check in and drop off his luggage..*pauses to sigh deeply..* Wow..it seems like this was yesterday..*continues* Kaioto came back to my house for a couple of hours. He got to see our place and cats. I believe he went on the comp to check in with ppl and found it near barron. We settled down and found we were able to hug and cuddle without a problem. I guess we just went together really well. We drove him to the hotle and said goodbye.

Thrusday-
The next morning I woke up and had a hard time excepting it was real. It just felt like a dream *shrugs* The phone rang and it was my friend asking how it went..after I spoke with her my other friend called for the same reason. After I got off with them I called Kaioto. My mom came in my room and told me to give him the option of ditching the hotle and staying with us. But he had already set everything up and didnt want to change everything so fast, which i thought was wise. My mom said that she was going to use the the bathroom so I assumed it would be a while and told Kai Id meet him in an hour. It turned out that using the bathroom consisted of taking a comb out of the cabinet..go fig. Well, I got ready and went on over to the hotle around 12am. After talking for a while of what and where's we decided to go across the street to Perkins for brunch. I felt bad since I cant eat a lot in the morning or I get sick. While I ordered a cup of soup, Kaioto chowed down on a stack of pancakes, bacon, two eggs and a pile of hash browns. *giggles* poor guy felt silly eating all that while I ate my soup. Well, we left and headed down town. We went to Mcdonalds first so I could get my check..but It was way too crowed so I had to give up and we kept walking. Our first stop was at the comic shop..closed, then we went to my friend Vicki's house to wait for her to return home from work so we could walk with her to Maris's house. *snickers* YES Yes I admit it..I dragged the poor guy to all my girlfriends and their moms *grins* Hey, they wanted to check him out, I wanted to show him off..it worked right? Anyway, Vicki didnt come home for 3 or more hours..but..her mother was home and she wanted to talk to Kai. *LOL* can you imagine? A three hour interrogation?? The poor guy held his own very well though. She was very impressed with him. Well, Vicki came home and we walked to Marisa's home with her two lil sisters both under the age of 5. We stayed for a while and played video games. Kai beat Marisa's brother Mark (19) in some battle game..and after the second round of Smash Brothers I just watched. One round was perticularly amusing because it was Marisa, Kaioto, Linda, and Vicki's little sisters battling, and the 4 year old won! After never have playing ANY game system in her life. *rotf* I gave kai some greif on that..
We then walked twords the comic shop. Everyone ditched us and stayed at Vicki's cuz they wanted us to go together alone. *L* After meeting back up we went to the other comic shop only to find them gone to the Gen Con. *shrugs* we went to the Library and then parted. They all walked home and Kai took me out to a chinese place. We walked back to his hotle and watched Hercules and then He walked me home around 11pm. He stayed since my mom was home, he went on the comp and we had some pizza. Then he went home.

Friday- We spent a lot of time together and had lunch at cousins..then he came back to my place and went on my comp again..then we watched Dragonball NOT Z and had pizza. It got late so I had him stay and sleep in my brothers room.

Sat- We got up early and hiked off to the hotle so we could get my check and call the taxi to take us to the bank before it closed all weekend. I cashed it, and then we walked downtown. It had been raining that morning so Maxwell steet days had gotton rained out a bit earlier then usuall. There was only one stand left and it was closing up.
It was selling small loaves of bread and Flowers. Kaioto bought me three of them to carry with me. We then went to the comic shop and Kaioto found 3 magic shirts and I got an AH my goddess wall scrol.
We kept on walking up the street and had lunch. Then went to the cloths store and picked up a few things. Kaioto picked up a Dragonball shirt and a shirt with a dragon and tiger on it. Both very nice shirts. I picked up a shirt for my friend Marisa and then we left to go to her house. As we were walking there I tripped over a buried rock and fell on the side walk. Kai decided to get me some ice cream to make it better *g*. We shared a Medium blizzard with chocolate icecream, peanutbutter cups and strawberries. We got to Marisa's and picked up all the supplies wed need for an anime party we were throwing on Sunday. One of her friends offered us a ride and we packed Collene, Kai, Me, Linda, Marisa, and Mark into the car along with a cooler full of soda and tons of junk food and about 30 anime videos. We got to my house..went on the comp for a while..then decided to order a couple of pizzas. After eating and watching some Neon Genisis we went swimming over at Kai's hotle, saw an old Jacki chan movie and walked back to my house. Everyone slept over to prepare for the party the next day.

Sunday- We got up and my mom happened to be off work that day. April and Athena showed up right before we left and then my mom drove marisa and I to get Christina. In between we met up with Vicki who had driven there. We all went to Pick N' Save and got more supplies. When we returned home we got a few more things ready..tapes in order, junk food layed out and such. Then Marisa, Kaioto, Athena and I went to fetch warm food. Marisa, Me and Athena picked up Chinese..Kaioto and Mark wanted Burger King. April munched the chinese when we got back and Vicki had veggies and some junk food. We then watched anime from around 1pm to 11pm. It wasnt nearly as long as it should have been..but Mark had work and my mom was there..so we could have a 3 day party *smiles* but we had a lot of fun. That night Kai went back to the hotle, Mark went to work, April and Athena went home and Marisa and Vicki slept over with me.

Mon- I got up at 7am and dragged Marisa with me. Vicki stayed in bed since she would have to walk to work at 11. Marisa and I hooked up with Kaioto and we all took a taxi to the Photographers. Marisa left and walked home while Kai and I went in to our 9:00 appointment. We spoke with John the guy who owned the place and he said he could actually squeeze us in at 9:30pm after his last appointment that night. We thanked him and picked out our background and such then walked home. We took the long way, walking past a park and stopping at a custard shop. I had a small turky sandwitch..(thats what they called it) and a cup of soup. Kaioto had a 3 quarter pound cheese burger. *smiles* that was enough for him and he decied against the banana split. We walked home and were so beat that we just took naps. Kai woke me up later and we watched some Ah My Goddess and nibbled on left over chinese. Then my mom came home and took us to South Ridge. A mall in Milwaukee. On the way my mom took us to my favorite chinese resturant..rated best for 4 years now. It wasnt ready for dinner yet so we went to a pet shop and looked at the fish, and played with a kitten. I suggessted we one day get a very large fish tank since I like them so much. To which he replied we should get a fish WALL or atleast a coffee table of glass placed upon the tank *grins* sounds good to me. We had dinner and my mom and kai had a brife deal over who would pay..my mom won *smiles* we went to share a banana split at Cops and then went to the mall. I found a shiny green dragon shirt and asked Kai to try it on. He liked it well enough and purchased it. Even wore it as one of his tops for the photoshoot later. We just made it on time and it was a funny session. He had us in weird poses one of which was me on a table with my hips digging into the table:P but atleast Kaioto let me spike his hair ( which I had given a bit of a trim at the party *grins*) for two of the pics..and John had a great japanese background for us to use. After that my mom picked us up and we had to say goodbye again.

Tuesday- I got up and went to see kai at 9 so wed have a few hours before he got kicked out at 11. We then packed and went to my house to drop off his things and do some of my Geometry work. My mom had to leave for something and offered to drop us off to eat somewhere. We went to Apple B's and again kai had a large chesse burger and fries. We shared some buffalo wings and as for me I had a non-alchoholic strawberry dachary..er..sorry cant spell that and a chicken pot pie. As we walked home we were getting sad since time was running out..we met Vicki walking by on the side walk and She said goodbye to him. We went home and did some more homework before he had to go. We drove to the airport and when we got there Kaioto bought one of his friends a cheese head. My mom waited for me at a resturant and I walked Kai to his gate. We were supposed to have another 15 min to talk to eachother..but as we walked down the isle they called final boarding call for flight (#) to Boston. We had to run to get him on and could only have one quick kiss and hug goodbye before he raced onto the plane. BOY That really urks me that they can just take off whenever they darn well please! Well anyway..I cried a lot..I couldnt even stay to watch the plane take off fully..I had to leave.

Well..to sum it all up. We had a wonderful time together. I am finding it very hard to be without him now. I keep crying and feeling sorry for myself..I know I shouldnt..but I cant help but miss him so badly. I love him so much.
But we are fortunate. We already plan on seeing eachother for 2 to 3 weeks in December. *sighs* *is counting the days*
I hope our story gives hope to any of you out there..Its hard to be so far away from the ones you love..

Well..I guess I should end this up. Id comment on the latest TGS but I havent been anywhere on the net since Kai came. *waves*



Lexy - [lex@hnet.net]
West Bend, WI, USA
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 10:56:30 PM
IP: d103.hnet.net

VISIT STATION 8!
VISIT STATION 8!

First day of school today. Fairly uneventful except for the bus not showing up to take me home in the afternoon, resulting in my being at school 3 hours too long...

Hmm, bit more arguing of sorts in here than usual... Okay people, I don't care who said what, when, where, why, or how, I want the bickering to stop YESTERDAY. Okay? Now, I need to go about finding a copy of the room rules and repost them...

Owen being stiff- Why is it people say he never smiles when he smiles all the time? Right off the top of my head he smiled in Awakenings and he smiled in Eye of the Beholder, and thats just off the top of my head that I can specifically

TGS fanfic- The way it works basically is, we have a staff between 20 and 35 people, (Maybe more, its hard to be sure since some people are off list and some are just artists and such...)and basically, we spend two or three months plotting out a season of any given series, throwing out story and story arc ideas. Ideas get tossed back and forth between everyone, and eventually, we have a good concept of whats what. Then stories are given out to artist and writers, and then checked a lotta times for continuity and final content and such. Its basically the same way any proffessional series works between multiple individuals, (And lots of the time, with single individuals as well.) You can't just send in a story to TGS and hope it gets put in, it simply doesn't work that way with the tight continuity we have. But other peoples fanfic BASED on the TGS universe is another matter entirely...

Uplifting news- I got an e-mail from Deuce last nightday pointing me towards a pokemon website with info on the MewTwo movie. So he's reading the room well enough to know I was looking for info on this. He's still around, he's just not ready to post yet.

Pistoff- Thanks for th epity offered to those of us now back in school... But it could be worse, we could have to deal with what you put up with. You're far braver than most of us man.

Ironwolf- You dogs don't get the spotlight because most of you can't talk, which leads to problems. But Scooby Doo... What are you talking about? He's had like, a dozen different series with HIS name in the title! He's always the main character! (Well, an argument can be made for Velma being the main character, but after a few series she and Fred dissapeared...)

Aaron- If you ever start to develop an ego, just remember one of the lessons learned from "Those Who Hunt Elves." I have no clue what lesson that would be, but I'm sure its in there somewhere.

Oh and you're supposed to tell me about the SAAS meetings.

Neo Traveler- First of all, you may need to come up with another name, since there IS someone else who goes by that name in here already... (He only stops by once or twice a month, but when he does, he has epic posts...)

And yes,those comments on issue 4 of the comic DO count as spoilers, put a warning next time. Although in this case, since the comic is years old, and impossible to find almost, it likely doesn't matter much... But then again, Conan O'Brian assumed everyone knew the ending of the Wizard of Oz a few nights ago...

**UNNEEDED SPOILER WARNING, THE ENDING OF THE WIZARD OF OZ IS IN HERE, IF SOMEHOW YOU'VE NEVER SEEN THE MOVIE.**

"Andy, you just ruined Blair Witch for me!"
"No I didn't. I made that up."
"Wha? Why would you make something like that up? Do you even remember how the movie ends?"
"Yeah, but I don't want to ruin it for you."
"I don't care at this point! Tell me how it ends, I have to know now!" (Andy had been giving out several fake endings at this point...)
"Well, they poured some water ont he witch and she melted and there were some flying monkies too."
"ANDY! That's the ending to The Wizard of OZ!"
(SOmeone in the audience "Thanks alot COnan! You just ruined the movie for me! I just bought the tape today and was going to watch it for the first time tonight! But now I don't see the point..."

**END WIZARD OF OZ SPOILER**

Pistoff- Neat idea, except Goliath weighs alot. He'd probably BREAK the roller coaster...

I'm going to go hunt for the room rules now. This is going to be very time consuming on my part since I'll have to hunt through all the archived CR's, without any guarantee of finding them. So I expect you people to behave if I find them. In fact, I expect you to behave if I don't. Okay?
Robby
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 10:34:07 PM
IP: spider-to044.proxy.aol.com

*enters*

My God, I just saw Gargoyles stamps at Borders! :) Why I didn't get them, I have no idea. Oh wait, yes I do! If I got them, my sister might find them! >:P

A funny thing happened when I was dowtown at a comic book store. I went in and saw a guy from my Anime Club at school. He's already graduated. When he turned and saw me, he gave me this look of shock. Hmmm...Must've been my tight little tank I was wearing...
Mary Flanders
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 09:44:02 PM
IP: ramp-1-44.ucdavis.edu

Traveler -My computer geekification has slowed to a halt. I am a glorifed operator. It's a waste of my time, intelligence, and worse, my education. My quest for a new job will begin after I finish all the training they promised (and *#!$ing better deliver). Arg. As soon as I have a new job, I kiss this crappy job good-bye. But on the plus side, I was offered a freelance graphics job redesigning a website for a columnist named Paul Riddell. Yay!

Thanks everyone who like "Lightning Crashes"! =) Sorry I was so long getting it out; I sent it off to beta readers quite a while back, but my internet access is still sporatic, so I couldn't post it for a while. Arg. Oh, well. I've finished the first draft of "Dies Irae" but a new, *major*, plot-altering idea has come up and needs to be hammered out before I can ship out "Dies Irae," so it's going to be on hold for a bout a week longer than I intended--so it should be out the week after next instead of next week. Sorry for all the delays! Oh, and just a warning--I'm taking a bit of a break from "Apokalypsis" and finishing off the prequel to "Gli enigmi." Yup, I decided to actually do it, and only have about two or three scenes to write before it goes to beta-reader stage--so it should come out either right before or right after "Dies Irae."

The infamous quote: I only just found out about this. Geez. I think it's best I just stay out of it, even though I feel like apologizing up a blue streak for the whole thing, not just to Christine Morgan but to everyone for the uproar this seems to have caused. But guys, please, try not to jump on Paul too much for it--it is his opinion, and he is entitled to it. Yes, it may have been tactless and kinda mean, but all of us have our opinions--and I'm not just saying that because of the contents of the quote. Really. And Paul, remember, you can't go around saying stuff like that without considering the consequences and the way it might make people feel. If that comment had been the other way around, I'd have been a little hurt. Actually, a lot more than a little hurt--I'd be very hurt. Paul, to be perfectly honest, while I am flattered by what you wrote, I also felt my stomach sink when I read it. I can appreciate the compliment, but not at the expense of someone else, and *especially* not in a public forum. Had you e-mailed me personally and said that, I would have thanked you, and then pointed out exactly what I'm going to here: I'm not surprised Christine Morgan did better than I did--she's a *really* good writer, she's written more stories than I have, and even if the first two weren't the case, I also had a year-long posting hiatas and lost some of my readership. Hell, I'd have gone into shock if she *hadn't* done better than I.

And Christine, I am going to apologize, even though it's something Paul Nathans said and Paul Nathan's opinion. Speaking as someone who for a long time had no confidence at all in her ability to write, there was a time when something like that would have been like salt in an open wound. I feel bad because even through it wasn't me that posted it, my name was (and therefore I am) involved in this whole mess. Again, I'm sorry, and everyone, can we *please* make this the end of it?

jewel - [Jewel.Faulkner@alumnae.brynmawr.edu]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 09:04:27 PM
IP: 207-172-73-187.s187.tnt1.man.va.dialup.rcn.com

**enters the room, switching out the candles and sitting back in the big chair**

Okay, I'm a bit happier today ... and I'll tell ya why:
NEW STORY!!
Clicky on my name link to read "Team Bravo." **pulls out the stack of Bibles again** I swear upon this stack of Bibles that I *will* have Team Charlie out by the 26th, in time for my grandmother's, Rosanna's, and Kyryn's respective birthdays!

To all those going back to school: **gives Roman salute** We salute you, those about to die. **slaps self** Oops ... wrong speech. ;)

Stephen, re: ABG's: RIGHT ON, BRUDDAH!! **chest-slams with Stephen**

Wilek: Murphaic? I've got to remember that one ...

Mandi: Maybe ye do, maybe ye don't. There's a big reason why I've given myself these deadlines, and it's because I'm trying to teach myself discipline in my writing. If I miss these deadlines, it hurts me on an emotional level, because I feel that I've let y'all down. 'Tis just the way my mind works.

Ironwolf, re: the howl: Certainly a good point, my friend. And of course, my coyote nature is certainly not one to miss out on the opportunity to join in on a group howl. ;) **clears throat**
Arh
Arh
AAAAAAAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!

David G.: Far's I know she hasn't been active since around 1940 or so, but she still has a wooden cross pendant she received to mark her status as a minister.
In fact, if the mood hits her right, occasionally she'll wear it ... and nobody ever makes the connection. :)

Warpmind: What about Carbonear (Dylan Blacquiere) or Arin MacDuff (Amy K. Cyrway)?

Traveler: Take notice of a part around the middle of "Team Bravo." You'll be quite interested.

Spacebabie, re: caffeine: No, don't lay off the caffeine. God knows your brand of silliness is more than welcome among *this* group of nutballs! :)

**sits back in the chair, fixating on the candle, a sad but satisfied look on his face.**
Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 08:21:58 PM
IP: modem77.i-is.com

Reveredn Attila>Smile thanks for the friendly welcome

OUCH its way too hot in here::fans away flames:: Yuck not another flame war::Uses the magic ice hose to quelch the flames:: Ok now to get rid of the bad vibes::concentrates::
WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAKAAAAAAAAAAZZZZZZZOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMM!

there all negetive energy shall be erased,now lets have FUN!

I need to lay off the caffeine.
Spacebabie - [Spacebabie76@yahoo.com]
Orlando, Fl, USA
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 08:06:18 PM
IP: ts002d47.orl-fl.concentric.net

Aris: Try to see the other side, eh? Perhaps you should follow your own advice.

As if it makes any difference. You think I started it, I think Angie started it, she thinks I started it. Whatever. In a hundred years, what difference is it gonna make?

Whatever. I'm through arguing about this because it isn't going anywhere. If anybody else comes down on me, don't expect a response. I'm through with this mess.
Pistoff
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 07:57:48 PM
IP: wire-8.koalas.com

Here's an oddball thought. Say some fey is into history, and recreated on Avalon an exact replica of the Trinity Test Site, comple with an exact reproduction of the first atomic bomb. Now imagine he's showing his *queem* what he build, and her reaction when she realizes exactly what was constructed.:)
Gyre - [wseeley@epix.net]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 07:50:37 PM
IP: fltg3-ppp70.fltg.net

Pistoff> I'm not trying to get into a flame war. I've had far too many in this room and therefore I'll be trying with this post to calm this thing down. Just.. try to see the other point of view. If I had said "In my experience, people who act like you do are in need of medical attention and a straitjacket" wouldn't that be considered an insult? Yes, I'll be simply referring to my experience but I wouldn't be using it as irrelevant anecdote. I would be using it with a clear reference to what the other person said and with a generalising statement about what such people are. You did not mean it as an insult, but it could be taken as such. And 'twit' certainly was also *meant* as such, which didn't make me overcautious in trying to determine whether you also meant the previous insults.

The words "Goliathite-Elisite warrior" alone seemed to suggest humour for me. I didn't consider it very perceptive of me. Sorry you thought otherwise. My final post on the thread.
Aris Katsaris - [katsaris@otenet.gr]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 07:19:26 PM
IP: athe530-e082.otenet.gr

Gettin' to the replies.

Kitania> <<Good Madoc-Clinton creativity demon. Wonder what he'd do to Al Gore.>> I don't know... make him more interesting? :)

Traveler with a capital T> << BTW, if I would have been around I would have voted for you in the poll. >> *blush* Thanks. :)

Anyway... I have TGS stuff to write, page updates to work on, and I'm gonna start on my SG-1 "Children of the Gods" transcript for that section of my site. Turns out I have the very first run of that pilot on tape, with nothing cut out. :) Later all!
Mandolin - [weird_web@hotmail.com]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 07:10:59 PM
IP: pm3-3-ppp19.iximd.com

You know people, the only reason I think we're all acting like idiots is either the eclipse or we've been working with the public too long.

Here's Pistoff's original reply to Angie. Know where did he refer to her as ugly. Only that in his experience etc.
****
Angie: Remember the saying about beauty being in the eye of the beholder. It's been my experience that people who describe somebody else as "ugly" are doing so because they feel inferior (either because of their looks, or any other reason), and insulting somebody else makes them feel better about themselves. Personally, I think Brooklyn's not bad-looking at all. In fact, I've always been drawn toward people/characters who *aren't* like "everybody else" because, IMO, normal is boring. To be honest, if I ever ran into a female who looked like Brooklyn--horns, beak, and so on--I'd be the first one to invite her to dinner and a movie.
****

I real do expect higher standard from this room. Oh well, it's got to be the eclipse.

Starsinger
Theresa - [Starsinger@Webtv.net]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 06:44:36 PM
IP: proxy-413.public.paix.webtv.net

**RP BEGINS HERE**

In a large mansion outside Chicago, rabidly hateful religious bigot, racist jerk, and all-around a-hole Matthew Hale is relaxing in a hot tub with a fat horse-faced woman with a huge mouth. All of a sudden a huge fireball erupts in the tub, throwing Hale out and steam-burning the screaming woman to cinders. "What the..." Hale stammers as he leaps to his feet and assumes a karate stance. "Be not afraid, Matthew Hale!" a voice speaks out of the steam and smoke clouds (note- CR dwellers who have been following the RP may recognize the speaker as Demon Lord Gothmenes). "I have been sent by the being you serve to give you orders. In a few minutes a man will come to your door. You and your followers are to do whatever he says!" Hale shakes in fear and nods. "Yes, servant of the Creator," he bows. "Thy will be done! All but the master race shall be expunged from this Earth!! Thy will be done!" Gothmenes laughs and vanishes in a puff of flame as Hale continues to kowtow.

Meanwhile, on the Avatar of Ganon, Doug and Kitainia are in the portal room saying goodbye to Daria and Trent. Nearby MIB agents are shuttling the still-disoriented Lawndale citizens through a portal back to their school. "Thanks again for helping us with the Borg situation," Kitainia tells them. "They had our friends and families," Trent shrugs. "We had to do something. Thank you for helping us get everyone back and restore them." "Yeah," Daria agrees. "Our families and friends may be annoying in many ways, but we do care about them." "Well, you two have a good trip back," Doug tells them as he and Kit step away. "Later." "Later, guys," Trent waves, Daria doing the same. "If you're ever in Lawndale again, look us up." With that they turn around and step through the portal but not before being flashie-thinged by two MIB agents. Kit shakes her head at the necessity, and motions to Doug. "Let's head for the arcade, shall we?" "Sure," Doug replies. "We also need to find Ruth. One of these portals will have her name on it." Kit nods and they head off.

**END RP BEFORE THE POST**

Hi. Well, school will begin for us in about two weeks. I know for some of you it has already, and so I wish you all good luck bearing it. Hope you all make good grades, nice friends, and have a wonderful year. :)

SOROW: Sorry about the mistake earlier. Good luck in your junior year.

Brooklyn: I agree that he's physically attractive, but not as much as some of the other characters. Graeme, Matt, and especially Xanatos are all better looking, IMO. The main reason I nominated Brooklyn for best male character was due to his excellent development. I like his attitude too.

Goliath: For all the reasons already mentioned, I agree that he is an excellent character and, while a little too serious for my taste, still a good sweet kind wonderful handsome guy.

Fleur: Read "Trick or Treat" last night, loved it. Good character development, action, and plot. Thanks for the entertainment, hope you continue to turn out good fics. $ BTW, I hope you'll read and respond to the RP query below. $

Theresa: Loud music is a problem at a lot of apartment complexes, isn't it? The people in the apartment above ours usually have parties with lots of it on the weekends, and nothing we do can shut them up. Bad music too, generally hard rock and heavy metal (and not the good kind like Metallica). It's one of the reasons Doug and I usually go out Friday and Saturday nights. :)

traveler: Welcome!

David G: Thanks for the interesting Illuminati info. Wonder if any of the Illuminatius Majors, Regents, or Mystics are people we know. :)

Paul: I disagree with you. If one looks at how the plots and character development of Gargoyles progresses, they should see that Goliath and Elisa's relationship is very important to the story. Maybe not as important as, say, Alex and Luna's in Lunar, or Fei and Elly's in Xenogears. But important just the same from Awakenings onwards. Thus it should definitely be at least a small part of any Gargs movie.

Todd: Good Madoc-Clinton creativity demon. Wonder what he'd do to Al Gore.

Batya: Yes you do. :) Welcome back, and hope you soon resume those interesting archetype posts.

Angela's Mate: I agree that because he genuinely cared about her and vice versa, Broadway was the best choice. (The big guy getting the girl was also good to see.)

Traveler: Welcome back...again! :) Thanks for the parody info, hopefully we can pick up a copy soon. (I'll have to ask my Mafia contacts where the local Khaos Inc store can be found.) *spoilers for Doug's fanfics* As for the info you requested, Doug's currently working on a story involving the Ishimura clan called "Protected Species." Nikki and Matt aren't in it. However, some development on them and their relationship will be done in the story after it, "Repurcussions." (It won't be the main focus of the story, that will be Demona and the Sparks trying to apprehend the Punisher while fighting the Rose again, but it will be a developed subplot.) Of course the real big developments are far ahead in "Night of the Symbiotes" and "Blind Date." :) That's all I can tell you. In his next post, Doug might say more. *spoilers end*

Okay, that's all for now. Doug and I will try to post more before this weekend (when we have to go out of town to visit our families again, but don't worry we won't be gone that long). Later!

**TIME FOR MORE RP**

Doug and Kitainia enter the Avatar's recreation room and find Ruth with Jammer and the other Ravens (except for Lathrop, who is still resting). "Hi guys," Tom waves as they walk over. "Send the Lawndale citizens home alright?" "We did," Doug replies. "Ruth, they've got the portals for you whenever you want to head back to your mother in Chicago." "If you don't mind, I'd like to stay hear in a while," Ruth tells him. "This arcade has some games I haven't played." Doug and Kit look at each other and shrug. "Alright," Kit says. "But you better call your mother and let her know you're alive sometime. And as soon as you've had your fill of the games, we're taking you home." Ruth smiles. "Don't worry." The Ravens chuckle as she runs off to play an interesting-looking Final Fight type of videogame that has the player as a samurai against armies of Chinese and Mongol soldiers who are invading Japan. Then Jammer spots Fleur (who has just finished her Half-Life game, and gave her character over to Jaden) and waves at her. "What's up?" she asks, walking towards the Ravens. "We were wondering if you could fill us in on a few things," Jammer answers. "Like where you went a while back." Fleur frowns and nods as the other Ravens make prompting gestures. "Uh, okay."

The display flickers back to Matthew Hale's mansion, where he is straightening a hastily donned suit as his butler brings in a familiar short blonde-haired Pat Sajak look-alike in a white suit. "Matthew Hale of the World Church of the Creator?" the man asks. Hale nods. "Pastor John Gould, Organization of Independent Christian Right Preachers. I've heard we share many views about the nature of God and Christianity. I wondered if your organization might be interested in joining a group of people I represent." "Maybe," Hale replies, still looking unnerved by his encounter with Gothmenes. "Who leads this organization?" "The angel of Oliver Cromwell, a figure you might know from history." Hale smiles. "Why yes, Cromwell is one of my favorite historical Christian reformers." He waves Pastor John to a chair. "Why don't you sit down and tell me more?"

**TO BE CONTINUED, END THIS BIT OF RP**
Kitainia
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 06:33:47 PM
IP: pool-209-138-215-77.dlls.grid.net

Angie: Yeah, sure, whatever. Just keep in mind that there insulting jokes and cutting remarks aren't funny. Go back and look at your "Have you been drinking?" post. There's nothing there, to me, that indicates in any way, shape, or form, that it was a joke.

Aris: Oh, you could tell it was a joke, eh? Well, if you're so much more perceptive than I am, where did you get the idea that I insulted her first?! I was NOT saying Angie is ugly or lacking in any way. I was NOT suggesting anything other than what my own personal experience has taught me--that people who call others "ugly" may be trying to compensate for their own problems. I know this from experience, because I've been on the receiving end of far too many "ugly," "funny-looking," etc, comments myself--and all of them came from people who had plenty of things wrong with them, as well, whether it was their looks or something else entirely. Ugliness is one thing I never joke about, and never insult people about, because such a concept depends on one's perspective. Go back in your memory and see if you can remember *any* time when I called somebody ugly. Anyway, I was NOT singling Angie out, I was making a general comment, and she had no justification whatsoever for attacking me. Furthermore, I simply voiced an opinion about Goliath, and she went off on me--and I don't give a damn what you say, to me her "Have you been drinking?" comment did NOT appear to be lighthearted or said in any sort of joking manner. But I guess I'm just not as gifted as you are, when it comes to noticing things like that.
Pistoff
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 06:14:31 PM
IP: wire-8.koalas.com

This whole flame war, not gonna get into it. NO ONE IS GOING TO WIN!

Reverend Attila> Which *part* of Verdant? ;) Ohhhh, spank me I'm bad! And I'm definately for the clean-shaven, cat-loving, conservative, three piece suit type...

Jenna> It's not just you! There has been a lot of fighting this month...

traveler> I have that comic with Broadway and the Vamp, the pics are awesome!

I wish Jackal would post and tell us he's alright, cause I'm having doubts that he's "just peachy".
SOROW
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 05:52:14 PM
IP: usr12-dialup222.mix1.irving.cw.net

Aris, let's forget who's fault it is, and move on, instead of trying to assign blame.


Aaron - [JCarnage@Yahoo.com]
San Antonio, TX, USA
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 05:37:22 PM
IP: ppp-53.tnt-1.sat.smartworld.net

I'm with Angie on this. Pistoff started with the insults suggesting that Angie may be ugly or lacking in some other way. Angie's commentary were light throughout and in atleast two of her posts they contained apologies. I could see it was meant as a joke and many other people could see it was a joke. And even if it hadn't been, I'd possibly justify her since she was responding to insults (it's Pistoff that first turned it personal by commenting on the person of those who make such comments as Angie's)
Aris Katsaris - [katsaris@otenet.gr]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 05:23:36 PM
IP: athe530-g104.otenet.gr

“There’s someone in my head but it’s not me...” Well, that’s almost right, because someone’s using my name, and it’s not me.

****WARNING: I’M BACK.... AND THAT MEANS THAT YES, THIS IS AN RP!!!****

Scene: Just after Wilek picks up Stephanie (who was chasing Traveler with her sword) in one of his portals without Traveler noticing. *Traveler whose still running cartoon style (you can see his upper body but his legs are just a blur.)* Traveler: huff...huff... I wonder if I’ve lost Kitainia’s crazy sister yet? *Slows down and stops, then looks behind him, towards the World Devastatior.... Just as it explodes.* Traveler: oh-no.... *BLAM* *Camera angle switches to a wide right (side) view. You see the MASSIVE shock wave from the blast rapidly approaching Traveler’s form. It then impacts Traveler and sends him flying like a football being punted at kickoff.* Traveler:
YYYAAAAAAAAWHOWHOWHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!

*WARNING: THIS IS THE END OF THIS PART OF THE RP. WHY YOU NEED A WARNING INSTEAD OF AN ANNOUNCEMENT OF THIS EVENT I DON’T KNOW. BUT IT’S IN THE RULE BOOK SO WHEN IN ROME....>:))****

Well hello again everybody. That time of the year is nearly upon us. Yes back to school. For some (the unlucky) must return to the seemingly never-ending hell of high school. (In case your wondering yes it does eventually end.) For the college students here however, who get to basically schedule their own classes (as long as they’re not already filled up) it’s not nearly as bad. Thankfully I’m in the latter. Looks at class schedule, Ahhh... I love being an computer geek. Another thing I’ve noticed, something disturbing in fact. It seems that I’ve been posting in here in my sleep... Most disturbing is the fact that with the exception of the Godzilla comments, the rest is a mixed bag, some I agree with some I don’t. I’m going to have to have a long talk with my Id. *At this point CC walks in, smacks Traveler over the head with a baseball bat and says: CC: You nut that’s not you posting in your sleep!!! That’s someone else USING your user name!!!* Traveler: Uhhh....Oh. Okay. Now on to the insanity...

>traveler- traveler, this is Traveler. Some people seem to think that our user names are similar. Really I don’t see any resemblance.>:)) You spell it “traveler” and I spell it “Traveler”. But just as long as you keep spelling it like that, and don’t start making lengthy posts in Dark Gray, I’m fine with it. (Although this may still confuse others...>:))

>Fleur- Thanks for the welcome back!!! <<But, after five thousand years, they've forgot about it. Or... *stops for a second, realizing what she is doing.* Okay. I give in. Resistance to this Creativity Demon is futile. :)>> Of course it’s futile you silly!!! It’s a Creativity Demon!!! Also, I’m quite glad that you didn’t receive any injuries from your ordeal with those two brain dead, tried to donate my body to science but was rejected, a$$-holes. If you really want to find them, try getting access to the police departments records and looking for similar occurrences. Humans are creatures of habit and those with fewer brain cells are even more so. I doubt this is the first time those two have done something like this. And don’t take the police’s word on this, be sure to check out the owner of the van. Especially *when* he reported it stolen, and what his driving record looks like. Good thing you were driving a tank though wasn’t it?>:)) Depending on how they hit you and the make of the van, they might have done more damage to the van than to your car. Well good luck with that. I also read your latest “Trick or Treat”. It explains a great deal about the characters in your universe that I had wondered about, also I believe your writing style is improving from your earlier efforts.

>Doug and Kitainia- And a thank you for you two for your welcome backs that you both gave me. <<BTW, did you have to kill off Walker Texas Ranger?>> Yes. Yes he had to die. <<And also thanks for getting Fleur and co. out of the Devastatior before it blew.>> No problem, ‘twas my pleasure. <<BTW, where can we find this interesting-sounding game called Rustygears? :)>> Why at your local black market Khaos Inc. store of course, in the video game section, right next to Soylent Green: The Eternal Spleen Saga: Complete.>:)) And just so you know someone has been, I have read your last two fan fics. The reason why I havn’t reviewed them? Well I think my reason was more than a few pages long by the time I e-mailed it to you... Let’s just say that I read them and enjoyed them, if I see any major problems I’ll tell you. As for the plot development... heh, heh, heh, you mentioned Sagat.... heh, heh... Seth’s mortal, but according to prophecy he’s going to kill the (hopefully the evil one) King of the Dragons
with the Spear of Destiny. That’s going to be one hell of an interesting fight scene.>:)) *Warning: Shameless attempt for information!* That reminds me, I wonder how the relationship between Matt Bluestone and Niki is going?....

>Robby- <<What, no part where you go "Dragons dragons dragons"?>> Well, Okay... BACK BY POPULAR DEMAND!!! Dragons, Dragons, Dragons, Dragons, Dragons, Dragons, Dragons, Dragons, Dragons, Dragons, Dragons, Dragons, Dragons, Dragons, and yet unbelievably, continuously, eternally EVEN MORE DRAGONS AND THE DRAGON KING!!!!

>Sevarius Jr.- <<BTW, Where can I get MY copy of Rustygears? It sounds like the best game EVER!!!>> Yes it IS the best game ever, because I said so, and I’m going to keep saying so is every ‘friggan post I make at least 20 times.>:)) Guess who I am...>:)) As for where you can purchase that item, like I said to Doug and Kitainia: “At your local black market Khaos Inc. store of course, in the video game section, right next to Soylent Green: The Eternal Spleen Saga: Complete.>:))” <<Say, I forgot that you were a Republican. Yes!!! Join us!!! Join us, the Evil Party, as we sell guns to children, oppress minorities and homosexuals, take away welfare, and make the rich even richer!!! Come, puppets, dance as we pull your strings!!!! Bwah ha ha ha!!!!>> Yeah, it’s a party every day isn’t it?>:)) Hey don’t blame us!!! You Democrats and Liberals party your way we’ll party ours.>:) *Traveler wheels out the good old “Wheel of Immoralality”.* Traveler: Quick S.J. give it a spin! *The Wheel goes ‘round and ‘round, finaly stopping on...* Sevarius Jr.: Alright!!! Cutting pharmaceutical medication with sugar, reducing it’s effectiveness to the point where it’s worthless!!! Traveler: It's party time!!!

>Wilek Nereus- <<Oh, and...I think there are several other cloaked ships in orbit. Namely, Oscura-class Dislumini Warbirds. They've remained quiet for now because they haven't detected the Trih Xeem, although they're probably getting suspicious now that they know your other ship is there. If you like, I can send you an e-mail clarifying all this.:)>> Yes please clarify. BTW, the Trih Xeem is a weapons system on board the “Boomer”.>:)) <<Um...Rustygears? You're twisted. :P>> Happily Wilek, happily twisted.>:)

>Rustygears- Before I start to ream Paul a new one with a jackhammer, some hydrochloric acid, and a few steel wool pads, I’d like to take this space and thank all of you here who stood up for my parody and the idea of parody in general.

>Theresa Starsinger- I saw your post mentioned the personal attacks, flame wars and such right before I was going to post this. This next part may or may not be in violation of that, but I should point out that I was attacked first by Paul in this public forum. Therefore I should have the right to a publice response to his attack. If my message had contained profanity though, rest assured that I would have e-mailed it to him instead of posting it here.

>Paul_Allen_Nathens- You fool. Did it ever occur to you that perhaps I was not only poking fun at the video game RPG genre and Xenogears, but also you personally? Did it ever occur to you that I wrote that parody because not only did I want to entertain the rest of the CR with it (my main reason and inspiration for writing it) but also to illicit a response from you? Oh yes your response was not unexpected, but what I wanted to see was what KIND of response. Would you take it as it was meant to be, a parody, and laugh along with it? Or would you ignore it? Or as I suspected, go into religious zealot mode defending it? When you did make your response I was not disappointed in its entertainment value. I read it and laughed my ass-off for at least ten minutes straight. A parody can be such a useful tool. A means to force, through the guise of entertainment, an examination of an idea usually unapproachable. In your case it was the idea that Xenogears could be parodied or even joked about. Judging from all of your previous posts exulting the *glory* and sheer magnificence of Xenogears and how the characters and their suffering were so realistic, I wondered just how attached you were to this GAME. I, along with the rest of the CR found out didn’t we? <<I am not obsessed with XENOGEARS, and the characters do live when the system's off.>> Uh-huh. You treat the characters as real people, as if those events actually happened and you were there. Or perhaps you see yourself as one or more of the characters themselves? I suspect that the reason you take that GAME and any attack on it so seriously is because that is what you’ve based (at least) a large part of your life on. You worship those GAMES as if they were a religion and you it’s prophet. You can try and deny this but your first and subsequent posts “defending” it from my parody (and for extra oomph, lets throw in all of your previous posts and count the number of times Xenogears or another RPG is mentioned or implied.) is proof enough unless you show me (at least) otherwise. Example: <<I am not obsessed with XENOGEARS.>> Right after you made this statement you wrote a short paragraph trying to explain why, but you ended up telling us how full and realistic the characters were. THEN in the next paragraph you went on to explain in some detail to Mandolin why she shouldn’t get Bleem! because <<without the Music, XENOGEARS is not as incredible as it is with the Muisc>> and that <<XENOGEARS has the best Music there is.>> And let us not forget about those quotes you put in every single time at the end of your posts. And just why did you try and pull Jewel Faulkner into this argument that YOU started? Did you try to involve her thinking that just because she writes fanfiction with characters that mesh with your world view that she would come to your aid and side with you? And yes YOU started this, for if you had only taken the parody in stride and let it go (like a somewhat mentally stable individual with a sense of humor would do), this response would be unfounded and unecessary. But you did not. You attacked me on a personal level, questioning my empathy and humanity. That I normally do not mind because I find some things funny that most others wouldn’t. What I take offense to is that you questioned them in response to a JOKE. A JOKE that EVERYONE else in the room either liked or did not comment about. You were the SOLE disapproving faction. So far as I can see, you stand alone.

But then you really always have, haven’t you?

>Santa Crus, California- They outlawed hate?! And they call(ed) us freaks?! It’s places like this that make me want to move there, start a gun club/shooting range, and a pirate radio station playing metal 24/7. Then I’d go about seeing how I could promote the raping of the natural resources in the local community. I’ll give’em something to hate, and when they try to run me out of town I would go laughing because their little bubble of Utopia would be in shambles.>:))

>Random point- Why is it that I currently feel like George Carlin giving his “Free-floating hostility” bit?>:))

>Jewel Faulkner- Good luck with the apartment! How’s your computer geekification coming along? How many scenes from Monty Python and the Holy Grail you can recite from memory is usually a good indicator.>:)) Also I read “Apokalypsis"--"Lightning Crashes” the night you posted it. Oh, poor Queen Titainia. To little to late. Only after Oberons death does she take the advice originally given to him on how to stop the coming twilight. But the time when that might have stopped it had already gone and she was now only playing as a pawn for fate, giving time for the seven to gather. hehehehehehhehe. And she misinterpreted the prophecy, I wonder what deal she made with the Lord of Shadows because of that error? And now Angelica is dead, and with her the child who could have stopped the coming fall. And as you said “Thoth wept.” hehehehehhahahahaha.... I love this stuff.

>Mandolin- Do you mean to tell me that you not only complained to the IRS stating that they had made a mistake, but that they actually *admitted* it, and then FIXED it? That’s unbelievable. This is a story that you’ll be telling your grandkids.>:)) BTW, if I would have been around I would have voted for you in the poll.

>Angie- Don't worry to much about Starsinger, she's had to put out a few potential flame wars in the past so she usually tries to stop them before they go to that level. Just watch what you say and make sure whoever your "talking" to knows when you're being sarcastic or joking.>:))

****WARNING: THIS IS THE SECOND PART OF THE RP. NO, REALLY. LOOK I’M NOT KIDDING, AND I DON’T CARE WHO TOLD YOU THAT IT WASN’T BECAUSE IT IS. WHAT DO YOU MEAN “HOW DO I KNOW”? I’M THE ONE WRITING IT!!!!!>:))****

Scene: The Iowa farm where the World Devastatior has exploded, and government troops are now cleaning up. Agent K has just had all of the TV cameras and reporters shuttled out of the area when Agent J come running up. Agent J: K, I found... something... someone... well just come over here and take a look will you? *They start over towards a patch of earth that looks like an impact crater, its’ obviously been exposed to extreme heat as well from the blast the World Devastatior made when it blew.* Agent K: Relax kid, it’s probably just another dead borg left over from.... *gets a look at what’s in the crater. An unconscious Traveler, whose armor is still intact and with out a scratch, not counting the fact that he’s trapped in the surrounding earth that’s been superheated to a liquid and then cooled around the body effectively fusing him into the ground, resembling a fossil. At least until he wakes up.>:))** Oh-no, not him again. Okay kid, you clear an area around this guy and make sure NO ONE else sees this. And don’t tell anyone of this either. I’ve got to go get Zed. *Half-an-hour later the block of earth containing Traveler is beamed abroad the Avatar of Gannon for testing and observation to try and learn more about the powerful insane one known as Traveler. Unfortunately soon after arriving he smelt the pizza in the arcade room thereby waking up and after freeing himself from the block, promptly made his way down to have a few slices. He is currently being beaten badly by Fleur in a Half-Life deathmatch. No testing ended up being done, and the initial readings taken didn’t make any sense. They all said that they were scanning something, but that nothing was there, this almost caused the entire Borg logic net to crash. Side note: Agent J was Flashy thinged to erase his memory of events he was not cleared for. One hour later Agent J asked Agent K if he flashy thinged him a little while ago. Agent K responded “No”.*>:))

****THIS IS THE ENDING. THE ENDING OF THE RP. THE ENDING. THE ENDING. THE ENDING.....****

“NNNOOOOOOOO!!! You fool!!! Do you realize what you have just done?! You have activated the Super-Extra-Deluxe Yamaitittaokangshin Cannon!!! In a mater of moments the entire universe will be folded in on itself destroying everything!!! There is but one thing I must know in these last few moments of life... How did you know the activation codes? -Kracan

“What are you talking about? I thought I just ordered a pizza on that weird telephone...” -Lactos Theintolerant

Rustygears: The Final Slice Saga
Traveler - [traveler45@geocities.com]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 05:14:06 PM
IP: abd7118f.ipt.aol.com

Pistoff: I WAS JUST FRICKIN' JOKING!!! Geez! And people said I took things too seriously. I wasn't saying you were drunk. It was just another way of saying "What are you talking about." Geez! And I wasn't threatening or attacking anyone. That Goliathite Elite warrior thing was just a frickin' joke! I was trying make my post more interesting, for cryin' out loud. I am not a twit! And it seems I'm not the only one who has a crush on a character from the show. Sorry! Last time I joke with you. Sorry. (sings) I'm sorry, so sorry!
Angie - [Goliathgirl@yahoo.com]
USAWednesday, August 11, 1999 04:43:53 PM
IP: dial249.b1.tnt4.wa.freei.net

People, I'm siding with Pistoff. Angie did make threats against him and further, she accused him of being drunk. That is a direct attack on his person and his reputation. May be only in cyberspace, but an attack.

Some of the most important rules of this comment room are:

EVERYONE is entitled to their opinion. It doesn't matter whether it is in agreement with your own views. THEY are entitled to them. They are entitled to civil responses, not flames and NO PERSONAL INSULTS, THREATS OF RETALIATION OR ATTACKS OF ANY KIND.

We can, have, and will continue to have discussions on the most volatile subjects in this room and still keep civil about it. Why, because we don't EVER get personal about our responses to someone else's views.

There is a vast difference between referring to someone as "Silly" and saying "I think your idea is silly." One is an attack on the person, the other, an attack on his idea.


ROBBY it's time to repost the house rules we have very many newbies that need to read them. And many oldtimers who need a refresher course.

Starsinger
Who walked out on her mom and step-dad last night because they kept ragging little sister who was trying to be nice and fix dinner. And whose mother insulted her one time too many in the course of the 'discussion'.
Theresa - [Starsinger@Webtv.net]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 04:32:38 PM
IP: proxy-443.public.paix.webtv.net

Mandolin: Yikes! Sorry about your IRS problems, hope they get straightened out. I'm glad the guy on the phone was able to sort it out and remain polite. You're right, I don't envy the people who answer the phones, either. I take plenty of blame on the phone for other people's mistakes, myself. And you made a good point about avoiding fanfics if they don't suit your personal taste. For instance, I read Mara's MSTing of The Beautiful People, and knew that I didn't care for Watson's stories, but I never flamed him or bitched about it. I just shrugged it off and moved on. There are more important things to get upset about...like the IRS's mistakes. ;)

Jenna: **taking deep breaths** Yes, I lost my temper, but I felt I had good reason. When somebody says to me, "Have you been drinking?!" after I did nothing more than express an opinion, I go off. And that "don't cross me" comment, I took as a threat. If I misinterpereted it, I apologize. If not, then I was justified. Anyway, thanks for the point about POV comment ;) and I'm glad you're enjoying the stories Denis and I have been cranking out. :)

Gyre: Excellent point. Elisa almost died because of the games the fay get off on playing so much. Seems to me that Elisa and Goliath would at least be a bit honked-off about it....

About Goliath being "stiff": Yes, he's been through a lot, but he's excessively stiff. He shouldn't become the source of comic relief, but he would be more interesting if he smiled or joked occasionally. *Occasionally.* It would be nice to see him burst out laughing at least once, after seeing/hear/reading something amusing. His emotions are fairly predictable--either anger or absolute seriousness. Yes, he's gentle, and all, but it would really help him evolve as a character if he had a little fun now and then. In fact, that would make a great story, right there: Goliath learning to loosen up just a little bit. Picture him riding a roller coaster next to Elisa, looking extremely uncomfortable while she is whooping and having a good ol' time.... ;)

Ironwolf: Well, as I said to Jenna, I don't see it that way. It seemed to be a pretty clear attack. Her exact words were, "What in the hell are you talkin' about?! Have you been drinking? Been sippin' back on Grandpa's old cough medicine?" Again, if I misinterperated it, sorry--but I don't think I did. Either way, disagreeing is fine, but when somebody goes off on me like this, a savage verbal beating is a guaranteed response.

Warpmind: Queen, eh? Well, under the circumstances, I think "Hammer to Fall" might be appropriate. ;)

David G: Good luck with your novel! Be ready for a long, hard struggle when you start trying to find an agent or a publisher. I've been shopping my own novel around to both agents and publishers for almost four years, and I have nothing to show for it except enough rejection letters to wallpaper Bill Gates' mansion. Not to discourage you or anything, but just to prepare for you. It's a difficult battle, and there may be times when you wonder if it's worth it. Just don't give up. Just speaking for myself, I've finally declared my novel officially dead and scrapped it--but I'm starting over from scratch and redoing the whole thing in a different manner. So just keep fighting until they open the door for you. Best of luck to ya. :)
Pistoff - [pistoff@outgun.com]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 03:42:49 PM
IP: wire-4.koalas.com

What happened to the fanfic archive? It looks crazy?

Does anyone know the author's name who wrote, "Children of Stone, Daughters of Eve?"
Jenna
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 03:09:08 PM
IP: unknown-31-157.glm.com

Only time for quick post, so here goes:

Does anyone present know of any fanfic saga where Broadway quickly hooks up with another mate than Angela? (Christine Morgan's Elektra not counting.) I'm planning to write a crossover including Spike's Avery, Christine's Aiden, but I lack someone for Broadway. Naturally, if any of the aforementioned authors have objections or questions, I shall answer to said questions as best I can (and no harm will come of it, either, I hope). For the record, I plan neither violence nor...well, more "adult content" stuff to appear in the fic, it will be strictly G-rated, if anyone wondered.

Please respond oh all ye authors out there.
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 03:06:52 PM
IP: mp-217-241-39.daxnet.no

Rev. Atilla> Yes, I do think the Illuminati have religious overtones. The historical Illuminataed Sages of Bavaria based their organization on the pseudo-religious Freemasons. The Gargoyles Illuminati were supposed to have been formed by the Fisher King, guardian of the Holy Grail. Some religious influence is almost a sure thing.

However, I don't think the Society at large is very religious anymore. Duval's ideals have been watered down for 1400 years or so, and from what we can tell now, the Society is more concerned with obtaining control and power than with using it for anything positive. Probably most members are in it for themselves, joining the Society to improve their own personal positions.

Coyote> That is interesting. I didn't know there were any active Rosicrucians.

Angie> Writing is an acquired skill. If you want to be good at it, you have to do it. If you can think up the stories in your head, and explain them in a form others can understand, you've already got the really hard part down. You should try it.

Fanfic Progress> I hate stories based on flashbacks. I love to read them, but I hate to write them. In essence, you have to write two stories, but you're only going to use about 10 percent of the first one.

Oh well.

I didn't even get much done last night. I spent most of my time on the computer doing cyberchat, and the rest converting all the files of my first (so far only) novel from the old .wps format my old computer used to save on into .txt. Then I had to clean up all the bad translation on every stinking chapter. Ick.

It's done now, though. I'm thinking about reading it again, just to see if it's as good as I thought when I was writing it, or as bad as I fear.
David G - [david_goodner@yahoo.com]
Arlington, TX, USA
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 02:42:11 PM
IP: pppa50-fortworthb16-3r662.saturn.bbn.com

Aaron- that would be cool!
Jenna
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 02:33:23 PM
IP: unknown-31-157.glm.com

I'll see what I can do. BTW, I'm planning to wear it to G2K too, since I'll have the coat anyway. Hmmmm, maybe I could go to the park dressed like that. ;)

Later.


Aaron - [JCarnage@Yahoo.com]
San Antonio, TX, USA
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 02:22:21 PM
IP: ppp-138.tnt-1.sat.smartworld.net

Still I wanna see pics with you in that getup! :P
Jenna
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 02:05:39 PM
IP: unknown-31-157.glm.com

Well, it's not really a reunion, it's just Christmas dinner, with my dad, his parents, my aunt, uncle, cousins, my stepmother, and half-brothers, not many of whom I get along with. Maybe I should do the leather vest with no shirt thing too, and show off the tattoo. ;)

Later.


Aaron - [JCarnage@Yahoo.com]
San Antonio, TX, USA
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 01:42:36 PM
IP: ppp-138.tnt-1.sat.smartworld.net

Aaron-- I wanna see piccys of that reunion!
Jenna
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 01:21:43 PM
IP: unknown-31-157.glm.com

Wilek>> You like Farscape too? I believe I've caught almost all of theilr eps this summer. I love the by-play between all the different aliens on the show.

Well, off today so I picked up a couple of books

have a good day everyone
Delphi - [cmiller@magiclink.com]
Twin Falls, Idalho
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 01:16:01 PM
IP: 207.14.195.165

Sorry to double-post but I forgot to wrie one last thing. Does anybody remember Lovonne from the comic series [Broadways' vampire girlfriend]? In her vamp' form she appeared in issue 4 where she shared his eternal hunger, but for what, that differed. When he introduced her to Brooklyn and Lexington They started fighting over here[Brooklyn and Lexington shared physical attraction only here, But I think Brooklyn fought hardest. This was my favorite issue , mainly because of that haunting last page that showed a stone broadway hugging Lovonnes' rotting skeleton after they crashed through a sky light onto an altar.Oh , that was a spoiler wasn't that , I hope not. Any way I find it impossible to find any of the comics anymore. I got mine last year and I only found issues 4,7,9. I feel privaliged to have even those.
traveler - [Goiath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, In, usa
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 01:14:23 PM
IP: proxy-443.public.paix.webtv.net

**Mandi sticks her head in.**

Just finished "Lightning Crashes" after lunch. Started it and couldn't stop until I got to the end, even with Warren and Mark hollering at me to crank up the A/C in here. Jewel, HOW do you do it?

traveler> Hotmail text? I don't know what you're referring to, unless you mean HTML. Plain text is simply plain text, usually that generated in a text file using Notepad. No effects, no fonts, no formatting save for line breaks.

Back to work. No, really. :)
Mandolin - [weird_web@hotmail.com]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 01:13:52 PM
IP: ch164-10.apgea.army.mil

Aaron wanders in, shoots DC with an imploder slug, reducing him to greasy microdot.

Yesterday, I bought a pair of leather pants. Combined with my coat, I can now be clothed from head to foot in the skin of a dead cow. I think I'll wear them to the big "family" gettogether at Christmas.

Reverend Atilla> Thank you. Actually, I *wish* I was more like Brooklyn. (Aaron opens a can if albacore tuna, and sets it in front of the reverend) It's funny you should say that about the tattoo, because in one of Jubilee(the G2K con head)'s fics, Brook *does* end up with one a lot like mine, courtesy of Alex's magic.

Angie> Was going to say something different, but Jenna's right. Let's calm down. We can all get along. Jenna, BTW, knows from what she speaks. She and I have diametrically opposed opinions of Thailog, but we get along very well.

Jenna> You can see me as Koz? Awwwww. I feel all warm inside now. Thanks. :) As for Blair Witch, it did creep me out seriously, but it wasn't the scariest thing I'd ever seen. Maybe I should have gone to a later showing, with less people around.

Warpmind> Something from Queen, huh? How 'bout Another One Bites the Dust? And I resemble, I mean, resent that remark. Some of my best friends in high school were weird kids in trenchcoats.

Geez, I've been compared to Brook and Koz today. I'd better go before I get an ego.

Later.


Aaron - [JCarnage@Yahoo.com]
San Antonio, TX, USA
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 01:08:01 PM
IP: ppp-28.tnt-1.sat.smartworld.net

To everyone going back to school good look and try to have fun oh bit of advice save all papers you do I have turned old highschool papers to college prof and papers for one course can work in another. hehehe


Pistoff> Whoa I don’t think Angie was attacking you calm down. As for Brooklyn being ugly well love and beauty are in the eye of the Beholder (and boy are they hard to fight). As for being Selfish yea he is or was. The trio was or is your typical gang of guys. One sensitive, but Naive; one Cool but selfish or self centered, and one nerd.

We interrupt this message for a message
Reverend Attila> Odd task (the illegitimate brother of odd job and Random Task has just handed me a letter from Mr. Bigglesworth. Ehm Meow meow meeeooowww meoooowwww meow mmmmmmeow. Sorry for the interruption now back to your regular message already in progress

As for favorite Gargs. Goliath is cool, but he is an authority figure. The Trio would be great to hang out with and would be the ones I would like to party with, but everyone forgot about one character. What about Bronx he has done his share of saving the city and the other Gargoyles. We of the Canine persuasion do are share but do we get the spot light NO “sniffle whine” we are just neglected in the corner forgotten ignored sigh
Arrrrrrroooooooooo the howl is picked up in cartoons all around the world from Gargoyles to Reboot from Johnny Quest to even Scooby Doo.

ironwolf
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 01:00:38 PM
IP: host-209-214-41-36.cha.bellsouth.net

Ok just a few thing to say. First of all girls don't fight.I thought Warpmind and I were setting a good example.[Although we weren't saying so at the time] that fighting isn't good.Nobody hates brooklyn, I haven't seen any Brooklyn haters websites[Hanson yes,Spice girls yes, brooklyn not yet anyway]. We are supposed to all be friends here , as gargoyle fans we are supposed to stick together [although I don't know how many of us have actuallf seen each other]. And fighting over gargoyles characters is not good either. Goliath is not a stiff [Serious yes stiff no, and I already listed some reasons why he is that way] , someone already said Owen but he is a good example of a stiff [never smiles, monotonus voice].and brooklyn is not scrawny[although I think he walks that thin line between muscular and scrawny he's in between].I hope that settled it. And speaking of brook' Someone already mentioned Angela and Gabriel , I myself noticed that they looked like they were pretty close.But was this room here when Brooklyn was chasing Maggie around[The cage, Metamorphosis].He saw here for about five seconds and he knew that she needed his "help".At the end of the episode he said "she dosen't want my help , she dosen't want me". And in that episode the only way she talked to him was in fear or in anger. And after she zapped him in the metemorphosis episode, he was still after her again in the cage . This only proves the point that Brooklyn is after a phisical attraction and not the person. I am glad Angela is with Broadway.
I have one more [fanfic]quesion for you guys,what exactly is Hotmail text . I am registered with hotmail as you can see but I haven't found any typing files, where are they? And they said that using this can cause problems, What sort of problems? And what is plain text ? Maybe I should have read the rules more carefully. Thanks to all of the people that are putting up with this and are helping me. And I know , that was three questions.
traveler - [Goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 12:58:47 PM
IP: proxy-443.public.paix.webtv.net

Heather: Good luck. Frankly, I doubt it will be hard on you more than maybe the first few days... but I could be wrong. Hey, and don't talk to strange kids in black trenchcoats ;)

Gotta go, got work to do (and an update on the Joyride - yet again - to upload).
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 12:33:45 PM
IP: mp-217-238-166.daxnet.no

Gyre - Titania wasn't able to help Elisa directly because of Oberon's law. She did help Elisa by influencing Demona, which actually helped Elisa and the clan in two ways - both in curing Elisa and in forcing Demona to consider that Elisa was the clan's ally and probably vital to the clan's survival.

Titania's actions could be seen not so much as resurrecting the Cold duo (mortals) as granting her grandson's wish (Alex is immortal as well as being her grandson).

I'm not sure you really understand how Oberon's law works. It isn't that fey like Titania don't want to help mortals directly. Oberon's law makes it physically impossible. So they often come up with some roundabout way of going at it (as Titania did by affecting Demona's decision) or they look at the situation in a different way (I'm rewarding my darling grandson for his cleverness and my demonstration of this magic resurrection spell will be educational for him).

Now I have to catch up on the rest of the CR.
Jenniren
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 10:34:33 AM
IP: user-2ivf7su.dialup.mindspring.com

**looks at her e-mail and blushes** Oops! I have Beast Wars RP on the brain lately. I use that over in the S8 Transformers. **looks away and walks out of the comment room embarresed.
Sory for the second post!
Heather - [kheetor84@aol.com]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 10:24:10 AM
IP: 98ce78f5.ipt.aol.com

**walks in feeling all sad that she didn't see Robby yesterday.**
I know that school starts today for Robby. School starts tomorrow for me. I'm nervous...my first year of high school. I can hear the senior calling me "fresh meat" now. **sweatdrops** Oii....
I just felt like telling someone this. **sighs sadly**
Heather - [Maximal - Red Fox]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 10:21:55 AM
IP: 98ce78f5.ipt.aol.com

Something has been bothering me since "Dargest Hour", and that is how in stride Elisa, and Goliath seem to be taking the fact that Titania gambled with Elisa's life when she refused to heal Elisa. Am I the only one who finds this strange? Let's be realistic, Elisa, and Goliath have got to be at least be resentful that aid was refused them, yet Titania conviently forgot the law that cannot be broken in regargs to the cold dual when they protected her grandson. So what could flow from this? I think that at some point Titania will need Elisa, and Goliath's help, and find that help is not so forthcoming. In fact it is possible that Elisa might tell Titania to gamble with her own life for a change.
Gyre - [wseeley@epix.net]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 10:13:34 AM
IP: fltg3-ppp17.fltg.net

Hmmm--never tried this combo before-- I'll see how it looks

Hmm-- looks like there is a disagreement about fanfics--I hate to say it guys, but I do notice a awful lot of quarreling in here-- or is it just me?

Pistoff and Angie- take a deep breath guys, threatening to "gnaw off someones's skull" solves nothing. And no I don't mean to get in the middle, or throw fat into the fire.

Pistoff-- liked your points about POV- (ack! no pun intended) Well, said and well thought out. Must say, I have enjoyed your writings about Demona- and I do like Koz--since I met Aaron ( at G99) I kind of see him in the role.

Angie- well, I have encountered the same thing. You have one opinion about a character or such , and some one else has a totally diff. idea. There is alot of stuff out there that I disagree with, like the portrayal of characters, or the content. I won't mention specifics. It really started to get to me after a while, so I decided to alleviate my frustration in several ways.

1) I started writing my own fanfics--ok, I have only one out so far, but at least it's better than none! j/k I found that as a writer, I had a lot of power to show the character in how I should feel they should be shown, and 100% control over content matter.
2) started my own page--granted it too, is in the hatchling stages--but I can't tell you what a relief it was to my creative frustration. Now I could show what I wanted.
3) Connect with like minds. You find a story you like that portrays a character you like- em them. Work on a story together. Em artists and say you like there stuff.
4)And finally- if you don't like some author's or artist's stuff for what ever reason, avoid it. There is one author (who I won't name and who isn't here) whose stuff I really disliked--very strongly due to some of the content matter. I used my disgust in two ways- to spur my own creative energies into creating something I was happy with, and as a model of what not to do.

I hope my ramble here didn't upset anyone furter, if so, that was not my intention.

Aaron--Hey there!@ :P You didn't think Blair was the scariest thing you've ever seen-- well, I saw it before all the media hype, so maybe that makes a differance. Glad that the movie is doing so well, though. Refreshing to think someone besides Hollywood can make a good flick.





Jenna again - [theamazingjenna@hotmail.com]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 09:58:53 AM
IP: unknown-31-157.glm.com

Hmmmm--I must say I agree with Steve on this subject of Angela / Brook-- Greg did decide that Broadway was the one who could really focus on her. I think Brooklyn really liked the idea of being in love, but the idea and the reality are differnt. Would it have mattered to him if it was Angela or some other female garg--I don't think so, and no offense to this swashbuckling character. The idea of love was more persasuve to Brooklyn than anything else. I think a lot of teenagers go through that type of thing. But with love, real love, it matters like hell who the person is. So Broadway was the most logical choice.
Lex, was seen as too young. And in a sense he was at that time.

As for the big guy getting the gal-- yeah, I liked that too.
Jenna
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 09:25:51 AM
IP: unknown-31-157.glm.com

Oh, geez... what a night. Slept right thru my alarm only to wake up five minutes before I had to leave for work. But since I'm a summer hire, I don't have to go to the ISO 9000 presentation - yay! Before I get to replies, a short semi-rant.

I received a very interesting piece of mail from the IRS last night - a reminder that I "still" owed them about $500 of taxes for 1998. Number one: this was the first I'd heard of this. Number two: my stepdad and I went through the tax form twice, and we couldn't figure out what was missing. So we called the 800 number, went through all the prompts, and after 20 minutes on hold talked to a human being. The guy pulled up my file, flipped through it... and it turned out we'd been right all along. Some dumbass had accidentally taken $3000 off my standard deduction. Probably a keystroke error. So we got the guy's name and badge #, and he promised he'd get things straightened out.

You know, whoever screwed with my file was an idiot, but I've got to hand it to the agents who get the dirty job of answering phones down there. After tons of people complaining about their taxes, I don't know how this guy managed to be as polite as he was. I'd be throwing things by that time of the evening.

Now to replies.

Coyote> <<I swear upon this stack of Bibles that I *will* post Team Bravo tomorrow night!>> Don't worry about it. From someone who's very behind on TGS and fanfic writing, I know where you're coming from. :)

Angie> You hate Brooklyn because of other fic writers' fascination with him taking the focus off Goliath? Don't you think you're taking this a bit too far? In the case of fanfic, just don't read the fics that don't focus on your fave characters. You're not being forced to. And even if you don't agree with someone's characterization of the character, don't bash them in a public forum. If it really bothers you, e-mail them and tell them how you feel - but make it constructive criticism. Look, there are a lot of fanfics out there that treat characters in ways that I don't agree with at all. But I'm not about to go pointing fingers or flaming their authors - I generally just avoid reading what I don't like. <<In fact, they probably wouldn't have lived very long(if they would have been awakened at all) if Goliath didn't decide to be put under the stone sleep spell. >> Heh, probably true... read Christine's "What Might Have Been" if you haven't already; it deals with what might have happened if he didn't decide to join them. It's not as bleak an alternate future as you envisioned, but it shows just how pivotal that decision was.

Paul> <<I was very unamused by seeing Christine Morgan higher up on the 'Favorite Author List' than Jewel Faulkner>> *sigh* Paul, this was a general fan poll, ruled by a majority vote. So the majority of people who voted didn't agree with you, so what? You can't change everyone's minds. **sarcastically** Besides, I'm also very unamused that I didn't make the poll at all, but do you hear me complaining?

**pause as everyone stares at Mandi**

I'm kidding. Really. If I had made the poll, I'd have fainted from the shock. :)

Jewel> "Lightning Crashes" is posted? Yes!!!

Batya> <<I really need to start coming back here more often...>> Hear, hear! No, wait, where are you going... come back! Darn.

Today, I just received indisputable proof that I have the damned best job I could have gotten this summer... since most of the program is going to be TDY for the next week or so, at 11:30 everyone is going out to Flying Point Park for a pizza party to thank me and the other two summer hires here for what we've done. **disbelieving pause** I almost had a heart attack when I found that out.

Either way, I have got to get that historical background done... until the next time I have a free moment...
Mandolin - [weird_web@hotmail.com]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 09:20:05 AM
IP: ch164-10.apgea.army.mil

High charges for net time, so this will be brief.

Reverend Attilla: Same rules apply to you as to the other Joyriders; please e-mail me a description (picture preferrable, not vital) of yourself. Welcome aboard.
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 08:28:31 AM
IP: mp-217-242-74.daxnet.no

Hi all!!

Traveler:did anyone look really close at the gargoyles episode Sanctuary ? In the first five minutes you can see that it appears to be Margot Yale walking the streets of Paris. Just see for yourselves. she's shown for about three seconds ,but that just enough time to recognize her.>>I remember seeing her,she also turns up in the ep "Monsters" as well(on the tour boat but for some reason she has a different voice).

Traveler again:Gargoyles don't age while they sleep, and humans do. So Goliath will greatly out live his beloved[ and don't sue me for this , but those of you that wrote fanfics with the two of them having human children he would outlive them too].I feel sorry for him.>>I agree with you,Poor guy:(

Batya/Jewel:Welcome back!

**The Joyride**
Welcome to the Joyride Rev Attila>:)

"Hmm...anybody know where we can get our hands on a severed pig's head?"

"Hmm I don't know if we can get a pigs head but will this one do?" said Xanathar as he casually handed over the severed head of one of the Backstreet Boys to Pistoff.

Where'd you get this?said Pistoff with a sly grin.

"I found him hiding in a dumpster at the back of the concert hall so I decided to have a little fun with him" said Xanathar with a shrug.

The screams from the Hanson kids in the trunk of the Cthulhu intencify."How delightful!"said Xanthar with a wicked grin and sat back listening some more.

"Hey guy's there's the mansion"said Wilek

"And it looks like we've been expected"said Warpmind"It looks like the've called out the National guard"

Up ahead the Mansion was surounded by the police and the Army,blocking the way in.

**To be Continued**

C'yas later!!
Xanathar
Melbourne, victoria, Australia
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 07:17:32 AM
IP: 203.29.192.74

Speaking of the question over who Angela's mate was to be, has anybody ever noticed that while there are a number of Gargoyles fans who wanted to have her choose Brooklyn or Gabriel for her mate, nobody (to the best of my knowledge) has ever wanted to see Angela wind up with Lexington? I wonder what makes them discriminate against poor Lex :)

Personally, I prefer the official version in the series of Angela being with Broadway. He genuinely cares about her, whereas with Brooklyn it was just physical attraction.
Todd Jensen - [merlyn@ninenet.com]
St. Louis, MO
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 07:13:09 AM
IP: 205-242-191-97.dialup-stl.primary.net

Angie: You back right the hell off, girl! No, I have not been drinking. I was simply expressing an opinion--and I did it quite a bit more calmly and rationally than you did. I don't need to be insulted by some twit just because she has a crush on a cartoon character. And as for your "And you won't make the mistake of crossing me, the ultimate Goliathite Elite warrior" comment, don't you ever threaten me again. I will gnaw on your skull with my very own teeth.
Pistoff - [pistoff@outgun.com]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 06:16:40 AM
IP: wire-27.koalas.com

Todd> <<He points one finger at Clinton, who promptly turns into a mouse. Then Madoc steps aside calmly, as Socks the Cat strolls into the Oval Office.>> <maniacal laughter>

Scott Iskow> <<BTW, on the subject of Jim Henson, anyone seen the show "Farscape" on the sci-fi channel?>> I have, and the thing ROCKS. Granted, I've seen all of one episode (why can I never find shows I like?), but I rather like it. :)

Jenniren> <<If you use a temporary spell to transform someone into something small, and then they get eaten, what would happen when they change back?>> If they're killed while they're small, then they won't ever change back, I suppose.

Christine> <<Ooh, that looks good! Even if that _is_ Johnny Depp ...>> I don't know; he did a pretty kewl job in Edward Scissorhands. But then, when I hear Danny Elfman's music, it's kind of hard for me to notice anything else...I just sort of zone out...<blink> What were we talking about? Oh, Johnny Depp. Heh...I don't know how well he'd do at portraying an actual human, since in Edward Scissorhands, he was...err...what was he? <<at least he doesn't get his jollies out of pain and torture! <evil grin> I'll have to come up with a new character for that...>> Heh heh heh...if you're ever in need of an elaborate torture, you know who to consult. >;)

Batya> Welcome back! Hope your stay away from the CR hasn't driven you too...sane. ;)

You know, the debate about Brook and Goliath has led me to wonder--how do y'all judge which characters you like and dislike? What affects your opinion of them? I have a simple criterium: whether I have fun writing for them. Any given Fey=fun. Goliath & Elisa=not fun (for me, anyhow; I'm sure it's different for others). Brook and family=fun. Arthur and company=not fun (again, for me at least). I don't know why my tastes run in these directions, but I'm twisted beyond any hope of repair anyhow.

Speaking of which...World of Darkness fans> I picked up a copy of Wraith tonight. I wonder what it says about me that I have the most fun with this one. >:)

Spike> <<I'm completely lacking in the housekeeping gene. (That's had to be a learned behavior.)>> Trust me, it is. While I haven't learned it myself, I'm certain that other people are taught how to do it; by whom, is anyone's guess...

Jewel> Welcome back! <<until next month, when I'll actually have my own apartment.>> We'll be waiting with baited breath. (Bait's what lures the newcomers in, you know.) ^_^

Coyote> <<I swear upon this stack of Bibles that I *will* post Team Bravo tomorrow night!>> Given the Murphaic weirdness that has besieged this project from the very beginning, I'll be forgiving enough not to hold you to that. :)

Jaden> <<An orgy of violence huh? Yeah I guess that's true sometimes. But at least [the CR] is not a pit of pure evil right?...um right?>> Not *pure* evil, no... >:)

Warpmind> <<Well, gotta go to work, now, and maybe I'll catch that big eclipse around noon today, too.>> Ooh, an eclipse. If you detect roars and falling chips of rock, do be sure to tell us. <G> <<Humans are approaching, too.>> Good luck. I haven't met many of those, not before joining the CR anyhow, but from what I've heard, some of them can be mind-shatteringly stupid. ;P

**JOYRIDE**

[Wilek: "Extremely kewl gear. You know, if you'd like, you could probably upgrade to a more compact neural relay, something completely internal? I know a few Borg who could hook you up, no pun intended, with something like that...<grin>"]

**END**
Wilek Nereus
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 05:23:40 AM
IP: tnt-1-190-56k.portsmouth.zoomnet.net

Oops, I seem to have forget a few things. Oh I know what you're thinking. "Her again!" I just need to respond to these things I forgot to respond to.
traveler: Yes, I have noticed Margot Yale walking down the street in "Sanctuary". Hmm, I wonder where Brendan was.
Pistoff: I can't write stories very well. I'm good at thinking up stories but I'm not good at expressing them on paper. I'm not sure how to make what I'm saying interesting. I thought about writing a story in screen play style, which would probably be easier for me, but I never got around to it. As for me writing some fanfics about Goliath would even things out a bit: A BIT?!!! More like a NANO bit or even less than that. Besides it's more interesting to read other people's stories.

Well that's it folks!!!
Angie - [Goliathgirl5@yahoo.com]
USAWednesday, August 11, 1999 05:11:49 AM
IP: dial223.b1.tnt4.wa.freei.net

Pistoff: I never said I wanted everyone else to be ignored. I said I wanted Goliath to get the recognition and appretiation he so well deserves. As for "Goliath is a stiffy. Al Gore is less wooden." What in the hell are you talkin' about?! Have you been drinking? Been sippin' back on Grandpa's old cough medicine? Geez! OWEN is stiff. VOGEL is stiff. Goliath is NOT A STIFF! Sure he's not smiling, laughing, and joking almost all the time like the others. What do you expect? The guy's been through alot. He was born serious. He HAS to be serious. That's how the other characters play off of him so well. Like the almighty Greg Wiseman said: "Goliath carries the weight of the show on his shoulders... He makes the show believable." and what-not. Goliath is the pillar that keeps the show from falling apart. Without Goliath there would probably be know Gargoyles. If there was it would have probably been a kiddy show. A kiddy show with cute little Gargoyles(if Greg Wiseman stuck to his original plan). Would you have wanted that? I don't think so. So, the next time you try to make him look bad(not directed at you Pistoff), think about what I have said. Read what the Great Greg Wiseman has said about Goliath. And you won't make the mistake of crossing me, the ultimate Goliathite Elite warrior. I fight for truth and justice for you other Goliath admirers out there who are afraid to fight the War of Words. Whoa, shouldn't have had all that coffee today. This late hour is really getting to me. Well, bye folks.
Angie - [Goliathgirl5@yahoo.com]
WA, USA
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 04:57:41 AM
IP: dial223.b1.tnt4.wa.freei.net

Sorry 'bout the double post, but finally the library's internet server is functioning, and I got this rush of inspiration...

**JOYRIDE**
Warpmind looks at Xanathar.
"Hanson's at the Governor's mansion? Ain't you mixin' up a bit, now? Pistoff just loaded them into the trunk of Cthulhu here."
Xanathar blushes slightly.
"Oh, yeah. My mistake."
Jack turns his head to Pistoff, pale as an albino.
"You put Hanson in the TRUNK? Aw, rats. Well, if they mess with my tarantulas, they're gonna suffer more than originally planned..."

Loud screams emanate from the trunk. Warpmind dons a thick leather glove and starts digging around in his backpack. Cold, freezing smoke pours out of the sack.

"Sorry 'bout the smoke, everyone. I'm just digging into - aaah, heck, this is cold - the freezer at a food processing plant."
He pulls up a frozen pig head. Jack stops the car and turns around.
"How the heck did you do that?"
"Oh, right, I forgot to mention this to you earlier. My backpack isn't an ordinary backpack, it's more of a transportation device."
Wilek grins. "I'd guess it was a pocket dimension."
"Nope, but close. It's a teleportal, with the requirement of a relay device elsewhere. I've managed to set out twelve such relays around the globe, one at a food processing plant, one in an office building, one back at my folks' place, and so on. Within the buildings where the relay is, I can reach anything, as long as it is in the building somewhere. But it has a price."
"Price? How?"
Warpmind gently removes his had, revealing a cybernetic implant just above his forehead.
"The hat is not merely a part of my image, it's heavily fortified. This implant is picocircuitry wetwired to my frontal lobes, to communicate with the relays. Anyway, we were headed for the Governor's?"

Jack kicks Cthulhu into gear and the hearse rushes forth into the night.
**TO BE CONTINUED**

Oh, just a thought. I gotta change the midi on the cast page, maybe something by Queen? (We are the Champions, perhaps?)

Well, see ya. Aww, shoot. Humans are approaching, too.
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 04:04:54 AM
IP: ti24a02-0034.dialup.online.no

Hi, all.

Traveler: Glad we got that sorted out. No hard feelings on my side, either (heck, I've been yelled at before, wrongly).

Well, gotta go to work, now, and maybe I'll catch that big eclipse around noon today, too. (Actually, it's supposed to be closer to 12.30 around here.)

Well, you all be good now, y'hear? And check for Joyride update tonight.
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 02:59:00 AM
IP: mp-217-228-148.daxnet.no

Traveler: Well, Goliath is the main character, IMO, because he's the clan leader, he's the focal point of the clan. He makes the decisions and the others go along with it (for the most part, anyway). When Goliath was on the World Tour, the others were pretty much lost without him, and Brooklyn had to be forced into accepting the leadership role. Goliath is the Gargoyles equivalent of Kirk, Sheridan, Gideon, etc. etc.

As for not being sure how to write fanfic, well, there's no "right" or "wrong" way to write anything. Actually, doing fanfic is a bit easier than writing stories for publication. One thing I've noticed is that, when you're writing an original story, with the intention of publishing it in a magazine, they always tell you to stick to a single POV character throughout the whole story. Well, I've followed that format for ten years and it's gotten me nowhere. What I like about fanfic is that the rules are a bit looser, and you can experiment by using multiple POV characters, and experiment with the structure of the story. If you have a story to tell, just write it out and see what happens.

As for TGS stories, I think it's handled the same way a TV show is done. It's a project that has certain authors on the staff, and they're the ones who write the stories for TGS.
Pissy again
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 02:56:18 AM
IP: wire-1.koalas.com

ROBBY - Actually, Greg said at the Gathering in Dallas that he and the rest of the writing staff Figured out that it would be Broadway that ended up with Angela from the beginning. This was due to the fact the big guy actually _cared_ about Angela; what she felt, thought, etc.

Maybe the animators threw in a couple of "clues" that made it seem she would go for Brooklyn, but we know from Greg himself... Lex and Brook never had a chance. (Apologies to all Lex and Brooklyn fans, but for once the ABG <Atypical Big Guy> gets to have the girl... and it's about time>.)

Maintain and Check Six!
Stephen "Coldstone" Sobotka, Jr. - [scififangargoyle@yahoo.com]
Spokane, WA, USA
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 02:13:28 AM
IP: m119.ieway.com

I don't think that all of the other chracters are there to make him look good , and I never really thought of Goliath as the main character[although I wish he was].He wasn't the main character particularly because in my opinion, there were too many scenes in the show without him.And going back to the past to show what happened to demona in all those years, and the archmage[throughout almost the entire episode of avalon part two], and the episode as told by Matt Bluestone.There were too many perspectives in the show for there to actually be a main character.And as for writing fanfics, I'd be more than happy to, but I just joined the registery a week ago and I am still not clear as just how to .And can anyone tell me what the difference is between the fanfic series [TGS] and the shorter stories in the archives [writing them that is],is it just certain authors that can put stories in TGS or can everybody send one in. I know this sounds stupid to all of you guys that have been coming here ever scince this started,and I've wacthed the series scince 94,but I am still fairly new to the computer and I still need a little help getting used to it.So someone please , help!!!!!

traveler - [goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 02:12:46 AM
IP: proxy-513.public.rwc.webtv.net

Delphi: Yeah, stupid co-workers are worse than stupid customers because there's no way to escape them. You have to tolerate stupid co-workers until either their shift ends, or yours does. I've had to work with plenty of stupid employees, myself. One guy kept smacking his forehead on the beam that holds the menu board over the counter. He wasn't looking somewhere else when it happened, either--he was staring straight ahead, and didn't bother to duck when he walked under the beam. He did this six or seven times in the same afternoon. Finally he quit, and we didn't hear from him for months. Then, one afternoon, he walked in and asked the boss where his last paycheck was. He'd moved out of town and it hadn't been mailed to him. The boss asked him if he'd left a forwarding address. He gave her this Dan-Quayle-deer-caught-in-the-headlights look, and said, "How does that work?"

**rimshot**

Angie: Gargoyles has an ensemble cast. Sure, Goliath is the main character, but the others weren't created just to be ignored or to make Goliath look good. Each character deserves to be developed. As for why some people might not write about Goliath...well, he's kind of a stiffy. Al Gore is less wooden. But hey, if you're not satisfied with the number of stories about Goliath, why don't you write some of your own, and try to balance things out a little?

**JOYRIDE!**

Xanathar joins the rest of the group as they gather around Cthulhu. "I just got a line on where the Hansen twerps went! They're hiding in the Governor's mansion"

"Perfect," Wilek says. "We were just headed that direction, anyway."

"Cool! Uhh, where'd the cat come from?"

"This is Reverend Atilla," Jack says, as if this is all perfectly normal. Which, compared to what he's used to witnessing, *is* normal. "He's riding in with us. He knows some people who want to take down that twit Angela Davis."

"It appears that our mission objective is expanding to include a number of targets that were not mentioned in the briefing," Miriam says.

"It's called a 'window of opportunity.' Davis has crossed the line and needs to be taught a lesson."

"We don't necessarily have to kill her," Pistoff says with a grin. "In this case, I'd recommend psychological warfare. And nobody does that better than Jack and I."

Jack nods, thinking it over. "Hmm, yeah, I've probably forgotten more about mindf--king people than somebody like Puck could learn in a lifetime."

"Well, let's get going, then."

Everybody climbs into Cthulhu. Rev. Atilla curls up on Miriam's lap and purrs.

"Awwwww!" everybody says at the same time.

"Well," Pistoff says as the hearse roars off down the street, "got any ideas, Jack?"

Jack scratches his chin. "Several, actually. We'll need to pick up a few things."

"Such as?"

"Some condoms, a couple of eggs, and a broomstick." Jack grins. "Actually, the ol' shaving-cream-can bomb is a good one."

"Anything else?"

"Hmm...anybody know where we can get our hands on a severed pig's head?"

**END RP FOR NOW**

Paul Nathans: I almost missed this one. You said, "I was very unamused by seeing Christine Morgan higher up on the 'Favorite Author List' than Jewel Faulkner, but, ah, well." You know, I just have to wonder what your problem is. It seems you can't keep from insulting Christine. She's a damn fine writer and a wonderful person. I don't know why you insist on insulting her. Hell, you routinely insult people with just about everything you say. You have this attitude like you think you're better than everybody else, sprinkling your posts with comments such as, "Duh! Hello?! Don't you people read these stories?" and so on. Yeesh! I used to think *I* had an attitude problem. You need to be a little more tactful and refrain from pissing on people every time you say something.

To all who are returning to school already: You have my most sincere condolences.
Pistoff - [pistoff@outgun.com]
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 01:47:58 AM
IP: wire-1.koalas.com

****BEGIN RP!!!****
"At last!" The evil scientist screams. "My work is finished, now I will personally see to Jadens capture and to see that his friends suffer for helping him. All that's left for me to do is to contact this Thailog person and make an alliance." The screen fades out as he leaves his secret compound.
****END RP!!!****

OOOOOO! BAD SERVER! BAD SERVER! Teach you to quit on me when I need you!

Wilek-An orgy of violence huh? Yeah I guess that's true sometimes. But at least it's not a pit of pure evil right?...um right?

ironwolf-<The Crow> I love that show, I watch when ever I get a chance to. Your right though, I wish it would follow the story line.

Christine- Someone new who likes torture. I can't wait to read about this one.

Well, I'm off to bed.
See ya later!
Jaden - [jaden12@hotmail.com]
Los Alamos, CA
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 01:20:30 AM
IP: pm0-25.vpop1.avtel.net

Well, you're VERY welcome traveler. Most of the time I feel I have to help people realize Goliath's signifigance. Their favorite characters wouldn't be the way they are if it wasn't for Goliath. In fact, they probably wouldn't have lived very long(if they would have been awakened at all) if Goliath didn't decide to be put under the stone sleep spell. So folks, whenever you decided you want to make Goliath some sort of hot-head, hypocrytical, scheming jerk(one example:Lex Wyvern), remember what I said in the two previous sentences. Ooh and once again, sorry Brooklyn fans. So long!
Angie - [Goliathgirl5@yahoo.com]
USAWednesday, August 11, 1999 12:27:29 AM
IP: dial227.b1.tnt4.wa.freei.net

Gargoyles movie-I said it before and i'll say it again,animation would be a whole lot cheaper and alot less work . But I wonder what more people would see animation or live action/CGI.yet no mater what I know that everyone of us would see it in it's first few days of release. But of course that wouldnt be enough.
traveler - [goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 12:24:56 AM
IP: proxy-543.public.rwc.webtv.net

Here's another reason that I think goliath has suffered alot more than brooklyn and should be respected more. Love is a big issue in gargoyles.Goliath-Eliza,Broadway-Angela,and Brooklyn-Sata[although I don't think they matter as much in my point I'll just have them here anyway.Even though I read them often I don't think of the fanfics as parts of the actual story]. Even now some of you have to see what I'm getting to . Gargoyles don't age while they sleep, and humans do. So Goliath will greatly out live his beloved[ and don't sue me for this , but those of you that wrote fanfics with the two of them having human children he would outlive them too].I feel sorry for him.
traveler - [Goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Wednesday, August 11, 1999 12:19:07 AM
IP: proxy-543.public.rwc.webtv.net

Ahhh, school starts tommarrow... And I've killed the last day and a half hanging with a buddy to avoid back to school blues... Ah well, at least I have a really cool schedual this year... Creative writing, Art 4 (only art 4 student in the school. Coolness!) , English 4, Newspaper, and Independant Student Mentorship... Fun stuff.

CGI- The thing all of you are forgetting is this. Phantom Menace is still heavy on your minds, so you're thinking of that cartoony stuff when you think CGI. Don't forget the T1000 and more importantly, Draco the Dragon, were all computers and they looked perfectly real. (And lets not also forget, that with a kiss in "Ghost" the two actors never actually touched lips and it looked good...) As far as having a large cast of CGI rendered characters... Its not that difficult. Mainframe does that for all their series. Beastwars has over a dozen MAIN characters, each with two or three forms that have a lot of complexity to them. And ReBoot has episodes with litterally hundreds of different looking characters sometimes... CGI is cheap and getting easier to do all the time. If it was gonna be CGI, it would work well enough. Also keep in mind, Demona doesn't really need to be CGI, Marina Sirtis could probably do the role justice if she dyed her hair and was willing to wear the small strips of cloth Demona calls an outfit. Wings and tail could be added later by CGI.

As far as costumes... People keep referencing Turtles 2 and 3 as examples of why they shouldn't have costumes... Mind you, those costumes were on a lower budget AND they made a good 4 dozen more of them than they did in the first movie. But the costumes in part one were excellent. As were all the costumes in Television's Dinosaurs. While a bit cartoony, they looked good. I imagine gargs could be done under similar circumstances pretty well.

Jeb- There were minor cues towards Brooklyn and Angela together because at first, Greg didn't know who Angela would end up with, and it was mostly animators.

Paul Allen Nathans- You're missing the point. We're not saying there were ever any clues that Angela was in love with Brooklyn, we're saying there were a lot of clues that they were similar characters. Add to that the fact Brooklyn was the one looking for romance, and THAT made it seem as if eventually they'd develop romance. No hints of romance early on, just hints of similarity, similarity being the first key to romance. Nothing more than that, nothing less.

Wilek- The slowdown of Joyride stuff can probably be attributed to the same reason Jim Iza Noying was on an island with nothing to do for two weeks and then blown up. Ya run out of ideas after tossing everything out day after day. But I've developed a few RP ideas and will start again tonight...

Tim P- People didn't argue like this about the first Star Trek movie because it was already live action, AND well known.

Angie- Forgiven. You like Goliath for your reasons, we like Brooklyn for ours. Just don't go off insulted the beaked one again, and everything will be fine.

Traveler- Margo is always easy to spot. Its called reusing model sheets. Greg made a game out of it, which is why the yuppie couple, the Jogger, and Vinnie among other keep showing up. As to WHY Margot was in Paris is another question...

"I will not eat Broccoli." -President George Bush

**RP**

Aboard the Dark Star Two, Connection Denied grins evily. "Wow, I killed Jim Iza Noying. The only thing that could possibly save him is some sort of lame plot device..."
"It's the last thing you'll ever do." A voice booms from somewhere aboard the Dark Star.
"Wha? Who's there?" A man steps into the light, wearing a blue vest and a grey cap, and he looks for all the world like Jim Varney.
"I don't know how you got aboard the Dark Star, but you won't be leaving it!" CD sneers, and blasts a bolt of lightning at the stranger. It fades harmlessley.
"Hey Vern, its me! Earnest! Earnest P. Wirl, ELECTROMAN, at your service."
CD arcs an eyebrow as suddenly a strange device attaches to his back, and begins bathing him in an eerie blue light.
"What the?"
A hooded figure comes from nowhere, and the hologram of Earnest dissapears.
"You're about to die Connection Denied, and the Dark Star Two is about to become mine..."
Robby
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 11:51:19 PM
IP: spider-ti012.proxy.aol.com

Goliath girl, thank you for that. Goliath deserved to be number one . He isn't given enough credit on the internet. The gargoyles T.V. show was about all of them, so are the garoyle fanfics. Timedancer is a brooklyn series,Pendragon is centered on king arthur and griff ,and dark ages is all of the gargoyles characters again. Goliath dosen't have his own series ,no wonder he isn't the favorite. Well like you he is my favorite . And even though I'm not a girl I would like nothing more that to praise his acomlishments in the series.
speaking of the series , did anyone look really close at the gargoyles episode Sanctuary ? In the first five minutes you can see that it appears to be Margot Yale walking the streets of Paris. Just see for yourselves. she's shown for about three seconds ,but that just enough time to recognize her.
traveler - [goliath01hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 11:35:36 PM
IP: proxy-543.public.rwc.webtv.net

**steps into the room, swiching out the candles, then sitting in the big chair**

**sigh** Replies, replies replies ... glad I was able to defuse the situation earlier.

David G.: Interesting that you should mention the Rosicrucians in your history of the Illuminati ... interesting for me, at least, because my grandmother used to be a Rosicrucian minister.

Paul: **raises eyebrow** "Real" fanfiction? What do you consider "fake" fanfiction? (This I've gotta hear ...)

Airwalker: I certainly can't argue with that logic.

Wilek: A testament that nothing of mine is MSTieable? Oh, you flatter me too much (besides that, Mara Cordova *did* manage to find one to MSTie ... it's just that the GFW screwed it up, and she has yet to send it to me).

Famke Janssen as Jean Grey: **tries to suppress images of Jean accidentally killing Cyclops during sex, ultimately fails** Oyyyy ...

Todd, re: Madoc meets Bill Clinton: Wouldn't a more fitting punishment be cloning him and then turning him into a Monica Lewinsky look-alike, then letting the clone do whatever? :)

Batya: Yeah, ya *do* have to stop by more often. Don't be such a stranger!! That goes out to all of you lurkers out there ...

Attilla: Same with you. **strokes the Good Reverend on the head**

Angie: Whew ... is *that* the reason why you don't like Brooklyn? Heck, you'd probably like my cycle, he doesn't show up in person until about the halfway point ... then again, Goliath is old and even more brooding and Elisa is dead, so maybe you wouldn't like it ...

Speaking of my fics: **pulls out a pile of books, placing his left hand on it and raising his right** I swear upon this stack of Bibles that I *will* post Team Bravo tomorrow night!

Jewel: That "don't be a stranger" line goes for you, too.

**sigh** Y'know, 'tis been a while since we heard from Kaioto ... methinks him and Lexy are having a *hell* of a lot more fun than we are ... I know for sure more than me ...

**whimpers quietly while sitting back in the chair, watching the candle's flame once more**
Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 10:25:45 PM
IP: modem69.i-is.com

Hey, all! Sorry I don't have time to comment at all to anything on the room (or even *read* any of the comment room beyond the must cursory of glances), and I'll be pretty scarce for a while--probably until next month, when I'll actually have my own apartment. Anyway, I'm jsut posting to say that I *FINALLY* posted part six of "Apokalypsis"--"Lightning Crashes" is actually done and posted!
jewel - [Jewel.Faulkner@alumane.brynmawr.edu]
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 10:02:14 PM
IP: 207-172-73-169.s169.tnt1.man.va.dialup.rcn.com

Well, I'm sorry to any of you who I may have upsetted with my comments about Brooklyn. No, Pistoff I didn't make those comments because I want to feel better about MYself. Ya know, I never really hated Brooklyn before I came on the internet. I just thought he was alright. I didn't like him and I didn't hate him. A while ago I decided to look up Gargoyles on the net 'cause I went to every site(which wasn't very many) of my favorite actor. I discovered this Gargoyle site and TGS and decided to read some of the Timedancer Saga. The next time I went online and tried to find it again, I discovered fanfic. From there Goliath and Elisa stories. Once I ran out of those I decided to read about someth...Dang it, I hate when I do this! I need to stop blah blah blahing and get to the point. The reason I hated(well not really HATED)Brooklyn is because I felt that he was taking the spot-light from Goliath. I feel that Goliath should be in first place and have most chic have a crush on him. It was always Brooklyn this and Brooklyn that. Heck, he has a heck of alot more fanfics about him than Goliath and or Elisa or anybody else had. I found that VERY annoying. Goliath's a sweet (when he's not P-I-issed), kind, romantic, noble, loyal, true to his word kind of guy with good-looks, nice body, and sexy voice. But hardly anybody except Christine Morgan and a couple(well more than a couple, but still not enough) of other authors recognized that. I guess Brooklyn's okay but Goliath is better. Sure he has a bad temper and is stubborn but that's okay. I guess I called Brooklyn ugly and selfish and what-not to make not seem like an okay guy. Greg Wiseman was right Goliath is a prism and Brooklyn is one of the lights that shine out from him. And what is most everyone going to notice? The rainbow of colors that comes from the prism and not the prism itself.Geez I always fall for the handsome, sweet, sensitive guy who doesn't get the recognition he deserves.(like my favorite actor) Hmm, oh well. Can you find it in your hearts to forgive me, Brooklyn fans? Hmm, can ya? Well, thanks for taking the time to read my post(if you did). Bye.
Angie - [Goliathgirl5@yahoo.com]
USATuesday, August 10, 1999 09:19:33 PM
IP: dial87.b1.tnt4.wa.freei.net

Interesting Tim P
James Birdsong
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 08:31:11 PM
IP: dt049n74.san.rr.com

Goodeve everyone

Scott>> I've been watching Farscape, and I like it. Zahn (sp?) is my fav character, but maybe thats because we are kindrid spirits in someway.

Traveler>> the scene in "So Weird" was not a related to Gargoyles, it was a preformance of the play "Macbeth" by a small community theatrical group and the beast was a dragon.

The play "Macbeth" has been around for a long time. Gargoyles' writers skillfully found ways to pull such things into "THEIR" story line. That's part of what makes it attractive to us older folk.

If you want to know more about it look up "W.S. Shakespeare" The author of the play "Macbeth"
Delphi - [cmiller@magiclink.com]
Twin Falls, Idaho
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 08:26:39 PM
IP: 207.14.195.75

Of course, if the Unseelies had been taking over the world during President Bush's term, I could have had Madoc turn Bush into a bizarre half-human half-broccoli creature, a fate worse than death :)
Todd Jensen - [merlyn@ninenet.com]
St. Louis, MO
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 07:41:34 PM
IP: 205-242-93-58.dialup-stl.primary.net

Thanks for clearing that up coyote. I am sorry warpmind.
traveler - [Goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 07:24:21 PM
IP: proxy-313.public.rwc.webtv.net

Christine>> *laughs* Well, I can't program computers, change the oil in my car and I'm completely lacking in the housekeeping gene. (That's had to be a learned behavior.)

Only one more day...hooray, hooray.... only one more day until my son goes back to school!!
Spike
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 07:22:07 PM
IP: bart.airmail.net

RP WARNING!!
**Santa Cruz, California
Reverend Attila has been flying through the air thanks to Kato, but he finally lands in Santa Cruz near Cthuhulu. Attila goes up to warpmind and Jack Hammer and asks to join them. he also offers some contacts who also plot the downfall of SSR Santa Cruz and Angela Davis.**

Hello everyone

Robby, Xanthar, Lady Ariana> Happy Birthday

SOROW> You like guy's pics, huh? Click on my name for a recent pic of GB at the Gathering. Actually, any ladies who want to read the story are encouraged to view the pic so they can get a good idea of what Verdant looks like :)

Fleur> That is awful. You need some noozlies ::noozle, purrrrr::

Mary Flanders> I want to see this teaser and so does GB :)

Angie> Appearance is subjective. If you think Brooklyn is ugly, that's a matter of opinion. I doubt Mara shares Rapture's view of Goliath, though, and she is a definite Brooklyn fan. "The Death of Brooklyn" really cheesed her off.

Brooklyn> I guess the tall, thin, bad boy can appeal to many girls, but personally I wish more women went for the cute, clean-shaven, cat-loving, conservative, three-piece suit type, like GB :) wait a minute, I forgot about the Owenite nuns :)

Aaron> You may be like in Brooklyn in many rspects, but I doubt he'd ever get a tatoo of Demona anywhere on his body :)

Batya> <<I really need to start coming back here more often.... >>
Yep, you sure do ;)

Todd> LOL!! Socks should eat Slick Willy, but I see Clinton as someone who has Unseelie support. He's too crafty not to have some Unseelie backing, but that may apply to a lot of Southern politicians :)

Besides, Bill would just blame the Unseelie mess on the Republican House :)

Delphi> The real problem is when they keep making the mistakes like that.

Paul Allen Nathans> I have a few things to say to you, sonny!!
<<If there was a GARGOYLES Movie canon with the Series, why would it even bother with the Elisa/Goliath Relationship? Its not exactly important to the story." / "Their relationship isn't that important to the GARGOYLES Story>>

I dare you to tell that to Greg Weisman. It's a wonderful romantic theme touching on boundaries of race, culture, and age (to some extent). It is also a definite factor that was appearant from the beginning, and can you blame Goliath? If Elisa were a cat and I wasn't a eunech, she'd have a litter of future clergy :)

<<I was very unamused by seeing Christine Morgan higher up on the 'Favorite Author List' than Jewel Faulkner, >> Christine Morgan and Jewel Faulkner are both good e-mail buddies of GB and I happen to like both fanfic writers very much, though I don't see why you should be so upset about Christine doing better among voters, unless this is form some grudge you have against her.

David G.> Very impressive list of activities, though it seems you think the Illuminati to be a Religious Group as well as a Society.

SOROW> <<It's 100 degrees in Texas here and 60 degrees in the school. I HATE that! >> GB would rather a school be the same temperature inside as it is outside than have that great an extreme in differences. He belives the difference in temp with buildings should be no greater than 15 degrees either way.

Spacebabie> Welcome to the CR. I am the official cuddle-cat of the TGS CR :)

Glimmer> Welcome back.

Jame Birdsong> <<As long as one of the sequels is based on City of Stone I'll be happy. Man that would look cool in live action. hehe>>

Damn skippy!! :)

Now I'm off. Meow!! Good bye

Reverend Attila - [revattila@garfield.catsrule.com]
New Orleans, Louisiana
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 06:02:06 PM
IP: 141.164.64.54

James Birdsong: <<It's so obvious what could be done. Just take Awakening the video into the movie. No additional stuff need be done. The episodes are already though.>> Sorry, can't be done. All marketing problems aside, there are at lest several production problems.

Animation: Although the animation was great by television standards, it's extremly substandard compared to features.

Sound mixing and editing: Taking the sound from a show meant for the stereo on TV isn't going to work very well in a Theater. If you watch a movie in a theater and then watch it at home on your TV you'll hear the difference. Sound is so important for a movie that many people buy surround sound speakers for their homes. If you've have ever seen SAVING PRIVATE RYAN in a well equipped theater, you'll know what I'm talking about. You could *hear* the shells whizzing by your head. The sound mixing and editing in SPR was so well done, that they put out a 1-800 number in case vetrans started to have shell shock. Trust me, I've seen it happen.

Screen format: The view on the TV screen is alot narrower than on a theater screen. When movies are formatted for TV, A lot of the frame is cut off by a procces known as pan and scan. Some movies on tape are often presented as Widescreen Format so it appears as you'd see it in a theater.

I'd still like to see the movie take up where "The Journey" left off. The series needs to go on. I'm sure that there were people arguing like we are about the first STAR TREK movie.
Tim P.
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 05:59:48 PM
IP: s4-onawa.pionet.net

Longer post later, but before anything grows that we won't like out of this little disagreement, I scanned over the room. Traveler, the gentleman who said "that has to be one of the ten stupidest people on Earth" was Xanathar, addressing Warpmind about something completely unrelated. This is an independent observer's reaction. Please take it as it is, but neither yourself nor Warpmind are at fault here. 'Tis only a misunderstanding.
Coyote the Peacemaking Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 05:58:51 PM
IP: modem69.i-is.com

you wrote that "that has to be one of the ten stupidest people on the planet" when I suggested n'sync and the disney executives for your joyride . you wrote that before commenting on what I wrote . If you weren't talking to me then who were you talking to . I am new to this comment room , and if that wasn't you who said that or you were talking to someone else I am sorry . I made a mistake then.
Traveler - [goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 05:44:00 PM
IP: proxy-353.public.rwc.webtv.net

Sorrow:I'm a 1995 graduate, man that year was blast..also g 1994-1995 Gargoyles premiered.My brother however is in his senior year, but look it at this way sorrow your class will be the first graduating class of the new millenium 2001

I have an interesting question is there a B.E.B? Brooklynn Estrogen Brigade? If there is I want to join.
Spacebabie - [Spacebabie76@yahoo.com]
Orlando, Fl, USZ
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 05:43:28 PM
IP: ts003d38.orl-fl.concentric.net

Hi, y'all. Just checking in (and probably no Joyride tonight either... we seem burnt out of ideas, for some reason. And here I was led to believe that man's greatest creativity is related to the infliction of pain) with a response or two.

traveler: In one word: QUE??????? May I please be let in on what you're accusing me of now? You wrote *what* before going to my site? If I have offended you greatly, it has been utterly unintentional and unconciously, but if that is the case, I'd like to know my sin before apologizing. However, if you let me know what harm I've done you, the odds of apology are vastly present.

David G: Well, didn't find you this search either... but I did find some library with yet unwritten books in it. I even found a book with my name on it, along with a couple others on a shelf labeled "historical fiction". For some reason, the book "Paladin Evermore" was placed next to the book "Battle of the sexes", as said, in "Historical Fiction". I dared not call for the librarian, I just found the shortest way back. Oh, and great piece on the Illuminati, by the way.

Xanathar: Oh, yeah, Top Ten Stupidity League... with VERY few runner-ups. Too bad I didn't get his name, we'd invite him to the Joyride, eh?

Mary Flanders: Trust me, I know how tempting it is to show your siblings the business end of... something with a business end. However, we of the Joyride to not condone domestic violence. At least, to my knowledge we don't.

Well, later, everyone.

**Blasts a few holes in DC at point-blank range with a gnawed-off shotgun.**
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 05:11:28 PM
IP: mp-217-239-89.daxnet.no

Travler- true FT was all a dream by Puck, but Puck had to make it believable enough, so that Goliath would think it was reality. And in the canon eps, puck never did clear up-"oh, but was it a dream? Or a prophesy?"
Jenna
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 04:46:22 PM
IP: unknown-31-157.glm.com

Of course brooklin beefed up in future tense . he had to . there was a war going on. If goliath was involved he probaly would have gotton bigger as well. And anyway , future tense was all Goliath's dream[Puck's mirage].
traveler - [Goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 04:39:15 PM
IP: proxy-353.public.rwc.webtv.net

Spacebabie> What year are you?

Christine> I've seen that preview! I'm glad that it's going to be dark and sinister instead of the crap Disney throws out!

Aaron> Yes! That's the ep... I'll never get over that song! And great job on the Brooklyn support group ;)

Doug> Thanks for the luck! I can't wait til senior year and it's only the second day of school...
SOROW
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 04:29:44 PM
IP: usr11-dialup41.mix1.irving.cw.net

Poor Brooklyn-- just can't win with some of ya, huh?
Granted he is scrawny in the canon eps-- but what adolescent male isn't? And in Future Tense he really beefed up. As for the beak-- very striking. Remember Beth's words in "cloud fathers" :There kind of beautiful, but so alien.

After a while, all you notice is the beauty.


Jenna
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 03:49:47 PM
IP: unknown-31-157.glm.com

See if I ever go on your site again warpmind. It was just a suggestion. I wrote that before going on your site . You don't have to be such an @$$.
traveler - [Goliath01]
hobart, IN, usa
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 03:28:26 PM
IP: proxy-313.public.rwc.webtv.net

*stumbles into the comment room looking a little dazed* I just heard the song "David Duchovny, Why Won't You Love Me" on the radio. Brain has crashed. Must reboot.

*puts on some nice soothing Paul Simon to restore calm*

I really need to start coming back here more often....
Batya the Toon
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 02:26:27 PM
IP: s24h160.lab.qc.edu

Ash > Ichabod Crane? Naaahhh ... but that reminds me, has anyone else seen previews for Sleepy Hollow? Ooh, that looks good! Even if that _is_ Johnny Depp ...

Wilek > hey, Jericho may be evil, he may be bad (_may_ be???), but at least he doesn't get his jollies out of pain and torture! <evil grin> I'll have to come up with a new character for that ...

Christine - [vecna@eskimo.com]
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 01:54:29 PM
IP: vecna.ndip.eskimo.net

SOROW, Mary Flanders> Right on! Brook's got that whole bad boy thing goin' on, kinda like Travolta in Grease, but cooler (And better looking) As for Brooklyn being scrawny.. He hasn't finished growing yet, people! Vid Future Tense! Brook grows into somebody who can knock Goliath on his kiester!

SOROW again> The "Tried to kill me with a forklift" song is from Wolf Raiders of Valnastar, which was a bunch of episodes from cheesy japanese tv show strung together to make a movie.

Later.

Aaron exits, whistling Pat Benetar's "Shadows of the Night"


Aaron - [JCarnage@Yahoo.com]
San Antonio, TX, USA
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 01:03:03 PM
IP: ppp-7.tnt-1.sat.smartworld.net

David G. - Nice profile of the Illuminati. I appreciate your taking the time to research and post it.

Todd - I like the Socks the cat idea. One thing I've always wondered - If you use a temporary spell to transform someone into something small, and then they get eaten, what would happen when they change back? O_o Maybe this is a good punishment for DC.

OK I'm leaving.

Jenniren
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 11:43:14 AM
IP: user-2ivf7oi.dialup.mindspring.com

Scott Iskow> I seen Farscape. Gargoyles movie> It's so obvious what could be done. Just take Awakening the video into the movie. No additional stuff need be done. The episodes are already though
James Birdsong - [LennexMacDuff@yahoo.com]
San Diego, CA, USA
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 11:18:17 AM
IP: dt049n74.san.rr.com

X-MEN MOVIE NEWS - Famke Janssen who played Xenia Onatopp in the James Bond movie GoldenEye has been cast as Jean Grey.


ENTITY - You wrote: [ The movie *will* contradict the continuity of the series, I'm afraid there's no getting around that. The movie will nutshell as much as possible. It will also bring to the forefront the plotlines required for a theatrical movie appeal (at least what Hollywood says is requird) while taking perhaps some of the plotlines that were more prominant in "Awakenings" and making them background plots (the ones I'm thinking of here are the ones that were principle for setting the stage for the series, which was the primary purpose of "Awakenings" but which will not be of the movie).]

This is all true. However, I hope that they don't stray too far away from the basic plot of Gargoyles. I feel for example that while they might not have much more of a plot than being minor background supporting characters in this movie, Hudson and the Trio should appear instead of perhaps having Goliath and Demona be the only survivors of the Wyvern Massacure. And while they will expand the Goliath/Elisa relationship in this movie and move it along fast for a movie audience, I hope that at the same time they don't sacrifice other important ideas in order to make Goliath more of the hero and less of a realistic character with his own flaws. I'm worried that if they did do a sort of AWAKENINGS redo that they might cut out all mention of the rookery and of Goliath asking to be put under a spell. After all having your hero abandon his children and commit suicide in the first part of the movie doesn't exactly reflect well on him. That should be left in at all costs. Not only does it lead to greater drama and the possibility of a sequel later on, it makes Goliath into a real character instead of just some cartoon hero like Superman who can do no wrong.

You wrote: [Sure they may be able to create a believable rendering of one gargoyles, but what about two...or three...or four? Since every garg looks different, they'd all gave to be created on by one.]

The Gargoyles are already designed. Even the background characters who don't have to appear that much. We've seen the beginning of AWAKENINGS. There are plenty of characters that can easily be downloaded into a computer, made to look realistic and put in the background.

Only the main characters, the big seven of Goliath, Hudson, The Trio, Bronx, and Demona (it could be eight if Coldstone is worked into the plot) have to be done in detail. And of those only on Goliath and Demona is absolute superb detail necessary since they are the two main Gargoyles characters from the seven. Hudson, The Trio, and Bronx can be done well but since they aren't going to get that much screentime they don't have to be done as well as the work done of a CGI Goliath.

You wrote: [But if they don't use CGI, then the film will
bomb. TMNT costumes worked ten, even five years ago... but not now, and certainly not in 3-4 years from now.]

I have to agree. It's one thing if they are working with Fey like Puck or Titania. Then CGI really isn't that necessary outside of when they are floating around or doing magic. But with Gargoyles, putting actors in suits is just going to make them look silly. The first TMNT movie got it right but afterwards the other 2 movies completely messed up. And the only reason that they didn't use CGI in the first TMNT movie instead of costumes is that it wasn't such a big thing them. If they would have had it, they would have used it.
Airwalker
Brooklyn, NY
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 10:40:07 AM
IP: 32.new-york-11-12rs.ny.dial-access.att.net

Movie > I think the best way to do gargoyles in the movie would be with costumes... but the wings should be CGI. ILM or Jim Henson Workshop would be the best for the job.

BTW, on the subject of Jim Henson, anyone seen the show "Farscape" on the sci-fi channel?

Scott Iskow - [smiskow@wam.umd.edu]
Gaithersburg, Maryland
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 09:31:36 AM
IP: 156.40.117.111

Crud! I used the wrong colour,definetly time to go to bed.
Xanathar
Melbourne, victoria, Australia
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 08:34:52 AM
IP: 203.29.192.74

Hi all!!

Warpmind:That guy has to be one of the top ten stupidist people on the planet.

Traveler:How would you do it. A quick gunshot to the head or a very slow and painful torture [cuting off their ears so they can't here us when we enter the room] . O should we just tie them all to a wheelbaro and throw it off a cliff [but make it small enough so that they would be alive when the vultures come.
And you can add N'sync and all of the disney executives to the backstreet boys, hanson , and Dean Devlin.>>The Joyriders always opt for slow and painful torture,it's more fun>:),and your requests to rid the world of N'sync and the Disney executives have been noted.:)

Glimmer:Welcome back!

Aaron:No way! SPG is smarter and more loyal the Jerico.>>I right I didn't think about that,I retract my earlier statement and apologise if I offended anyone.

DavidG:Loved the Illuminati piece.

Brooklyn:I don't think Brooklyn's ugly because I don't think Gargoyles are ugly,I'm not put off in the slightest by Beak's,wings or any other Gargoyle traits and I've never understood why when I show my tapes to people that they say"why do you watch this? those things are ugly!"and words to that effect,I've always thought Gargoyles are a facinating and beutiful race*IMO*BTW I'm most definately in the Demona Testosterone Legion;)

I'd love to write up a piece for the Joyride tonight but it's getting late and I have to be up for work in the morning goodnight all!!
Xanathar
Melbourne, victoria, Australia
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 08:32:17 AM
IP: 203.29.192.74

ANOTHER BIZARRE LITTLE CREATIVITY DEMON FOR "HOW 'THE DARKEST HOUR' COULD HAVE GONE":

In this version, the Unseelie Court decides to go for a more open attack upon the planet a la your conventional alien invasion scenario, with Unseelies striking at major cities, military bases, and other strategic points all over the world to cripple humanity. The big scene takes place in the Oval Office at the White House, as follows.

Bill Clinton is frantically trying to appear calm as he sits in the Oval Office preparing to give a live televised address to the nation to reassure it that everything's under control (coming at a point when the Unseelies have already reduced half the major cities in the U.S. to rubble, taken out most of the military, and are even presently demolishing whatever famous Washington landmarks you can see from out the windows of the Oval Office). In the middle of preparations, however, the doors to the Oval Office suddenly cave in and Madoc calmly walks in, a number of petrified (as in turned to stone) Secret Service agents cluttering the corridor behind him. The President tries to protest this, but one glower from Madoc quickly quells him and he sinks back into his seat, trembling. "Are you going to zap me?" he asks.

"No," replies Madoc. "You are far too pathetic for me to destroy you myself. Instead - "

He points one finger at Clinton, who promptly turns into a mouse. Then Madoc steps aside calmly, as Socks the Cat strolls into the Oval Office.

THE MOVIE - I agree that you have to do something with Goliath and Elisa in it. Maybe not much (after all, it took 65 episodes to get to the point where they have their first kiss), but it's too integral to the story to not be there.

As for whether it should be CGI or costumes, I'd probably go with CGI, although I don't have enough experience with that concept to know how well it would work.
Todd Jensen - [merlyn@ninenet.com]
St. Louis, MO
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 08:03:45 AM
IP: 205-242-191-106.dialup-stl.primary.net

I just heard from my brother that the disney show "So Weird" did this cheezy re-enactment of the Demona-Macbeth imortalization scene from "city of stone". I don't know if this is true or not but he said that the female gargoyle was bald and the weird sisters were plain old witches [black hats, brooms]. They even called them the weird sisters in the show. All this was a play that someone had conjoured up that sound very much like it came from our show. This was for the wicthcraft episode. I've never watched the show myself , but if this is true I say we kick some @$$.
traveler - [Goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 04:22:54 AM
IP: proxy-563.public.rwc.webtv.net

Pistoff: Yeah, right. Like I'm gonna try to back off when I finally find a dame with sufficient weirdness in her life to have the possibility of tolerating me! **Draws an aerosol can.** I challenge you to a joust! **Thinks for a moment.** Wait a sec... uh... have we found her yet? Naah. **Puts the spray back into his backpack.** Oh, and the stupid customer: Even I still have problems believing that even happened. Of course, I was sitting there with a running tape recorder at the very moment, so... hard to dispel such evidence (even though it's legally inadmissible in court). Naturally, such events cannot be solely blamed on stupidity, the guy obviously had some sort of reality perception problem, too.

Well, gotta go to work soon, library, y'know, I'll catch you later tody. Oh, and David G.: I'll be looking for you (but with my luck I'll wind up in Mesopotamia or something).

Later.
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 03:39:22 AM
IP: mp-217-239-55.daxnet.no

**RP!**

[In the Avatar's video arcade, Wilek is grinning smugly. "I *told* you it'd be a good idea to add this." Agent Rho: "The off-duty personnel seem to enjoy it. Still, nothing beats a good game of sabacc, if you ask me." Wilek: "I wouldn't know; I'm bad with card games..."]

**END RP!**

Theresa> Ack, sounds like you had a rough night. At least you were able to chase off the idiots. :)

$Xanathar> <<Fellow Joyriders I vote that we hunt down Dean Devlin after we're done with the Backstreet Boys and Hanson>:)>> AYE! For even attempting to sully Our Show, Devlin will *suffer*. Muhahahaha!$

Mandolin> <<I'd be glad to try to MiST your stuff... after I get "Apocalypse" finished and find something MiSTiable of Coyote's, that is. :)>> Thanks! No hurry. :) Heh...it's probably a testament to Coyote's writing that none of his stuff is bad enough to MST. ^_^

Mary Flanders> Thanks for the link. :) Hm...is this the advanced tutorial...? Or am I really so pathetic that I can't even do the first step? :}

$I notice that there wasn't as much RP/Joyride/whatever as usual for the past few nights. Looks like I'm not the only one who seems to be creatively drained of late. Odd, that. Almost like something's affecting us all...Is there any way I can possibly blame Mr. Disconnect for this...? <G>$

Warpmind> $<<Xanathar, Wilek and Pistoff: If you guys could please make sure to file all the Joyride clippings from Thursday onward, I'd be much obliged>> Sure thing. (I hope I remember it...o_o' Just to expose you to my raging stupidity, I momentarily thought you meant *last* Thursday. <bangs head against nearest cement wall>)$ <<He comes in, walking like he owns the world, then sets his eyes on me, the only person behind the counter, looks around at the bookshelves and asks "Do you lend out books here?">> :O People like this are the reason that we will someday be replaced with cockroaches. <sigh>

Glimmer> <<Somebody please inflict a mass amount of bodily harm to DC for me!! The few times I was able to make it into the room Mr. DC ate my posts which included my votes. And I'll probably have trouble getting into the room until Octoberish. Sporadic visits at best.>> Ack. The requested DC death will arrive at the end of this post, and my condolences regarding your troubles getting into the CR. <<Umm... that link from last week (Sat.?) isn't a Brooklyn action figure. That's one of the Gargoyle costumes from Disney On Ice.>> <gasp> Oh My Gawd. IT WAS THAT REALISTIC?!! Woah...maybe there could be costume/animatronic gargs in the movie after all if a dinky ice theater costume was that good!

Jenniren> <<Is DC any kin to HC (Mr. Hung Connection)? He's been bothering me all day.>> I do believe they're one and the same. :)

JEB> <<They could also make it possible for the same head to be used in each of the Coyotes, and you could attach that little anti-grav thingy to it too...>> That sounds so kewl! Why didn't I think of that, action figure nut that I am... :)

Coyote> <<using Christine's initials to designate the series (CM) ... then assuming that I'd created Christine!>> Eh heh heh heh...I think I'll stay away from that one. ;P <<which is really tasteless of me to say because she has CP.>> Another CR dweller with a family member who has a chronic ailment? <sigh> I'm truly sorry. :( <<I know there's one mechanic in my town that *seriously* fails on the tattoos-to-fingers scale ... he has two *magnificent* tats, and only eight fingers.>> So what's wrong with--oh, he's not a garg? <blink> Ew. <<If you're serious about it, there are three MSTiers I know of ... you can let all three get their mitts in your work, like I have, if ya like.>> Thanks for informing me. :)

David G.> Impressive Illuminati essay. Now, let's hope they never find out that you have apparently deciphered their entire orgaization...

Paul> Goliath and Elisa's relationship, unimportant? Well...granted, it's not exactly fun to write for, for me at least (which is why I'm not even going to bother with it; my ambition of killing much of the central cast of the show has as much to do with practicality as with bloodlust), but I'm sure it has *something* to do with what's going on...of course, I *am* the Lesser Anti-Romantic. "The sweet caress of twilight...there's magic everywhere...and with all this romantic atmosphere...DISASTER'S in the air!" >;)

Patrick Toman> <<Jar Jar Binks has turned me off CGI for the time being - at least until he can get hooked up with the T-Rex from Jurrasic Park>> Heh...he may be annoying, but I'll say this for the little walking fish--he was technically brilliantly executed. If only he weren't so irritating that a great many Star Wars fans have concocted brilliant executions of a different manner...if only such a marvelous tool as CGI hadn't been used for such evil...

Christine <<there's been a story out there for years called something like "The Interrogation of Princess Leia", and that icked even _me_ out>> You? The disturbed individual who created Norman--I mean Jericho? >;P j/k

**REVOLTING MR. DISCONNECT CARNAGE**

[Mr. Disconnect is abducted by the usual ninjas or Gerudo or whoever Wilek is employing this time, and awakens to find himself strapped to, you guessed it, the beloved torture device, Mr. Thingy. Wilek: "Taunting friend Glimmer? Bad, bad hacker. I think you know what to expect." Wilek has Mr. Thingy uses a hooked knife to make numerous slashes in Mr. Disconnect's arms and legs, and pours hydrochloric acid into the wounds. He then forces a few indescribably painful-looking spiky things down DC's throat, and then he *really* starts tormenting DC--by having one of the torture device's mechanical arms, one with a heavy four-clawed manipulator on the end, punch a hole in DC's torso, grab a significant portion of his viscera, and pull it up out of his thoracic cavity while rotating; the end effect is that most of DC's guts are wound around the claw like spaghetti, and DC is of course in unimaginable agony. Wilek: "Now, what can we do with this...I know." Wilek grins evilly as he releases the contents of a container full of rats upon DC's exposed twisted viscera (Twisted Viscera? Kewl name for a band), where they begin chewing merrily.]

**END**
Wilek Nereus
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 03:38:05 AM
IP: tnt-2-33-56k.portsmouth.zoomnet.net

Gargoyles Movie- At this point I'll take anything I can get . I'd prefer a nice 2-hour [animated] movie that would come very close to the series . But even if it's a live action movie I'd be happy with it . as long as it brings enough attention to the series [an animated movie would do a better job of that] to bring it back I'll be happy . and I'd see it over and over and over....
As long as it's very true to the series[ and Greg Weisman gives his okay to the passed script] It'll be one of my favorites . After two years of waiting I think that we at least deserve that much.
traveler - [Goliath01@hotmail]
hobart, IN, usa
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 03:36:41 AM
IP: proxy-563.public.rwc.webtv.net

Wilek: You're right, "normal" is in the eye of the beholder, as well as beauty. Still, I was referring to our society's standard of normality, which says men must be athletic and good-looking and women must be skinny and big-titted. I definitely prefer *our* definition of "normal," which is nowhere near society's ideal. :)

Xanathar: Next target--Dean Devlin. That is a brilliant idea! Count me in!

Warpmind: Keep your hands off the beaked chick! I saw her first! :P heheheheh...and about that stupid customer--oh my f--kin' god!! I doubt I could find one to top that one even if I delivered pizzas for two hundred years!

Aaron: [Rodeo class> Now there's one class where you *don't* want to be the class clown.] ROTFLMAO! And I'd love to see Miramax do a Gargoyles movie, too. Maybe we'd also see a cameo by Quinten Tarantino... O_o Glad your car's okay, too.

Coyote: Eight fingers, eh? Eek! Yeah, that's a pretty good clue... ;)

Been another one of those days. I have tomorrow off, though, so hopefully I'll have time to think up a good segment of the Joyride.... :)
Pistoff - [pistoff@outgun.com]
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 02:53:39 AM
IP: wire-1.koalas.com

More thoughts on the Gargoyles Movie.

Airwalker> <<<The Gargoyles movie and the Gargoyles cartoon and the Gargoyle comic don't have to all follow the same continuity. The X-Men movie isn't going to be anything like the X-Men comic which is nothing like the X-Men cartoon. The movie could be very different as long as when the show comes back to television (and hopefully to a Greg written comic) it remains faithful to the continuity we know and enjoy.>>>

Exactly! This is the most important point, IMO. The movie *will* contradict the continuity of the series, I'm afraid there's no getting around that. The movie will nutshell as much as possible. It will also bring to the forefront the plotlines required for a theatrical movie appeal (at least what Hollywood says is requird) while taking perhaps some of the plotlines that were more prominant in "Awakenings" and making them background plots (the ones I'm thinking of here are the ones that were principle for setting the stage for the series, which was the primary purpose of "Awakenings" but which will not be of the movie).

For example, the Elisa/Goliath romance will be made center stage in a movie. The studio would circle that plot element with a bright red marker on the spot. If Goliath and Elisa had been both the same sex, nullifying the potential for a romance, then they'd probably change things around so that there *was* a romance. So, we're lucky that "Awakenings" has the Goliath/Elisa thing to appease the studio execs. Otherwise, we might be having to fear them really turning things upside down.

I yield to Airwalker on the rating issue. Due to the 994 material it would have to be PG, but it wouldn't be higher than that. It's not so much a matter of reputation that Disney would be worrying about, it's how much of the American public they can draw to their film in order to make money. Think about why all the movies with 100+ million dollar budgets are never as high as R. Because with that much on stake the studio wants as many consumers as possible. Same with Gargoyles. I imagine the film is a risk-taker in the studio's eyes.

Lastly, I am pretty confident that CGI would be used as much as possible. In this day and age it's *more* finiancially-sound to use CGI than conventional SFX. The cost is so cheap that everyone's using it, and as a result it has set a new standard that one must live up to, so to not use CGI may in and of itself be a death warrant for the movie. By the time a Gargoyles Movie gets to the post-production stage of its development (3+ years from now, assuming it gets a start very soon) they should have no trouble rendering believable CGI versions of gargoyles. I keep comparing to Dragonheart. Recall how believable Sean Connery's dragon was in that, and that was a movie that couldn't have had too large of a budget, *and* was made a couple years ago. With Lucas focusing all his attention on CGI for his SW movies, I'm sure things will start skyrocketing even more soon. (So at least some good will come of that...)

However, they'd still cut corners. Sure they may be able to create a believable rendering of one gargoyles, but what about two...or three...or four? Since every garg looks different, they'd all gave to be created on by one. As background decore (like for the 994 segment) there wouldn't be that much of a problem, but for front-stage characters you'd need a lot more detail and realistic movement, hence a lot more money. This may be the reason for why Goliath will be the only garg featured in the film. If they show more, they might do what I'm sure we all fear... combine characters. But if they don't use CGI, then the film will bomb. TMNT costumes worked ten, even five years ago... but not now, and certainly not in 3-4 years from now.
Entity
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 02:07:34 AM
IP: ely-oh3-40.ix.netcom.com

On Brooklyn: You can all say what you want... but he still seems to look like Icabad Crane to me :) (You might remember him from Disney's animated adaptation of "The Legend of Sleepy Hollow" which was called "The Headless Horseman")
Ash
Tuesday, August 10, 1999 01:08:34 AM
IP: yktnsk01d01040158.sk.sympatico.ca

Brooklyn>WHAT!?! My darling Brooklyn, UGLY?????? HHHHHHHEEEEEEEEEEELLLLLLL NO! If I were a gargoyle, I would defintely want him for a mate. He kind, smart, resourceful, and he has incredible good looks. There's somthing about his beak that is absolutely irrisistable(sp?)! And he has a nice lean yet muscular body (I especially like is torso). And his eyes are so deep and romantic! And his voice....Ohhhhh it's something that could sooth me to sleep! *drooool*

Hmmmm...apparently my interest in Brooklyn is as great as Christine's is for Goliath... ;)
Mary Flanders
Monday, August 9, 1999 10:53:02 PM
IP: ramp-1-28.ucdavis.edu

Wow, interesting comments and so much to catch up on

Movie>> I believe the beginning is the best place to start. Those first ep's are some of our favorites, everytime Disney hits that part of the seq I try to watch. A good dipiction of the gargoyles that would "hook" new fans is definately best in the long run. I would sure like to see the story continue on in animation.

David G>> humm, did that Illuminati post keep you up long hours-perhaps your on there list as poss. recruit (like Matt they may need to make you one of their own, since you seem to know so much about them)

WORK RANT
The only thing worse than stupid customers, are idiot new employees. Sometimes it gets REALLY OLD teaching them how to think for themselves. Case in point, new young man gets asked by a customer how much the large garbage cans on the top shelf cost. Young man proceeds to get a ladder, get the stack of garbage can down and find the price. Now these garbage cans where put up there because at the time the counter down below was full. When he is done with the customer, instead of filling the empty lower shelf- HE PUTS THEM BACK UP TOP. Talk about a wasted use of brain matter.
end rant

Good night all


Delphi - [cmiller@magiclink.com]
Twin Falls, Idaho
Monday, August 9, 1999 10:51:43 PM
IP: 207.14.195.138

**RP HERE**

"The cinders of the mysterious immense explosion on this Iowa government farm are still settling," a female reporter is saying on a TV newscast being played to the bad guy leaders. "As you can see, thousands of government troops are now moving over the site to assess damage. Let's speak with some of them." She walks over to a tall man standing near the huge pile of ash and destroyed metal that is all that remains of the Devastator. (Note- the man is K from MIB.) "What agency are you from, sir?" "FBI, Division 6. I must ask you to turn off that camera now." Thailog grimaces and switches off the TV, then turns back to his associates. "So the Borg have failed," he sighs. "I should never have let that idiot Guod plan his own takeover operation!" He fumes silently for several minutes, then looks up. "That's it! I am now taking complete control of all our strategies!" "Excellent idea, lover," Asil grins back, twiddling her fingers back and forth. "I'm sure you'll do better than that moron Guod did. So what's our next plan for world domination?" Thailog smiles sinisterly. "General Zale, now that the Borg are gone what is our greatest force?" "That would be our Phalanx allies," the military commander replies. Thailog nods. "Very well. Tyl, get Phalanx Prime on the line for me immediately." The evil hacker nods and begins tapping keys.

Meanwhile, in the Avatar of Ganon's briefing room, Doug is talking with DumlaoX. "Can the Onslaught be repaired?" he asks the weapons dealer. "I know it was badly damaged in our fight with those Borg." "I looked it over," Dumlao replies. "It can be rebuilt, but that's going to take a while. And it will require T-Loco and myself to take a leave of absence from the general RP action. She's still recovering from the wounds those Borg-Pokemon gave her, so I don't know exactly how long." "But it can be fixed, right?" Doug asks. Dumlao nods. "It can and I assure you, it will be." "Good. In the meantime we'll have to get around using Jammer and Stephanie's cars. Most of Wilek's ships are on clean-up crew for the remains of the Borg battle, so I doubt he'll be able to loan us one. We'll get by." Dumlao smiles in agreement. "I'm gonna go check on my sister now. See you later." Doug nods and turns to make a post as his fellow RP player walks off.

**END RP FIRST HALF**

Hi everybody. A new week is upon us. For me and Kit, it's the second to last one before the start of the new semester. <heavy sigh> Hope we find some way to enjoy it. :) For those of you who have already started school again or will very soon, don't worry, we won't be gloating about the extra vacation time. We used to have to go to school early too, and thus we feel your pain. <grin>

Fanfic Progress: For those of you who are curious, Protected Species is proceeding smoothly. I'm about to move the characters into Ishimura (so far they've been doing things near it and (in Taro's case) in Tokyo and Osaka). Coming in two to four weeks- **TEASER ALERT**
- The beginnings of Seth and Agony's reconciliation.
- A deadly hunt with Ishimuran gargoyles (or more accurately, Taro and his minions) as the prey.
- One of the Ishimura clan's young warriors becomes aware of the hero's soul within him.
- Sata returns to her birthplace, and reacts to how much it has changed since the 1600s.
AND...
- "I don't believe this! Ari's got a crush on someone!!" "Mom! Can you please make him stop?!"
**LAUGHTER, TEASER ENDS**

Okay, enough of that. :) On to replies.

Gargoyles Film: I'm unfortunately one of the people who doubts it will get made any time soon. Hope it does, and that the film is done right. A slightly redone Awakenings sounds fine for me, I agree that incorporating Reawakening into it would make for a good script and story. Maybe some other Season 1 eps could also be brought in. Needless to say, I'm really glad they rejected the Devlin plot. :)

Paul: The white fiend was the one we had the least trouble with, surprisingly. :) Hope your new chapters of Myria's Legacy get posed on Mieu Sedai's page real soon.

Fandom Top Five: Glad so many good authors, writers, products, and characters made it. Thanks to the few people who voted for mine (I know from the other room that some things I've done got in. :)

Christine: Avalon Mists is coming out that soon, huh? :) I'll be looking forward to it. Hope you soon are able to declare the story I sent you good enough for it. (If it's not, I'm willing to help edit it so it is. :)

Sorow: Good luck in your junior year of high school. Hope it doesn't last too long. I know from experience how nauseating and full of hassle those can be (but it's nothing compared to what happens when you're a senior!).

Aaron: Sounds like I need to pick up a copy of that tape you mentioned. :) I agree with you and the morons about modern TV.

Ash: That's an interesting creativity demon. :)

David G: Thanks for posting that well-written bit about the Illuminati. Wonder how much of it is true in Gargoyles, and if the Invisibles are any relation to the Discordians of GURPS Illuminati fame.

Goliath and Elisa's Relationship: I agree with Patrick and Airwalker, it is very important to the Gargoyles story. Sure it may only be a subplot, but it still creates tension and emotion in all the characters. And it helps to develop the characters (Goliath and Elisa especially, the others to a lesser degree), and the story as a whole. Thus it is an issue that is very much part of the Gargoyles tale. I hope to see parts of it in the movie too, when the movie gets made.

And that's all for tonight. Later!

**BEGIN SECOND HALF OF THIS POST'S RP**

Kitainia walks up to Doug as he is finishing. "What did DX say about our truck?" she asks him. Doug tells her and Kit nods. "Okay, I guess we can manage. It's time to relax anyway." "Yeah," Doug agrees. "Where is everyone?" "Most of them are off resting or celebrating. Did you know the Avatar has a fully stocked bar, game room, and video arcade?" "No," Doug smiles. "Think we should go check them out?" "Sure," Kit nods. "But later. Daria and Trent want to speak with us first. Wilek's medical staff is just about finished unassimilating their friends and families, and they want to know how they'll all be getting back to Lawndale." "Wilek can probably beam them down," Doug guesses. "And when they get back, like all of us, they'll have interesting stories to tell."

The display suddenly changes back to the enemy's secret base, where another interesting nefarious plot is brewing. "Our virus is once again prepared," Phalanx Prime tells Thailog. "Sevarius assures me that this time it is infallible." "Then we shall use it," Thailog declares. "This is the perfect time. The Avatar of Ganon's forces will still be recovering from the devastation inflicted on them by Guod's Borg. This time they will not be able to halt our assimilation." "Excuse me, sir," AD Kincaid suddenly breaks in. "That's a good plan, but shouldn't we do something about those Ravens before we enact it? They've proven themselves quite formidable." "Yeah," Pastor John agrees. "They may be unrepentant sinners, but some higher power is on their side just the same." Thailog nods, and so do Asil, Jerec, Zale, Kharsus, and Dahak. "I agree. We must do something to prevent them from challenging us. Once the Ravens are out of the picture, then you can launch your missiles, Prime." The Phalanx emperor shrugs. "Alright. I just hope we don't have to wait too long." "You won't," Kincaid says. "Agent Tau is still on the case. As soon as he picks up the Ravens' trail and finds them, he will capture them for us." "What if we could get the Ravens to be in a place of our choosing?" Tyl asks. "Your man could capture them more easily then, right?" "Yes," Kincaid nods. "Do you have an idea?" "If Thailog will let me go through with it," the evil hacker grins. "It's a good one, sir," adds his pal Corax. "Very well," Thailog muses. "What is this idea?" "Well," Tyl replies, "it's simple yet complicated. First..."

**SCREEN FADES OUT, END THIS BIT OF RP**
Doug - [frostfire@mail.utexas.edu]
Monday, August 9, 1999 10:45:26 PM
IP: pool-209-138-160-149.dlls.grid.net

Spike > it's just not right ... blue ribbon artist _and_ runner-up writer ... sheesh, woman ... you're _too_ good! Are you cruddy at anything? Come on, throw me a bone here, there's got to be something! ; )

Fleur > give George a heart attack? Nah ... there's been a story out there for years called something like "The Interrogation of Princess Leia", and that icked even _me_ out; I doubt my harmless Obi-Wan story would earn more than a chuckle (followed by a massive lawsuit).

Brooklyn > what's ugly about him? He's not scrawny; sure he's no Goliath, but who is? His build is leaner but well-muscled. His beak is unusual, yet striking. He's got great hair, cool horns. And most of all, most _important_ of all, he's got attitude. I personally prefer Goliath and MacBeth over him, but that's because I go more for the strong noble suffering type than the rebellious bad-boy type. But ugly isn't a word I'd use, not ever.

Christine - [vecna@eskimo.com]
Monday, August 9, 1999 10:35:59 PM
IP: vecna.ndip.eskimo.net

Movie > I think that a Gargoyles movie would best be presented as a mystery, with Elisa following up on these vague encounters with "monsters." There's suspense, as Elisa is getting close, and there's motion in the shadows. Then we get to see the glowing eyes. Finally, after further investigation, she sees Goliath face to face, and from there the back story is gradually filled in, (hopefully without flashbacks, because those tend to slow down a movie).

To add to the mystery, we'll see Xanatos executing orders without obvious motivation, glancing out at the stone gargoyles on the parapets at the end of the scene.

The movie can still be good without ruining the rich mythology of the series. If anything, the movie can add another layer to the myth--another interpretation.

But that's only if it's done right.

Scott Iskow - [smiskow@wam.umd.edu]
Gaithersburg, Maryland
Monday, August 9, 1999 10:02:11 PM
IP: bay7-46.dial.umd.edu

COYOTE - You wrote: [You also have to consider the possibility that the film will flop royally, in which case there wouldn't *be* any sequels, and subsequently we'd never get *any* original Gargs on *any* screen again.]

If a Gargoyles movie is made only with fans who know every bit of continuity in mind, then it's definetly going to flop. We have to acknowledge that we fans are a very small minority of the public that is going to see this movie. Most of them will be a public who will go to it will know absolutely nothing about Gargoyles. Whatever goes to the screen is going to have to introduce the property to them, not to us. They already have us. We are already the fans who will go to the movie. They need to get the Gargoyle ignorant public in.

You wrote: [I say, if it's in the theater, take a chance on an original story within continuity, because you might not get another chance.]

Making an original story is what they are trying to do, that's why they rejected Greg's proposal which they said was too much like AWAKENINGS. But how can they set it deep in Gargoyles continuity? I can see ways that it can be done but for a first movie, it's going to be hard enough to get people in without complicating things for them.

For a first movie, nobody needs to know that Xanatos is an Illuminatus who created his own fortune through a time loop or that Demona is an immortal who is also linked to the historical Macbeth due to the schemes of a time travelling wizard and three Fey. To tell an audience who doesn't know anything about Gargoyles this right off the bat is going to make them say "It's too complicated. Let's go see something that won't make me think so much."

But at the same time we would like to see the continuity of Gargoyles honored. So the only solution seems to be a compromise in which they take the plot of an existing pilot - AWAKENINGS - and they make some changes here and there in the minor details so that the public gets an origin movie that will get them hooked and we get a look at an expanded version of AWAKENINGS done in live action/CGI format.

Plus one other thing that has to be considered. Movies aren't always faithful to the property that they spin off from. The Gargoyles movie and the Gargoyles cartoon and the Gargoyle comic don't have to all follow the same continuity. The X-Men movie isn't going to be anything like the X-Men comic which is nothing like the X-Men cartoon. The movie could be very different as long as when the show comes back to television (and hopefully to a Greg written comic) it remains faithful to the continuity we know and enjoy.


PAUL - You wrote: [If there was a GARGOYLES Movie canon with the Series, why would it even bother with the Elisa/Goliath Relationship? Its not exactly important to the story.]

The Goliath/Elisa relationship is a big part of the series overall even though in AWAKENINGS there was only the smallest, barest hints of it. I figure that in a movie they should include it. It doesn't have to advance far. They don't have to go from an origin to HUNTERS MOON in the first movie. But they should set some things up in the movie continuity so that if there is a sequel it can be used.


TIM P - You wrote: [I'd say that they should use a balanced combination of both costumes and CGI.]

If they were dealing with Fey then I could agree completely. If Puck shows up then it would be perfect to see a live action actor in costume augmented by CGI. But with Gargoyles, I'm not exactly so sure that characters wouldn't turn out to look so-so if they have costumes. I still have memories of TEENAGE MUTANT NINJA TURTLES 2 and 3.

I'd rather see the Gargoyles done ala The Phantom Menace way in personal scenes. So if they had a Goliath/Xanatos scene then I wouldn't mind an actor acting out Goliath's part next to Jonothan Frakes and then dubed over with a CGI Goliath. The action scenes between gliding Gargoyles and let's say Steel Clan robots (since we've been talking about a remake of AWAKENINGS here) could be completely done by computer. That would avoid camera movement problems since the entire scene would be computer generated.
Airwalker
Brooklyn, NY
Monday, August 9, 1999 09:52:36 PM
IP: 253.new-york-30-35rs.ny.dial-access.att.net

Cool... "Something Old, Something New" came in 2nd in the favorite story category. I'm glad people liked it... and I have to take a moment again thank my co-writers, Christi Smith Hayden and Kathy Pogge.

Paul Nathans wrote: "If there was a GARGOYLES Movie canon with the Series, why would it even bother with the Elisa/Goliath Relationship? Its not exactly important to the story." / "Their relationship isn't that important to the GARGOYLES Story."

Not that important to the story? It was only one of the major underlying arcs for two entire seasons! Sorry... I'm just too blown away right now by the flippancy of that dismisal to offer a long-winded counterargument. All I know is that, to me, anyway, there was a certain tension that existed between Goliath and Elisa right from the moment they first met on the ledge in "Awakenings" that said that between those two characters there was going to be something significant. I knew right away that Elisa wasn't going to be just another April O'Neil. And after "The Mirror" it was pretty clear what was going on. So to say that the Elisa / Goliath relationship "isn't that important" - that just boggles my mind.

I don't think the series would have been the same if that element weren't there. And if/when a movie is done, I'd sure hope to see it there, as well.

As for animation vs. costumes vs. CGI - I'd prefer a live action movie with Star Trek quality costuming and other effects courtesy of the magic of Jim Henson's Creature Shop. (Jar Jar Binks has turned me off CGI for the time being - at least until he can get hooked up with the T-Rex from Jurrasic Park). Of course, I'd also like to see the movie retell "Awakenings" and include as many of the orginal series actors and actresses get cast in the movie, too (Marina would look so cool in Demona prosthetics, don't you think? :P) At this point though, from what I hear via the rumor mill, I'm just still hoping we get _any_ movie.
Patrick Toman
Cleveland - and the Browns are back!!!, Ohio, yeah baby!
Monday, August 9, 1999 09:15:40 PM
IP: abd764ed.ipt.aol.com

Todd> Darien's not in the illuminati, but they're putting their hooks into him. The level I called "preparation" referes to someone who might someday be a member, but for now is just a useful tool. That's where I figure Montrose is. I probably didn't make that terribly clear, since I wrote the post off the top of my head.
David G. - [david_goodner@yahoo.com]
Arlington, TX, USA
Monday, August 9, 1999 09:08:39 PM
IP: pppa56-fortworthb21-5r663.saturn.bbn.com

Gargoyles Movie: Costumes vs. CGI: I try to see to see this through a director's point of view. CGI is great for stunts that are too dangerous for actors (Example: The people falling off the edge of the stern in TITANIC) and for characters used in simple pans and dolly veiws.

In THE PHANTOM MENACE, many of the shots that Jar Jar Binks involved an actor (in this case, a former Stomp performer) stood in his place that interacted and talked as Jar Jar would. Then the actor would dub his lines over those he spoke on the set.

So if Thom Hernandez got a part in the film, he *could* be able to act as Lexinton on the set.

But what if your shooting it with a steadicam or there is alot of camera movement? The camera is shaking or the lighting is always changing. SAVING PRIVATE RYAN is an excellent example of this. Using CGI would be extremly difficult is such situations. Therefore, costumes would be excellent in many situations.

In conclusion, I'd say that they should use a balanced combination of both costumes and CGI.
Tim P.
Monday, August 9, 1999 08:57:51 PM
IP: s16-onawa.pionet.net

Fleur::Thanks for the welcome :)

Sorrow::School started today as well...wich ment my brother was out of my hair for most of the day.

Brooklyn being ugly? NOT! he is my favorite, I mean he is secon in command,he is clever,he has that sexy voice and that long wild white hair. he looks good wearing a leather jacket and wearing shades, He has a great sense of humour. He also reminds me of pteranodon wich growing p was my favorite dinosaur. Obviously Sata doesnt think he's ugly :P
Spacebabie - [Spacebabie76@yahoo.com]
Orlando, Fl, USA
Monday, August 9, 1999 08:55:17 PM
IP: ts001d40.orl-fl.concentric.net

First: YES!! Athenaverse as one of the top five in the Fandom Polls!! Yeah!! I was very unamused by seeing Christine Morgan higher up on the 'Favorite Author List' than Jewel Faulkner, but, ah, well. At least Athenaverse got on the list as best 'Real Fanfiction'. Yay!

Angela and Brooklyn-The synchs were simply because of the similarities in characters. Angela takes the point in many situations a lot. So does Brooklyn. As for THE RECKONING, if one of your friends was hurt, and you could help him, wouldn't you? There's nothing besides simple friendship there.

Airwalker-If there was a GARGOYLES Movie canon with the Series, why would it even bother with the Elisa/Goliath Relationship? Its not exactly important to the story. Speaking of which, with the listing of 'Previously on GARGOYLES' or whatever, there's no need for the commentary from Goliath to Elisa in THE MIRROR about her being beautiful, its unnecessary. I think there were too many 'Previously Scenes' concerning their relationship anyway, or I don't remember it correctly. The kiss between Elisa and Goliath at the end of HUNTERS' MOON might be one of the few points necessary to express that plot point. Probably the brief exchange on Elisa's Apartment's Balcony in THE GATHERING and the kiss between Elisa and Goliath at the end of HUNTERS' MOON.
Their relationship isn't that important to the GARGOYLES Story.

Kitainia-The Red Fiend is female and is a slight pain. I probably had the most trouble with, out of the Fiends, the White Fiend. At least I think the Red Fiend is female, the Red Fiend kinda' looked female.

"I'm glad, no, I'm proud, to be human!"-Fei Fong Wong
XENOGEARS
Paul Allen Nathans - [LacanPanother@worldnet.att.net]
Monday, August 9, 1999 08:50:43 PM
IP: 22.morristown-05-10rs.nj.dial-access.att.net

DAVID G - Good piece on the Illuminati, but just one question. When in TGS did we say that Darien Montrose was in the Illuminati?


Todd Jensen - [merlyn@ninenet.com]
St. Louis, MO
Monday, August 9, 1999 08:47:15 PM
IP: 208-19-232-138.dialup-stl.primary.net

Oops. I got some headings out of order. Darn.
David G. - [david]
Arlington, TX, USA
Monday, August 9, 1999 07:43:11 PM
IP: pppa41-fortworthb20-4r663.saturn.bbn.com

Hi kiddies, it's that time agian:

David G's Obnoxiously Long Post (Special Illuminated edition)

The Illuminati is one of the major forces shaping the world of Gargoyles. If they had no other effect than providing Xanatos with the funds with which he started his empire they would still be a major factor in the world. Beyond that, they were one of the driving forces behind the Quarrymen, and their machinations touch upon the lives of almost all the storylines in the Gargoyles Saga.

Greg Wiesman's Illuminati are considerably different from whatever real world groups have borne that name, and are somewhat different from the most pervasive fictional versions. Primarialy, they are more direct than the legendary versions. When I first saw the Illuminati in Gargoyles I was disappointed. They were too easy to find, and too easy to fool. Since just complaining about something rarely causes the situation to get better, I started theroizing about why things might be the way they are, and adding my own elements to fill in the gaps I saw.

What follows is pretty much what I came up with. This is MY PERSONAL model for the Illuminati, and is made up of a mix of real world history, Gargoyles continuity, elements from other fiction and RPG's, and stuff I made up. A lot of it has no basis in the series, but is included to flesh out a very sketchy account.

(Remember, none of this is real. If any Secret Masters happen to read this and take offense, my little brother really wrote this post, and is just posting it to frame me)

Part 1 - Illuminated History
The real Illuminati, the Illuminated Sages of Bavaria, emerged in 1776 as a group of intellectual 'freethinkers' who tried to take over the Freemasons, but were unsuccessful. That group embraced rationalism, atheism, and, ultimately, power for its own sake. In so far as can be determined, they don't exist in the present day.

The Gargoyles Illuminati have to be much older, since they were well established in the 10th century. Accepting that Duval, the head of the order, is Pellas the Fisher King, then they probably emerged in the chaos that would have followed the fall of King Arthur.

Pellas, a good man, would have wanted a way to mantain the order Arthur imposed on Europe. A number of things could have driven him to do so secretly, rather than overtly. He had only a small band of knights, rather than a great army, and he had an important secret (the Grail) to protect. So, instead of building an army of soldiers, he recruited a society of 'advisors' who gathered subtle power to carry out his agenda. The Illuminati of the dark ages was concerned with peace and order. They promoted alligeances and treaties. (As evidenced by the actions of the Norman Ambassidor who met Xanatos)

Over time, their focus changed. Perhaps they realized that the goal of a united Europe was impossible, or came up against some opposition. At any rate, by the Crusades the focus seemed to have shifted from Peace to Control. The Illuminated sought to keep rulers in check, and to limit the power of any single nation. (Thus, the Robin Hood Brooklyn met)

From the Crusades to the modern era there is very little to go on, so I have to resort to pure conjecture. As the Illuminati grew, Pellas slowly surrendered control. For one thing, his immortality would have started to raise eyebrows. He had to initiate a more complex organization based on a piramidal hirearchy. Increasingly, the Regents below him had their own goals, and used the Society to accomplish them. Pellas still wielded significant power, even though he might have changed identities. The Grail allowed him to bestow longevity on his most trusted advisors, though he probably kept its nature a secret.

In the 1700's the Society shifted focus to the New World. Pellas's ideals, similar to those Arthur espoused, led to the formation of our democracy. (Note, in the real world many of our founding fathers were Freemasons, a group the Gargoyles Illuminati probably controls)

By the modern age, the Illuminati are spread throughout the world. They have means to influence the criminal underworld, govenrments, and corporations. The Society's power is almost all decentralized. Rather than having armies of mercinaries, they have the means to hire those mercinaries, secretly, whenever they need them. Very few people are aware of the Society, even their most useful agents may not know whom they serve.

The Society has several goals. They still want to control things, either directly, or indirectly. They protect the earth from threats. This seems to be as much motivated self-interest as any sense of duty. They also seek knowledge, particularly arcane learning and scientific advancement. They work through agents placed in several groups. Mace Malone provided the Society with influence in the world of organized crime. Martin Hacker, and others like him, allow them to influence the government. David Xanatos and Darien Montrose provide them with the most useful sort of influence in the modern age, over technology and finance.

Part 2 - Organization of the Illuminati
The Illuminati are a hierarchical organization. Each level has fewer members and more influence than the ones below. The real Illuminati took their organizational forms from Masonry, so the Gargoyles version probably does, too. Pellas/Duval's medieval mind would have liked the Feudal and Church overtones. Membership in the Illuminati consists of several Degrees, with from four to five ranks within each Degree:

Nursery - the lowest level. Illuminati at this level know practically nothing of the society, and do all the hard, dangerous work. Nursery members are not very involved with the Society, and probably consider it a side issue to thier daily lives. There are four ranks:
1 - Preperation - this is the level of someone being considered for membership. Matt Bluestone, in the years he was with the FBI, would have been at this level. The Society tests and manipulates these individuals while revealing as little as possible.
2 - Novice - The lowest rank of a full member. Novices know about the Society, but much of what they know is either sketchy or false. They are being prepared for greater responsibility and knowledge. Bluestone is probably at this level now.
3 - Minerval - A true servant of the society, with some access to the inner secrets. At this level, the Illuminatus starts to reap some benifits, but is still not trusted with much knowledge. Martin Hacker might be at this level, but he also might be much higher.
4 - Illuminatus Minor - A 'true Illuminatus.' This is probably the highest level most members ever attain. The resources of the society are put at their limited disposal, giving them minor advantages over non-Illuminated competitors. For instance, since the Illuminati manipulates the stock market, an Illuminatus Minor might recieve notice that a certain stock is about to crash, just in time to sell. David Xanatos is probably an Illuminatus Minor.

Masonry - Now you're getting somewhere. This is the level at which members start to become more involved in the Illuminati than in their real lives. There are five ranks, but one seems rather superfilous:
1 - Apprentice - Beginning to be introduced to the inner secrets, the equivelent of an intern at a big company, or a graduate student in a university.
2 - Fellowcraft - Something on the order of a non-tenured professor. Important, and either on the rise, or on the way out.
3 - Master - The equivelent of a Tenured professor.
4 - Illuminatus Major - One of the last steps until being admitted into the highest levels. Mace Malone probably had this level. This might be a practical maximum for most people in terms of advancement. This is the level where they start giving you the longevity treatements (after you're too old to really enjoy it)
5 - Illuminatus Dirigens - I can't really think of any reason for this rank, except, perhaps for someone being considered for a Priesthood or other advancement.

Mysteries - This is the inner circle. Advancement into the Mysteries is very difficult, the work of several lifetimes. The members at this level are among the most powerful people in the world, and are probably hundreds of years old. There are two sub-degrees within this degree.
Lesser:
1 - Priest - I think this is something like a military general, a field commander for a large portion of the Society's resources. If Martin Hacker is far more powerful than I initially judged, he might actually be at this level.
2 - Regent - Also called a Prince - I think the Regents are in charge of specific territories. A Regent might be in charge of a single city, or a single industry. (The Regent of Communications must have a fun job, if he exists)
Greater: I think there are eight greater Illuminati, and there are never likely to be more. I choose that figure because Clan Tremere from the World of Darkness chooses eight (Tremere, and the Counsil of Seven) and it seems to work pretty well.
Magus - a member of the "Inner Counsil," a body so secret that the members may not even know who eachother are. Each Magus controls resources and secrets that could shake the world. I belive that over time the Magi have ursurped a considerable amount of Duval's control over the society, which leaves him forced to rely upon his own resources. Of course, this is like saying Superman can't count on his allies, so he has to use his own powers. (bummer)
Rex - the highest level - The Fisher King himself. He controls the Grail, which is probably the source of the longevity drugs, so he controls the society. Eternal life is very habit forming, so the power to take it away is a considerable one. Duval probably also has a sizable personal network of agents and spies, such that even if the Counsil aren't totally loyal, he's a bad man to cross.

Part 3 - How to Join and How to Leave
The Illuminati is a good old boys network. Membership is by invitation. Most new Illuminati are recruited for their knowledge, skills, or resources. Xanatos recruited himself. Matt was recruited because he was too nosy, and just smart enough to be useful. Montrose is being recruited for the business assets he controls.

A new Illuminatus starts off in the lowest rank of the lowest grade, and is given 'jobs' to do. The more successful he is, the faster he graduates on to more responsibility. Probably 90 percent of the Society's members never get higher than the Illuminatus Minor level, if that high. Many never realize that there is anything more to be.

Over time, some Illuminati manage to become so important, powerful, or useful that the Society invests more in them. These are the members in the Masonry ranks, and do most of the day to day manipulation of the lower ranks. Others never advance at all.

Joining seems almost impossible. Leaving IS almost impossible. Even before you realize you're a member, the Society will be collecting information on you. They'll learn what buttons to push, and they'll have blackmail to hold over you. By the time you know enough to want to leave, it will be too late. The only way to escape would be to sacrifice your life, either by dying, or by destroying every reference to yourself and taking on a new name and face.

While leaving is hard, being kicked out, or ignored, isn't. Xanatos is still somewhat controled by the Society, but they seem content to leave him largely to his own devices. Mace Malone evidently failed sufficiently that nobody ever bothered to rescue him from the Hotel Cabal, though this decision was probably motivated by internal rivalry, rather than true discipline.

Part 7 - Operating Procedures
The Illuminati doesn't act, if it can help it. It collects information, and manipulates others into doing its will. Almost every agency or power in the world is, to some extent, controled by the Illuminati. When an existing agency is not sufficient to its needs, the Society creates a new one, like the Quarrymen. Of course, things don't always go as planned. Other groups are manipulating things from behind the scenes as well. Madoc, in various guises, has used tactics very similar to those of the Society. Only his psychotic contempt for Humans, and his mania to destroy Gargoyles kept him from being far more effective.

Illuminati operations fall into three main areas:
Control - whenever a new factor enters the world, the society looks for a way to control it. The help they provided Xanatos, as well as other actions, was intended to provide the society with control over the gargoyles. Their reason for wanting to control the gargoyles - because someone was going to, and it might as well be them.

Disrupt - the Society keeps the ballance of world power by manipulating opposing forces against eachother. One example is the Timedancer Robin Hood story. Another might be the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor, which had no other effect than to push the USA into World War II.

Learn - the Society wants to know everything. Even knowledge that may seem trivial or usless at the moment might be useful later. To this end, they sponsor research and investigation into a wide variaty of fields. The researchers may, or may not know of the Society's involvement.

Other actions by the Society, or its pawns, probably benifit the specific agenda of some Magus or Regent.

Part 6 - Other Groups
While I was looking up stuff on the Illuminati, I found a few other groups that might have some part in the hidden war. For your amusement, here they are.

The Society of Assassins - an Islamic cult that used mind control techniques to create fanitacal, highly competent warriors. They were most active before and during the Crusades, then were killed off. The Illuminati, being European during this time, might have been the agency responsible for their downfall, or might have secretly absorbed them, prepratory to taking over the Holy Lands.

The Poor Knights of the Temple of Solomon - The Templars - An order of knights formed to protect pilgrams to the Holy Lands. They became, over time, an extremely rich and powerful group, so much so that the Secular leaders of Europe conspired to destroy them with accusations of black magic. Rumors persist that they were not, in fact, all destroyed, but went into hiding as a private army for the Pope. It's not hard to exchange the Fisher King for the Pope, providing Duval with a highly trained, very loyal army that might serve him to this day.

The Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn - A Victorian occult society. They recruited activly from the Masons, and so would have certainly run into the Illuminati before long. I like to think that the Order of Hermes was absorbed into the Society, and that their dissolution in 1925 was a ruse.

The Invisibles - (Because I sort of liked the Virtigo comic) - an Anarchist group in Italy in the 18th century. They espoused violence, Athiesm, and Anarchy. If they survived, they would certainly be enemies of the Orderly Illuminati, but wouldn't be organized enough to be very effective.

The Order of the Rose Cross - the Rosicrucians - One of my personal favorites. They became public in 1614 with a pamphlet titled "Fama Fraternatis of the Meritorious Order of the Rosy Cross" and espoused a line of thought very similar to the New Age movement of today, that man could master his environment through a blend of enlightened Science and Mystical learning. A good view of this group is available in the game Witchcraft, by Myrmidian Press. They would either be an arm of the Society, or, more interestingly, a serious rival for control of the world. They would be smaller, and less influential than the Illuminati, but possibly much more powerful on the individual level, wielding technology and magick with equal ease. It's possible that Rosicrucian intervention kept the Rising from being much worse, and that their secretive actions kept the world from discovering how close it came to destruction.

My, that took a while. I hope you like it. I may come back later and do some replies, but now I'm going to rest my wrists.
David G. - [david]
Arlington, TX, USA
Monday, August 9, 1999 07:39:50 PM
IP: pppa41-fortworthb20-4r663.saturn.bbn.com

**enters the room, sporting headphones and listening to the midi Robby left over and over and over and over and over and ... well, you get the idea. Switches out the candles and sits down in the big chair**

**sigh** Such a great show ... too bad it's gone now. **sob**

Robby: Forgiven. :)
Seems as if the one person with that vote got *extremely* confused, using Christine's initials to designate the series (CM) ... then assuming that I'd created Christine! (considering that I prefer abbreviating the title of my series "G:CM") I noticed that she also credited me with Christine's version of Sevarius, as well.

Spike: Don't know if it's because I've seen them when they were running or if I've seen them second-hand ... but I recall those ads, too, along with OJ running through the airport. :)

Airwalker, re: sequels: Which is exactly the point I was trying to make with my idea for the opening of the film ... you also have to consider the possibility that the film will flop royally, in which case there wouldn't *be* any sequels, and subsequently we'd never get *any* original Gargs on *any* screen again. I say, if it's in the theater, take a chance on an original story within continuity, because you might not get another chance.

Mary: Congrats on converting your cousin to our madness. ;)
Makes me wonder if I could convert any of my sibs to the show *without* the car ... considering the only one I have that's younger than me might be the easiest chance ... which is really tasteless of me to say because she has CP. **slams forehead into linoleum flooring**

Fleur: Heh ... my Caddy came from the factory with a battering-ram front bumper. To tell the truth, I pity anyone who gets in an accident with me ... not so much because I'd kill them if they did, but more because if it's a newer car they're driving, more than likely it's going to wind up on the worse end of the punishment ... 'tis a relief to know I drive a car that could (theoretically) saw a Honda in half. :)

Stephen: Believe me, man ... you deserve it.

Pistoff: I know there's one mechanic in my town that *seriously* fails on the tattoos-to-fingers scale ... he has two *magnificent* tats, and only eight fingers. :P

Wilek: If you're serious about it, there are three MSTiers I know of ... you can let all three get their mitts in your work, like I have, if ya like. (FYI, Mandi is one of the three ... the other two are Cyrway and Mara Cordova)

Starsinger: My condolences ... if there's one thing I can't stand more than people forcibly enacting change on *me* at Godawful hours of the morning, it's people forcibly enacting change on my *neighbor* at Godawful hours of the morning. ;)
Oh, the "Lowrider" mag I mentioned the other night? Has some pics from the big Albuquerque lowrider show ... there are some *impressive* pieces of hardware here. While I don't particularly care for the hydraulic lift suspensions, the bouncing, or the dancing ... the cars *themselves* are the draw for me, even if it appears many of them are rendered undrivable. ("Eagle Warrior" is one example. It's this *magnificent* '78 Cutlass done up with full Aztec battle regalia and mural work ... only problem is that it has no *instrument panel* or *pedals,* not to mention any way to open the doors from the inside.)

James Birdsong: You probably won't be seeing any Dr. Forrester/Frank/Joel eps anytime soon, unless they're on video ... the Sci-Fi Channel only has the rights to show the last three seasons of MST3K; technically the first seven seasons' rights are still owned by Comedy Central, who has no room for them in its programming schedule.

And now for something completely different: A review of "Mystery Men" ... from an auto parts counterman's perspective.
**CONTAINS SPOILERS FOR "MYSTERY MEN!"**

I certainly enjoyed this movie, especially a lot of the jokes about comic book cliches ("Lance Kane wears glasses, Captain Amazing doesn't.") and the possibilities of superheroing becoming just another jerk jock job complete with endorsement contracts, publicity agents, and wannabes.

But what struck me most about this movie was all of the *car* references!! Somebody must *really* be a car nut in the production design team for this movie. Too many to list individually, but I'll give a few a shot for a short list:
*Champion City's police force drove '68 Camaros as patrol cars ... sweet!
*The Disco Boys' first appearance is accompanied by a *gorgeous* gold-plated white Cadillac that can't be any younger than '81. We're talkin' pimpmobile here. ;)
*Some of Captain Amazing's endorsements, marked by the patches on his uniform, included Jiffy Lube, Pennzoil, The Outlaw (a fuel additive) and Gumout (a brand of fuel system cleaner).
*Mr. Furious' costume, at different times, featured different car manufacturers' logos (probably from being assembled in a junkyard). Old costume's main feature was a Chrysler pentastar on the back of his left hand. New costume's main feature was the HUGE belt buckle with the Chevy bowtie.

Hmm ... either somebody *really* likes cars, or I'm looking *way* too hard. ;)
**END SPOILERS FOR "MYSTERY MEN!"**

Ash: Interesting theory there ...

*sits back in the big chair, focusing his gaze on the slow-burning flame of the candle**

Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Monday, August 9, 1999 07:38:56 PM
IP: modem55.i-is.com

Okay, OKAY! Now I'm pissed off!!!! To me, and this is me, Brooklyn is my hero! He's smart, being Second, and always gets out of sticky situations. He's funny: Never go out with a guy who doesn't have a sense of humor! He's romantic and says the sweetest things: He did win the heart of a rock hard warrior (Sata). He's a risk taker! This is someone who lives each day to the fullest. He had to since the Gate was throwing him in many depressing situations! He has a HUGE heart! Always helping those who need help, giving his life for others, and always hoping for the best! As for the appearence issue, you personally CAN NOT say what's beautiful and what's not! Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I think Brooklyn's gorgeous because he's DIFFERENT! The unique stand out. I adore his eyes, and his brick red shade (my fav color) is exotic. The beak... that's the charm! I always think he looks sophisticated! His voice, SEXY! My walls are covered with just pics of him! Finally, Brooklyn has the one thing that I wish I had... a wild spirit! So people, keep your remarks as opinions please! If you're unhappy that Brooklyn won first, too bad! Brooklyn Estrogen Squad for me :)

Thanks to JEB, Warpmind, Xanathar, Wilek, Kit, and any others I missed for the school year luck!

Kit> I'm a junior this year. I *wish* I was a senior!

Xanathar> Those back to school sales commercials depress me because I never have any money! I just finally talked my parents into letting me have a job.

My first day of school was... alright. It's 100 degrees in Texas here and 60 degrees in the school. I HATE that! All the teachers are okay, except the new Latin teacher! She thinks we can speak fluently or something. And a girl that I really don't get along with is in five of my classes! SIGH... well, it's school! What can I say?

MST3K> I always loved this show! My favorite ep, which I can't remember what movie, sang "He tried to kill me with a forklift...the music written for the train chase!" And a lot of their remarks are classic in my house! "Cooky, the meniacal clown has done it again!" :)
SOROW
Monday, August 9, 1999 06:31:19 PM
IP: usr11-dialup306.mix1.irving.cw.net

Reading the myths of Cuchulain I noticed that Manannan Mac Lir was lord of an island called "Emhain" (meaning "of apple trees"). Since Avalon also is an "island of apples" could there be a link between Oberon and Manannan Mac Lir?
One myth involving Manannan Mac Lir involved Cuchulainn, and Manannan's wife Fand. Now in this myth the Fand and her husban quarrelled and he left her. When she was attacked by fomorii (evil god-like creatures), she sent for Cuchulainn who defeated her enemies and spent one month there as her lover. Now supposing Fand and Mannan are really other identities of Titania and Oberon (respectively) would that mean Rory might get a sly glance from Titania in the future? :)
Ash
Monday, August 9, 1999 06:09:23 PM
IP: yktnsk01d01040116.sk.sympatico.ca

If they never came out in theaters I wouldn't mind seeing DTV movies [specificaly animated ones ] , but lets hope it dosen't come to that . I still believe that animated movies would be the best choice for a wide release. If they wanted to get more fans for the show , then they should make the movie like the show. otherwise they would be two different things. and they would only be fans of the movie and not the show . If the movie was like the show[animated] then it would bring more fans to the show.
Godzilla- I always loved Godzilla vs. Mechagodzilla, Godzilla 1985, and Godzilla vs. Biollante
traveler - [Goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Monday, August 9, 1999 05:35:31 PM
IP: proxy-343.public.rwc.webtv.net

Heylo, people of the TGS Comment Room. :)

Well, my weekend was rather uneventful, did stuff with my younger brother and his friend. Also hit the comic store downtown for the first time in months- my mom picked up some X-Men titles, and both of us were quite throughly confused by them. <:) Meant to do several things this weekend, including seeing "Mystery Men," but it didn't work out that
way. Still gotta see that, Tarzan, Blair Witch Project, and Iron Giant...

Also, saw the final episode of MST3K- I think it at least ended relatively well. :)

Ahwell...

Pistoff> <<I remember seeing some sort of "assault glider" or something like that>> That's the Night Striker vehicle. :) I seem to recall seeing those things still in stock at local stores...

Todd> I still contend that Titania would take over from Oberon, due to the fact that most of the sensible fay would recognize her competence... however, I also agree that various ambitious nobles would contest her claim... it would certainly make interesting times for Avalon, no? :)

Airwalker> <<Actually rather than an exploding Cyoti, how about one that comes packaged with it's own steel beam? >> That WOULD be better, yes... :) They could also make it possible for the same head to be used in each of the Coyotes, and you could attach that little anti-grav thingy to it too...
<<How many people here would love to see a direct to video Gargoyles movie>> DTV animated movies avoiding TGC would be terrific, but as Greg has said, it won't happen. TGC cannot be ignored. But a DTV series of movies that include TGC would also be great... :)

Spacebabie> I like anime all right- most of what I've seen is Americanized (or Canadianized) versions.

Godzilla> I dearly loved these movies when I was little- my favorites were Godzilla vs. Megalon, Godzilla vs. Mechagodzilla, and Destroy All Monsters. Still got 'em all on tape (except the ones after Godzilla 1985). :)

Wilek> Neat little Nereid site there. :)

Gargoyle Movie Responses> Airwalker, I LIKE the idea of fusing "Awakening" and "Reawakening" together for the film. :) Shauntell, I think you'll likely not see the Gargoyles movie if you will only go if Angela's present- she was added half-way through the saga, so I doubt she'd be in the film. SJ, I'm pretty sure the Gargoyles movie will be made (they've been at it for three years, that indicates there's
definitely interest in making it- otherwise they'd have given up three writers ago), but I agree it may not be what we hoped for. But I'll still go see it. :)

Robby> Interesting results on the Fandom Top 5. :) Of course, I already saw them... ;)

Mary> Congratulations on assimilating your cousin. ;) :)

Brooklyn, Angela, Broadway> I am a little curious why there were some cues in the 2nd season towards Brooklyn and Angela liking one another ("Gathering" II and "Reckoning," mainly), but they decided by "Hunter's Moon" and "Journey" to make Broadway and Angela get together. Not that I don't like it, because I was pleasantly surprised, but it seemed a bit odd with the earlier clues...

SOROW> School, already? Well, best of luck. :)

WB Glimmer!

Aaron> <<Wait a minute. Goliath fights an army of zombies in the Devlin script? Aaron conjures a mental image of Goliath, missing his right hand, brandishing a shotgun. "Alright you primative screwheads! This is my boomstick!">> *LOL!*

Indigo> Good story, not terrible much to say about it, save that I didn't expect the ending, and I could sympathize with Sabra. Nice job, Mrs. Morgan. :)

Wellp, I'm off to work on me site's next update... toodles!
JEB - [JEb215@aol.com]
Monday, August 9, 1999 05:17:18 PM
IP: abd38185.ipt.aol.com

Thank you Airwalker. It certainly sounds awful. I agree with every bad thing that was said about it. Absolutely vomitous.

Is DC any kin to HC (Mr. Hung Connection)? He's been bothering me all day. :Ţ

Today has been a Cavall day.

Jenniren
Monday, August 9, 1999 03:58:59 PM
IP: user-2ivf883.dialup.mindspring.com

The kissing scene between Goliath and Eliza would look corney in live action . and cgi gargoyles are alot more expensive thananimated ones. Probaly the only thing That would look better in live action wold be the battle scenes in the midevil scenes [if they went from beginnig to end and beyond].
traveler - [goliath01]
hobart, IN, usa
Monday, August 9, 1999 02:39:37 PM
IP: proxy-563.public.rwc.webtv.net

JENNIREN - We don't actually have the script, only a summary of it. Click on my name to see what Dean Devlin planned to do to Gargoyles.
Airwalker
Brooklyn, NY
Monday, August 9, 1999 02:00:05 PM
IP: 78.new-york-20-25rs.ny.dial-access.att.net

Aaron wanders into the CR, and smacks DC over the head with a shovel.

These things have a thousand and one uses.

Had a pretty good weekend, even if the temp was in the triple digits. Lot to catch up on, so bear with me if this starts to look like a Traveler post.

Rodeo class> Now there's one class where you *don't* want to be the class clown.

MST3K> At this point, I'd call it a mercy killing.

Airwalker> I'm afraid that was all they told us, that they'd have a trailer. I'd rather see a trade paperback format, myself, since they're easier to store. Pokemon is sort of unescapable. I now know more then I ever wanted about that show, and I've watched all of one episode.

Wilek> Yeah, great minds *do* think alike. Let's all root for a Miramax Garg movie. With them in charge, we might get to Pistoff's suggestion after all.

Pistoff> I got my car back okay, and pretty cheap too. Apparently my battery had just gotten kinda cruddy inside. Thanks for asking. The only beaked chick I can think of who isn't jailbait would be Eddie of Clan Winslow. I believe she's happily mated to somebody bigger then Goliath though.

David G> If TPM had come out first, Lucas would be a forgotten hack today.

Robby> More Matrix, eh? Cool.

Xanathar> No way! SPG is smarter and more loyal the Jerico.

Todd> Wait a minute. Goliath fights an army of zombies in the Devlin script? Aaron conjures a mental image of Goliath, missing his right hand, brandishing a shotgun.
"Alright you primative screwheads! This is my boomstick!"

Disembodied Brain of SJ> If you come back wearing a busty android, I'm gettin' a gun.

Spike> That would be the old Avis commercials, wouldn't it?

The movie, animated vs. live action> With all the CGI these days, what's the damn difference anymore?

***********Review w/spoilers for Blair Witch*************

I'm impressed. It's not really a horror movie per se, more of an atmospheric psychological drama showing what happens to people in very stressful circumstances. I can come up with a dozen different interpretations for this movie, all of them pretty scary. Well worth seeing. 3.5/5 skulls.

Note to self: In film school, stay away from any and all projects involving tramping around in the God-forsaken wilderness. Volunteer for nice safe projects, like prison documentaries on the Aryan Brotherhood.
*********************************************

*********Review w/spoilers for Mystery Men***************

I loved MM. It's sort of the antidote movie, if you're still creeped out by Blair Witch or the new Bruce Willis movie.

Just as a straight superhero-action movie, it's got the last two Batman installments beat all hollow. And the comedy skate a fine line between funny and vular, staying on the right side most of the time. (Except maybe the scene where the skunk gets friendly with The Spleen's leg)

Garafallo's tres creepy bowling ball with her father's skull inside it is a scene stealer, and I *love* Ben Stiller's costume. Wes Study shows up as the terribly mysterious Sphinx, and William H. Macy's Shoveler has got to be his best work since Fargo.

Overall, I enjoyed myself more at MM then I did at any of the summer's "Big Four"(TPM, AP2, WWW, and The Haunting) I hope for a sequel. Aaron Bob says 3.65/5 skulls, check it out.
***********************************************************

How does this sound for the MIB sequel? MIB2: Back in Black

Picked up a copy of The Bevis and Butthead Experience audio tape four a buck, and that's got to be the best dollar I've invested all month. Their version of "I got you babe" is worth it all by itself, and they have an exchange that would be funnier if it wern't so true.

"Hey, Beavis. I heard they're gonna have like 500 channels soon."

"Cool."

"You know what would be really cool, though? If they had *one* that didn't suck?"

And that, ladies and gentlemen, tells you everything you need to know about American TV.

Later.

Aaron wanders away, singing Queen's "Keep Yourself Alive"


Aaron - [JCarnage@Yahoo.com]
San Antonio, TX, USA
Monday, August 9, 1999 01:59:03 PM
IP: ppp-49.tnt-1.sat.smartworld.net

**Glimmer finds her way back into CR after 2 weeks**

Somebody please inflict a mass amount of bodily harm to DC for me!!

The few times I was able to make it into the room Mr. DC ate my posts which included my votes. And I'll probably have trouble getting into the room until Octoberish. Sporadic visits at best. *sigh*

Time to start hunting for a new job. Too bad, I liked being self-employed. Less chance of being fired.

Fluer> Wowza! Thank the stars you weren't physically hurt by those bozos. If they're caught *crosses fingers* I think a suitable punishment would be to force them into a demolishion derby. Sans car.

David G.> One of your posts will be on the subject of the Illuminate? Sounds very educational. In more ways than one. *drops her voice to a whisper* Just be careful about what you say. Don't give away too many of their secrets or make fun of them. They'll come after you for something like that.

Wilek> Umm... that link from last week (Sat.?) isn't a Brooklyn action figure. That's one of the Gargoyle costumes from Disney On Ice. Sorry, still obsessed.

Forgot absolutly everything I had planned on saying. One of those days.

**Glimmer leaves the room and heads to Christines site**
Glimmer
Monday, August 9, 1999 01:56:47 PM
IP: 12.73.8.42

Xanathar-How would you do it. A quick gunshot to the head or a very slow and painful torture [cuting off their ears so they can't here us when we enter the room] . O should we just tie them all to a wheelbaro and throw it off a cliff [but make it small enough so that they would be alive when the vultures come.
And you can add N'sync and all of the disney executives to the backstreet boys, hanson , and Dean Devlin.

traveler - [Goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Monday, August 9, 1999 01:02:53 PM
IP: proxy-423.public.paix.webtv.net

Ash, you said "I've never understood why Brooklyn was so popular among the female veiwers. He is ugly and scrawny after all... with a rather sarcastic nature. Most human guys
who are ugly, scrawny smart-asses are generally ignored :)".
Thanks a lot, pal.

Oh, and I noticed it is almost deadline for Avalon Mists now... too bad I couldn't get my top-ten list included. I really liked that top ten list. (Ask Christine nicely, and she might be persuadable to send it to you, unfortunately, I lost my copy when the school hard drives were reformatted just before the exams). Which reminds me: Christine, may I have a copy of that list back, pleeeeeze?

SOROW: School already? My condolances. I'm pretty much in the same boat, though, moving back to my dorm Friday and starting school again on Monday (which reminds me - that week will be HELL to catch up on any Joyride events... Xanathar, Wilek and Pistoff: If you guys could please make sure to file all the Joyride clippings from Thursday onward, I'd be much obliged) and has to suffer for yet another year of (mis)education.

Fleur: You say you've learned things here, partly through the Joyride. Well hear this: You Ain't Seen Nuttin' Yet!

Angie: You say you can't see what chicks dig in Brooklyn? Hey, I'm a guy, and I think I got a pretty good idea; he's got brains, he's Second-in-Command of a Clan (yeah, okay, a small clan, but really...) AND he likes to live on the wild side. Frankly, there are bits of him that remind me of Han Solo, and we all saw who he wound up with. For the record: I'm straight, if anyone should suspect something. I just have something of an observer's eye for what males and females in general find attractive. (Now, if I only could manage to take advantage of that knowledge... *sigh*) I percieve Brooklyn as something of a ladies ma... garg, the same way I'd say that Lexington is "The cute one". But you all knew that.

Pistoff: You want a race for that beaked chick? Oh, um, I mean... thanks for the compliment on the Joyride page.

Oh, and what stupid customers concern: I doubt anyone can beat one that arrived at the library a couple of weeks ago: He comes in, walking like he owns the world, then sets his eyes on me, the only person behind the counter, looks around at the bookshelves and asks "Do you lend out books here?" I kid ye not, he actually asked if we LENT OUT BOOKS! I answered that "No, sir, we do not. This is a joint hardware store and bakery." Then he said "Thanks. Just wanted to check." and walked out of the library. Now, I'm not sure about this, but I *did* hear about someone who managed to escape from a mental institution on the mainland recently.

Xanathar: I've not yet seen that Dean Devlin script, but hey, if you say he's a candidate for the Joyride, I'll take your word for it. I gotta get to clean out my chemical storage soon, anyway ;)

Okay, no time to write more, so I can't continue the Joyride tonight :( but maybe tomorrow.

Later, everyone (oh, and of all the TGS gargs, I tink Angela is probably the only one I'd consider dating... maybe if Ariana was a few years older ;) and Brooklyn gave his consent).

I'll be back.
Warpmind de InzanE - [de_InzanE@xoommail.com]
Middle, Nowhere, Norway
Monday, August 9, 1999 12:57:08 PM
IP: mp-217-242-209.daxnet.no

Thanks for telling me Mandolin. Dean Devlin> I only know of Burke Devlin from Dark Shadows.
James Birdsong - [LennexMacDuff@yahoo.com]
San Diego, CA, USA
Monday, August 9, 1999 12:06:48 PM
IP: dt049n74.san.rr.com

Brooklyn isn't my favorite, but I've never perceived him as ugly or scrawny. He's lean, but not scrawny. And his beak makes him look different enough from a human that I don't use the same standards of beauty to judge him as I would a gargoyle with a more human face - just as I don't use the same standards of beauty to judge a horse's appearance as I would a human's. My mind sort of shifts gears. Also I like Brooklyn's voice. A lot of the way I feel about a character depends on what their voice sounds like. Guess how I feel about Hyena. The only time I don't like Brooklyn is when he's trying to show off how cool he is and comes off looking like a silly ass. That's probably what turned Angela off of him. But I don't feel too sorry for him about his loss of Angela. I think Sata is better for him - probably similar to what Katana would have been in Greg's series.

Jenniren
Monday, August 9, 1999 10:54:33 AM
IP: user-2ivf0b5.dialup.mindspring.com

Please someone send me the link for the Dean Devlin script so I can see what people are talking about.

Jenniren - [jenniren@mindspring.com]
Monday, August 9, 1999 10:39:58 AM
IP: user-2ivf0b5.dialup.mindspring.com

Wilek>here you go. :)
Mary Flanders
Monday, August 9, 1999 10:27:38 AM
IP: ramp-1-29.ucdavis.edu

James> As far as I know, Sci-Fi will be running reruns of the episodes through the year 2000. I don't know whether or not they will be showing reruns of the episodes aired on Comedy Central, however.

Wilek> I'd be glad to try to MiST your stuff... after I get "Apocalypse" finished and find something MiSTiable of Coyote's, that is. :)
Mandolin - [weird_web@hotmail.com]
Monday, August 9, 1999 09:47:46 AM
IP: ch164-10.apgea.army.mil

Sixth sense> This is not a spoiler but GO see this film it was great and those of you who have seen it Don’t post spoilers it will ruin the film for all the others. One warning go early I saw people sitting on the floor when I saw it.
Congrats For the Fandom Winners.

Must work latter guys and gals

ironwolf
Monday, August 9, 1999 09:44:15 AM
IP: host-216-78-83-6.cha.bellsouth.net

MST3K> So is it gonna be shown still in reruns or is it truely gone for good? If it is reruns now I hope it's of the first five seasons with the original Dr. Forester of TV's Frank. They are better then Pearl, Proffersor Bobo, and Observer aka Brain Guy.
James Birdsong - [LennexMacDuff@yahoo.com]
San Diego, CA, USA
Monday, August 9, 1999 09:32:27 AM
IP: dt049n74.san.rr.com

THERESA - You wrote: [Has anyone ever considered that Disney could do a proper remake of The Journey?]

I would like to see that. On the other hand, to do a remake of THE JOURNEY is even more complicated than to do a remake of AWAKENINGS. THE JOURNEY isn't an origin story. It's a change in the status quo of an on-going saga story. If they were going to do something ala Star Wars with groups of 3 movies for each part of the saga then I could see them doing a remake of THE JOURNEY in the fifth movie since the first one has to be a simple stand alone origin (AWAKENINGS) and the other three can play off of that (CITY OF STONE, AVALON and HUNTERS MOON).

You wrote: [They have 65 episodes of Gargoyles to act as infomercial to the new movie.]

We as fans would love to sit through the entire series and watch it over and over again until Greg is allowed to create something new. But this movie isn't for us so much. It's for those who have never seen the show and don't know anything about it. It's for those who might have seen the show on television and changed the channel saying "It's just a cartoon." It's for people who didn't and wouldn't watch the show on television. This is a way to get them interested. If they aren't interested before the movie then they aren't going to watch the series no matter how many times it's shown. This idea would work much better if in the aftermath of the movie, if then the show is shown over and over again for people who saw the movie and became interested and will want to see more.


GARGOYLES MOVIE IDEA - I was watching LEGION last night and with all this talk about the movie it got me to thinking. If they do a remake of AWAKENINGS then it could be possible to change Xanatos' plan to include Coldstone. Instead of sending the clan after 3 disks which would make a movie audience wonder "why didn't he just send dozens of heavily armed human mercenaries or just give out huge bribes to get the info", how about having him send them after specific technology that would enable him and Demona to be able to bring a Gargoyle back to life and create a loyal cyborg?

It could work great feeding into Demona's feelings of lonliness over a thousand years as well as guilt for the part she played in her families death in that in this version she is trying to her resurrect her family - first by getting Goliath and company awake, and then by finding a way to get those who were smashed awake. But since Demona is the villian of the piece and a bit warped by a thousand years of hate and wandering, of course her plan has to be a bit messed up with the addition of turning all of those cyborg Gargoyles (of which Coldstone was meant to be the first) into loyal warriors that wouldn't disobey her and would help her in her quest to destroy humanity.

It's a great way to work Colstone in, drives a wedge between Demona and Goliath faster than in the series, and it would be great to see the scheming and the counter scheming between Xanatos and Demona as they each fight for control of the clan and of Coldstone.

Plus who here wouldn't love to see a CGI Coldstone?
Airwalker
Brooklyn, NY
Monday, August 9, 1999 09:29:19 AM
IP: 49.new-york-26-27rs.ny.dial-access.att.net

Hi all!!

I think I'll take a night off from the RP tonight as well.

SOROW:Tomorrow...is...my...first...day...of...school.....AAAAAUUUUUUUGGGGGHHHH!!!!!>>ouch I'm feeling for you SOROW,Going back to school was always a depressing experience made worse by the fact that about a week before you went back the tv would be loaded with back to school sales commercials.

Robby:Thank you for putting together the Fandom poll.

Traveler:I just read the summary of the Dean Devlin script and I just laughed alloud . Did he really expect anyone [especially us] to see it . He must have some sort of deathwish if he was really serious about it.>>Having seen the Dean Devlin summary last time the Movie topic came up I agree with you,It was appalling!!,as for him having a deathwish,Fellow Joyriders I vote that we hunt down Dean Devlin after we're done with the Backstreet Boys and Hanson>:)

Goodnight all!!
Xanathar
Melbourne, victoria, Australia
Monday, August 9, 1999 07:19:08 AM
IP: 203.29.192.74

Fleur I'm glad your ok. I ride a bike and take the bus to work. As someone who plays 'dodge car' all the time I know just how stupid other drivers are.

Stephen - As someone who works on their feet all day, I have sympathy. This saturday was bad. My back up prep person quit wednesday and even though onion ring month has been replaced with milk shakes, I had more than the usual load of rings to do. Add grocery truck day and one warm body short up front (small loss), I ended up working nine hours. I finally got home, unwound, and went to bed at 8:00 (yes, I crash early). I was just getting to sleep when The Turn Around Albuquerque group decided to get in the face of the apartments next door. <SIGH> I can't win. They have their bullhorns, sirens, whistles, and chants around 200 strong and a police and firetruck escort. Their primary purpose is to get in the face of drug dealers and the like. They haven't been next door for over two years. Why last night? Being the tolerant, patient person I am, I put up with this stupidity for about fifteen minutes and called the police to complain. All the noise was freaking the cats and I was in danger of a stress asthma attack. They got lost within five minutes of my call.

Hey, I've called the police on the apartments next door for their willingness to share their music, or for being the poster child for partners for domestic violence verbal division, or even the idiots who thinks it's fun to shoot guns off at three or four in the mornings. Why should community activists be excluded. I'm soooo glad sunday was quiet and nothing was going on.

Has anyone ever considered that Disney could do a proper remake of The Journey? They have 65 episodes of Gargoyles to act as infomercial to the new movie. A sort of reverse make a cartoon series then the movie ads. 65 chances to sell the movie with ads and placement of the series on the Disney Channel and Disney Toon Channel. Just think, as each episode is aired, an movie commercial, at the end of two months with the Hunter's Moon finally, you get the Movie about what happens afterwards. With Greg in charge of course.

Starsinger
Theresa - [Starsinger@Webtv.net]
Monday, August 9, 1999 05:35:49 AM
IP: proxy-313.public.rwc.webtv.net

I never really liked brooklyn too much . he always seemed like the type that would get killed off at one point. Goliath should have been number 1. I can find alot of reasons for liking him. He's been through alot [the loss of his angel love , being betrayed] , and I think that he is very strong[mentally , phisically ,and emotionally. exept for that slight temper]. And his decision to get frozen in stone with his companions was amazing. I know he would have had no place to go , but he felt what it was like to be truly alone , and he faced that awful possibility that he might never re-awaken , He has guts. he also was faces with the fact that his former love had turned against him . He has experienced more pain than most of the other characters in the series and that needs to be recognized . what has brooklyn had to face , Angelas' decision of Broadway over him. Get over it brook' , you were trying too hard.
traveler - [Goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Monday, August 9, 1999 04:19:21 AM
IP: proxy-343.public.rwc.webtv.net

**No RP tonight. For some reason, my brain refuses to kick into that mode just now. :/ <brandishes cattle prod> Where are those lazy little creativity divas. Let's see how they react to me tossing THIS in their fish tank...**

Airwalker> <<I spent the last hour typing, I had this huge post and I was about to send it when my computer froze and I lost everything.>> That happened to me once. They're still looking for the pieces of Mr. Disconnect. From then on, I composed my posts completely in Notepad and I save every minute or so. He's made me paranoid. :) I'm rather impressed by how well you've thought out the Gargs movie. I wish you could be in charge of making it. <G> <<it's Touchtone itself that is making the decision.>> Eh? <sigh> I was hoping for Miramax, for reasons that will become clear. >:)

Shauntell> <<I will NOT watch any rated R movies, PERIOD. Angela must be in the gargoyles movie, or I will NOT see it. If it's PG -13, it better not have any sexual content whatsoever, cause I WON'T watch it if it does. Sex is a beautiful thing, but if Hollywood, it's a nightmare. It's all they think about. That's why I don't see many movies.>> Heh...not all R-rated movies have sexual content, or even unacceptable language. The Omen and its sequel (which I saw tonight and loved), for example--near as I can tell, the only basis for their R ratings are a few moments of gore.

Xanathar> <<Thanks for the Sly Sludge death,it was a thing of beauty>> You're quite welcome. >:)

Entity> <<It will be rated G. No way is Disney gonna invest in a movie and have chunks of its potential audiences trimmed from the start.>> What if they have Miramax do it? I mean look at the sick stuff they're known for. >:)

The Discorporated Cerebrum of Sevarius Jr> <<This movie will never see the light of day. Seriously. I love the show, but I just don't think the market for the movie is there, and so far Disney hasn't shown any real excitement for the project. It's still wasting away in development hell.>> You're probably right, but it's nice to dream. :) Besides, the laws of probability have the interesting habit of going artfully insane in the vicinity of Gargoyles. This could still have a happy ending. <<Blair Witch Reviews: *Sigh* Well, I liked it at least. And for about 10 seconds it seemed like other people did too>> I haven't seen it (waiting for the DVD), but I think it's going to *rock*. :)

SOROW> <<Tomorrow...is...my...first...day...of...school...>> ACK! My condolences, friend.

Ash> <<I've never understood why Brooklyn was so popular among the female veiwers. He is ugly and scrawny after all...>> Ugly and scrawny? Heh...I think I'll sit back and watch the more eloquent Brook fans in the room give more detailed and enthusiastic rebuttals. Me, all I can really say is, I wish *I* had a beak. Why does this manner of thing have to skip a generation?! >:/

Speaking of MST3K, would whoever does such things to fanfics in here mind unleashing the boyz upon my own misguided little efforts (at my name link)? Thx! ^_^

Randomness> Anyone here seen Damien: Omen II? Now that is a frightening little movie--made even more so by the fact that Damien is eerily reminiscent of a friend of mine...o_O

Mary Flanders> <<the help of some drawing tips from Aimee's website>> What's the URL of this site? <<But what I really wish is that she didn't have M.S.>> ACK. I'm so sorry; it's terrible when a loved one is forced to suffer through something like that. :(

All newcomers> Welcome! <wheels in Mr. Thingy, in sanity extraction mode> Who's first? <all the newcomers run away from the fearsome-looking machine> I've got to find a better way of doing this...

Jatbird> <<if you don't like it, I'll eat a piece of paper>> I'm a Mozart fan. Bon appetit. ;P j/k

Fleur> <<Besides, if you did, there'd probably be headlines the next day about George having a heart attack.>> Heart attack? Try coming unhinged and going on a killspree. And Gaia forbid that Ewan himself (not to mention Alec Guiness!) finds out about this. >;)

Pistoff> <<IMO, normal is boring>> Heh heh heh...that all depends...is the normality genuine? Some seemingly 'normal' people are decidedly other than normal once one gets to know them. I speak from experience. >:) Besides, normal is in the eye of the beholder. For example, the following is the kind of thing that is considered 'normal' here in the CR: [Mr. Disconnect runs screaming through the room, chased by a herd of possessed penguins wielding emerald sporks.] There's no way something like that could go unnoticed in the mundane world. >:)
Wilek Nereus
Monday, August 9, 1999 03:32:56 AM
IP: tnt-2-146-56k.portsmouth.zoomnet.net

Gargoyles movie- I just read the summary of the Dean Devlin script and I just laughed alloud . Did he really expect anyone [especially us] to see it . He must have some sort of deathwish if he was really serious about it. Somebody needs to contact Greg Weisman and tell him he needs to start doing something with this and soon , before we all go crazy . And I hope that he has plans for a well written , beautifully animated movie[s] that will have everything to do with the series. First should come a longer version of the awakening , so the ignorent majority would know what the hell this is all about . And it would need to be more complete , at least 30 more minutes . After that would come "city of stone","avalon", "the gathering", and "hunters moon". Each one of these would eventually lead to another movie , which would come after the journey. The south park movie put it's series back in the spotlight . The same will probaly happen to pokemon when it's movie comes out in november. and both of them were animated . The gargoyles movie would definetly be better [and closer] to the series if animated . But that won't be possible if disney keeps on being so greedy and won't lend their services . Gargoyles was a lot better than all of the other crap that they came out with .
And as for best characters- even though I didn't know about the voting until it was done , here's how I would have voted in this catagory[by only using the t.v. series] Goliath, [of course] Demona, Eliza, Thailog, and Brooklyn.He didn't deserve to be first in my opinion.
Thank you for welcoming me here .
I am just traveler [previously unknowing of the other guy when I picked this name ].
traveler - [Goliath01@hotmail.com]
hobart, IN, usa
Monday, August 9, 1999 03:27:24 AM
IP: proxy-343.public.rwc.webtv.net

Ack! Forgot to use my text color! Heh, told ya my brain was fried...;P
Pissy
Monday, August 9, 1999 03:15:54 AM
IP: 207.48.109.31

Warpmind: S'okay. I was just grumpy last night, is all. Of course, I'm rarely anything *but* grumpy... ;) Anyway, I checked out the Joyride page and I loved it! Great work! :)

Entity: Well, for one thing, a live-action movie would probably be more expensive than an animated one. And personally, I'd just prefer an animated film, anyway.

Gyre: Nifty idea, there. But I still like the black hole. Not even Oberon could get out of that one. He would be stretched infinitely thin and infinitely long. The process is commonly known as "spaghettification." :)

Coyote: Ah, that's a handy scale. I'll keep that in mind. :)

Demona Testosterone Legion: Count me in! (But then, everybody probably figured that out a long time ago...;)

Fleur: I'm glad that addition to the Joyride made you feel better. :) I wish you the best of luck in bringing those worthless bastards to justice and getting your car fixed.

Angie: Remember the saying about beauty being in the eye of the beholder. It's been my experience that people who describe somebody else as "ugly" are doing so because they feel inferior (either because of their looks, or any other reason), and insulting somebody else makes them feel better about themselves. Personally, I think Brooklyn's not bad-looking at all. In fact, I've always been drawn toward people/characters who *aren't* like "everybody else" because, IMO, normal is boring. To be honest, if I ever ran into a female who looked like Brooklyn--horns, beak, and so on--I'd be the first one to invite her to dinner and a movie.

Uggh, brain's fried after another long day at work. Sometimes I feel as if the customers' stupidity is draining some of my own brainpower. This job certainly taps my will to live, on occasion. ;) Oh well, I just work tomorrow, then I have a couple of days off. I should be able to get the ol' gears turning by then....
Pistoff - [pistoff@outgun.com]
Monday, August 9, 1999 03:12:48 AM
IP: 207.48.109.31

Just put up a more complete version of the fandom poll with actual vote counts and all the runners up, and a couple of corrections in S8. In other words, go visit Station 8.

Why we like Brooklyn- I can't speak for the ladies who like him, heck, I can't speak for anyone but myself. But there's a couple of reasons. First and foremost, is that wild, carefree but I'm loyal to my friends and a romantic at heart attitude of his. Then, there's his appearance, which some say is ugly, but I really like. The wild mane of white hair, rather than showing age displays an unnaturalness to him, and element that most people don't possess until they are much older. The horns that curve back look pretty spiffy, and those eyes have something to them that almost none of the other characters have. Its the beak I suppose most people have a problem with, but I find it unique, and it shows off a great variety of emotions and allows for a nice smile. Maybe its being raised on Ninja Turtles that makes the beak look cool, but I like it. And of course, the red coloring with the blue loin cloth just shows fashion sense. The glider type wings show more of that style, and then toss in the fact that Brooklyn is a romantic at heart, well... There's a lot to like about him. (Incidentally, the smile, eyes, blue clothing, and white hair including cut are all traits he shares with ElfQuest's Skywise... Another general fan favorite...) Anyone else care to say why they like their faves?

Fluer- Nope. I was too busy being hurt at the time to notice the guy's license plate, so, nope.

The song attached is in honor of the show that died tonight.
Robby
Monday, August 9, 1999 03:07:41 AM
IP: spider-we061.proxy.aol.com

[Comes in, bearing the statuette of "The Golden Dude" (no! not that one!), shaking his head...]

Not really sure I deserve the accolade, after all, there's those that have done a lot more than I did so far in fanfic and the fandom... But, thanks to everyone that voted for me! It's good to hear that people think I'm popular enough to warrent something like this. All the feedback and comments do a lot to keep me going as a writer, and without you--the readers--it just wouldn't be fun or worth a lot of the effort.

So, from me to you, thanks for reading, and keep on reading too. :)

ELEKTRA - Chris is right, I did spur the interest in Elektra, but she's her character. I just borrow her for my stories; nothing more, nothing less.

Maintain and Check Six!
Stephen "Coldstone" Sobotka, Jr. - [scififangargoyle@yahoo.com]
Spokane, WA, USA
Monday, August 9, 1999 02:57:54 AM
IP: m24.ieway.com

Well, Ash, you must remember that not every female likes Brooklyn. I like Goliath and Thailog.(well, 'course I like Goliath why else would I have that e-mail name) Personally I agree with you about him being a scrawny, ugly, smartass. I just don't understand why or how anyone could like him for his looks 'cause heh, face it, he's UGLY. Hey, you Brooklyn lovers, yeah you, over here. Could you please explain to me what you see in him? E-mail me at my e-mail address, kay? Ooh, and I'd like to thank Mara Cordova, who ticked me off majorly with her little story.(the one where she called Goliath a, uh,(takes a deep breath)(says through teeth) Barney-impersonating blow-honk. Or something like that!!! She inspired me to pick that e-mail name that I had thought about picking but was a little embarassed to choose. Once again thanks. She took my flame (no more like inferno) well. She's pretty cool despite what she said about Goliath. Let me shut up now.
Angie - [Goliathgirl@yahoo.com]
USAMonday, August 9, 1999 02:00:03 AM
IP: dialupk153.sttl.uswest.net

Hi all!
*Hugs everybody* Thanks for the support guys, I really appreciate it. *sigh* So far, I haven't heard anything from the police, although a neighbour saw the van dumped at the side of the road about four hours after the accident.

*SHAMELESS PLUG*
My latest fic, 'Trick or Treat' is up at the archives. Go read, go read!!
*THIS HAS BEEN A SHAMELESS PLUG*

Paul> >Name one thing that suggested she was possibly in love with him.< There was nothing that suggested Angela was in love with Brooklyn, but there were quite a few things that suggested they were headed in that direction. That scene in 'The reckoning', just after Brooklyn got zapped and Angela glided down to help him was one. The rest have all been covered by Robby and Airwalker and the others.

Christine><send it to George? Do I _look_ suicidal to you? ; ) I'm sure he's _much_ more forgiving than the Big Bad Mouse would be ... <shivers>< Yeah, you're right. *grins evilly* Besides, if you did, there'd probably be headlines the next day about George having a heart attack. ;)

Robby> >Haven't been able to go bikeriding since, my bike isn't rideable any more.< Oooh, my sympathies. Did they actually catch the guy who hit you?

Happy birthday Lady Ariana.

Coyote> >Just what exactly was this car you were driving?< An '80 Mazda. With a true metal bumper bar. (Not the tin-foil variety in the newer cars.) My friend's suggesting I replace it with a bull-bar. I'm tempted. :)

Spacebabie, traveler (jr? 2?)> Welcome to the CR!

Pistoff> *reads joyride and laughs her head off* I think I enjoyed reading that little slice of revenge _too_ much. >:) (I'm having a hard time resisting the urge to go around to the owner's house and have a liiitle chat with him. Only thing stopping me is that if the guy had his van stolen by the >censored< who hit me, he doesn't need me coming over and trying out some of the stuff I've learnt here on him. >:))

Xanathar> <Interesting story,last night police were outside of my house with tracking dogs looking for a burgular in the
neighborhood and they found him in my backyard, they set the dogs on him and then beat him up and finally carted him off,the worst thing about this is that I SLEPT THROUGH THE WHOLE THING!!> Owch. But maybe it was better that you did sleep through it. Who knows what could have happened?

Congratulations to all winners of the gargoyles poll!!!

TTFN!
Fleur - [newgoyle@hotmail.com]
Monday, August 9, 1999 01:47:54 AM
IP: donkey.cc.monash.edu.au

Hey folks, check out WJSE.COM- the hottest station broadcasting on the net in RealAudio-if you don't like it, I'll eat a piece of paper
jatbird - [jbird@wjse.com]
somers point, NJ, usa
Monday, August 9, 1999 01:35:03 AM
IP: spider-wc073.proxy.aol.com

*enters*

Ahhh....I feel so much better now that I've seen a half hour of my beloved show. :)

The hike I had with my family went pretty much OK. My sister didn't whine for once and I got a really cool pencil that's also a stick! :)(I know what you're thinking: Whoopy-doo) when I got home, I worked on a drawing of my character's sister (with the help of some drawing tips from Aimee's website. Thanks Aimee!!! *HUGZ*) and it came out looking really good for my second try! But alas, I made the stupid mistake of trying to color it in coloring pen. Now the face has a dark chin and light forhead and looks terrible! :( Oh well, I can draw more tomorrow. :)

At long last! I have converted my dear cousin Pam to the Path of our Defenders of the Night! I told her about the show two years ago when my dad, sister and I went to visit her in her small "chicken-coup house" in San Diego. I probably told her the whole story of the show in under 30 seconds I was so excited (she could tell, that kind of trait runs in the family :) But the show had been canceled the following week before she could watch it. So now she has seen it and thought it was fantastic! She says she will definetly watch more of it. :) But what I really wish is that she didn't have M.S. Then we could both go to the Gathering and meet everyone there. My parents aren't about to take me to a convention of any kind and they would feel REALLY uncomfortable around people wearing gargoyle costumes and things. I think my cousin would find it to be pretty wild. :) She's so cool, I love her to death! Now if only the rest of my family was like her...:)

*exits*
Mary Flanders
Monday, August 9, 1999 12:49:16 AM
IP: ramp-1-10.ucdavis.edu

VISIT STATION EIGHT!
VISIT STATION EIGHT!

Coyote- Ack. Bit of a boo boo I made... Blame whoever first voted for Elektra as "Elektra from CM fanfics by Don Martinez" for the typo... Missed that in the hoard of entries... Ah well... I'll try to remember to fix that error and some of the others typos I made when I post the list to Station 8...

Mystery Science Theater- The show will be missed for what it was. Heck, it coined its own term that all fandoms use, even those that didn't like the show. "Mistied" stories and movies are part of our culture now, and thats really something. The final episode wasn't that great unfortunatley. The movie they mocked really wasn't as bad as some they've mistied before, it was just boring and stupid. They should have done another Gamera movie, or a Sinbad the Sailor movie... Those were their best bits... However, the final scene was good, as they ended up seeing a movie they made fun of in the beggining...

Spike- Ooh, I recognize that commercial from somewhere...
Robby
Monday, August 9, 1999 12:09:43 AM
IP: spider-to064.proxy.aol.com

COYOTE - You wrote: [But you're forgetting one thing, though ... there are certain folks in the fandom (myself included)
who will *not* want to sit through a live-action re-filming of "Awakenings" (images of the recent remake of Psycho come to mind with me on that issue)]

I'm not so anxious to sit through a re-filming of AWAKENINGS either although if it was shown I would definetly go (and probably repeatedly). I also would like to see some new material done. But we can't forget that as fans, we are a small minority who know the continuity of the show and know the characters personalities. But the general public is completely in the dark. That's how any movie has to be approached unless it has a monumental fan base. So while it might not be desirable to use to see a redo of AWAKENINGS at the same time it would be necessary for those who have never seen anything associated with Gargoyles or for those who only saw one episode here and there in passing and so on. They need that origin story and since Disney is not about to release the actual original version of AWAKENINGS in theater's so that the public will be prepared to watch a live action original Gargoyles movie, it has to be done in the actual movie itself.

As for it being a remake in the same way that Psycho was recently, I don't think that that is going to happen. All indications seem to be that Touchtone actually would like to come up with something original yet at the same time an origin story. Since something completely new would mess with continuity we know and at the same time an origin is needed, it seems that a revised version of AWAKENINGS is the best compromise/solution. The plot is perfect anyway you look at it. It's just the minor details that would change.

(This might even be the problem that is delaying completion of the script. The writers (if they are smart) might have seen AWAKENINGS or read a synopsis of it and see that it's pretty much perfect as an origin story but at the same time they are being ordered to take this origin story and come up with something similier yet original and it just hasn't worked out yet.)

You wrote: [will want something original that *hasn't* been told already. That may be a small minority, but it's an audience that still exists. Even if it *is* an "Awakening" retelling, I'll still go ... but I'm just saying what I would *prefer* to see in the film.]

I would love to see something new. I would love to see a live action movie set in the aftermath of either HUNTERS MOON or THE JOURNEY that would invalidate TGC and at the same time tell a great Gargoyles story. But this is a movie that has to help expand the fanbase. This is a movie that has to introduce an ignorant public to Gargoyles. As much as I would love to see something firmly following where the show left off, this opportunity shouldn't be squandered. An simple origin story has to be done to capture the imagination of those who don't know about the show yet. Later on, when the movie is a success and they are talking about sequels, then is the time to argue that it would be best to have something original and steeped in continuity.
Airwalker
Brooklyn, NY
Monday, August 9, 1999 12:03:43 AM
IP: 79.new-york-01-02rs.ny.dial-access.att.net

"I may only be Number Two, but we try harder..."
(And if you can name the commercial THAT one came from, you must be old too...)

Thank you very much to everyone that sent in their votes! I'm very flattered to have been nominated in so many different categories! I deeply appreciate it!
Spike
Sunday, August 8, 1999 11:59:56 PM
IP: bart.airmail.net

"I'd like to thank the Academy ... but most of all, the readers, whose feedback and encouragement make this the most rewarding thing I've ever done. Thank you! Everyone!"

To give credit where it's due, yes, I created Elektra, but if Stephen hadn't gotten intrigued by her, I might have taken a lot longer to develop her as a character.

I'll be away from Wednesday to Sunday next week. Going to Ashland. This year I'm seeing: Othello and Much Ado (both of which I have on tape with K. Branagh already). And a version of the Three Musketeers.

Avalon Mists > deadline for the next issue is Wednesday, August 25th. Still time to get those fics, pics, filks, poems, cartoons, surveys, and anything else (G or PG only) sent in! E-mail them to me, vecna@eskimo.com

Christine - [vecna@eskimo.com]
Sunday, August 8, 1999 11:43:35 PM
IP: vecna.ndip.eskimo.net

**enters the room, switching out the candles with a black one ... with "MST3K" printed on it in white**

A moment of silence for the passing of a TV institution.



There. Now for some replies ...

First thing's first: Robby: Thanks for posting the results of the poll ... but I just need to make one correction, because you credited me for a character I didn't create (Elektra, which most of us know is Christine Morgan's character). I am certainly honored to be considered in this elite group ... but I *must* tip my hat to those that I voted for that made the list in the writing category (Christine, Spike, Stephen, Skydancer and Cyrway).
I *am* going to be wanting to see the rest of those results, friend. :)

Wilek, re: "Curse of the Ravening" and the Ravyn figure: Of course it wasn't intentional, I would highly doubt that any of the writers involved with CotR even know that our own, sweet Ravyn **sigh** even exists. It's just a reeeeeeeally screwy coinkydink, is all.

Skippy, re: Blair Witch: **WARNING! CONTAINS SPOILERS!!**
My mom was just telling me the other night that a big part of that film she didn't make the connection with until the next afternoon *after* she'd seen it ... remember the story about the killer who killed two children at a time, but made one of the kids stand facing a corner because he couldn't stand looking in their eyes? When the ending hit, mom didn't figure out why the guy was standing in the corner ... then it suddenly dawned on her the next day.
**END SPOILERS**

**sobs** The final MST3K just ended.

Airwalker, re: "info dump": But you're forgetting one thing, though ... there are certain folks in the fandom (myself included) who will *not* want to sit through a live-action re-filming of "Awakenings" (images of the recent remake of Psycho come to mind with me on that issue), and will want something original that *hasn't* been told already. That may be a small minority, but it's an audience that still exists. Even if it *is* an "Awakening" retelling, I'll still go ... but I'm just saying what I would *prefer* to see in the film.

Pistoff: We usually gauge the collective IQ of our customers by a scale we call the "tattoos-to-teeth" ratio. The more tattoos and the less teeth, the dumber the people are. (Believe me, people come in bearing *sleeves* worth of tattoos ... and not having a damned tooth in their heads! :))
You definitely don't want to go into the *other* scale, the one only I use ... the "tattoos-to-fingers" ratio. :P

Kitainia, re: doing all right: I certainly hope so, too ... **sighs sadly, looking to the candle, before continuing**

Todd: Uhmm ... hmm ... "Demona Testosterone Legion?!" **snickers quietly** Uhmm, couldn't we be something other than a "legion?" Maybe a "team," or a "troop?" :)

**sits back in the big chair, sighing sadly and fixating once more**
Coyote the Bando - [1134@i-is.com]
Algonac, Michigan
Sunday, August 8, 1999 11:15:06 PM
IP: modem23.i-is.com

Hi again. I was working on Freelance, and came across a little factoid I need to know. Does anybody know what an official government license plate from Great Britain would look like. I need to know the colors and what the numbers would look like.

Thanks.
David G. - [david_goodner@yahoo.com]
Arlington, TX, USA
Sunday, August 8, 1999 11:14:23 PM
IP: pppa18-fortworthb5-5r522.saturn.bbn.com

I've never understood why Brooklyn was so popular among the female veiwers. He is ugly and scrawny after all... with a rather sarcastic nature. Most human guys who are ugly, scrawny smart-asses are generally ignored :)
Ash
Sunday, August 8, 1999 10:20:39 PM
IP: yktnsk01d01040143.sk.sympatico.ca

Boy, Brooklyn and Demona really are very popular among the fans! Look at how many votes they must have won in the contest! (Of course, given the fact that they're both very intriguing characters - Demona especially - that may not be too surprising. Although, if you want to be cynical about it, you could also assume that most of Brooklyn's votes came from the female fans and Demona's from the male fans - the Brooklyn Estrogen Squad and the Demona Testosterone Legion, to be precise :)
Todd Jensen - [merlyn@ninenet.com]
St. Louis, MO
Sunday, August 8, 1999 09:56:13 PM
IP: 209-223-92-173.dialup-stl.primary.net

**EXCITING RP HERE DETAILING THE DEATH OF A MAJOR VILLAIN**

Guod's disembodied head comes rocketing out of the Devastator, but Doug and Kitainia are very close behind. "Give up the chase!" Guod shouts at them as a shotgun blast from Doug hits him in the neck, damaging his rocket booster and forcing him into a hover. "You're wasting time trying to kill me! Any moment now the Devastator will explode!" "We'll take the risk of dying to finish you off!" Doug declares, firing another shot at Guod's face. Kitainia rakes the evil clone's head with laser fire as it dodges, then comes down on it in a drop-kick. This knocks Guod back into the hole he just rocketed out of, screaming "No!!!!" as his head plummets back to the depths of the great machine. "He's not getting out of there," Doug declares, pulling a couple live grenades from his backpack and throwing them after Guod. Their muffled explosions soon echo from the depths, along with a computer voice saying, "This ship will self-destruct in thirty seconds. Have a nice day." "Doug, we have to get out of here!" Kitainia shouts. "Kit, there's no way we're going to far enough away from the Devastator to escape in less than thirty seconds," Doug sighs. "I guess this is the end."

Suddenly a portal opens beside them, Jammer and Wilek waving from inside. "Come on, guys!" Jammer shouts. "Do you want to die before we finish this?" Doug and Kit immediately rush over and leap through the portal, back to the Avatar. Seconds after their escape, the Devastator is destroyed in a huge explosion. "Guod couldn't have survived that," Doug says to the others as they watch from above the Earth. "Are you sure he was in there?" Keith asks. "I kicked him down," Kitainia assures them. "And I don't think he had time to form a portal before the explosion. It looks like we're not going to have to worry about Guod ever again." "Thank goodness," Doug smiles. "I guess we've defeated the Borg now. Hope everyone's alright." "We're still alive," says Wilek. "That's what matters." "Yeah," Kit nods. As the others walk off to check on their wounded friends, she turns to make a post.

**END RP FIRST HALF**

Hi everyone, time for my first post of the week. Thanks again to all the people who have congratulated me on my raise, it's one of the things that make customers who are like Dags mentioned bearable (yes, I work at Blockbuster too and also have to deal with that kind of people. Unfortunately :). Okay, on with replies.

Oberon vs. Space Aliens: All the alien opponents that have already been proposed are good. I'm surprised, though, that no one has mentioned the most powerful alien of all comicdom- Galactus. I can easily see Oberon fighting that guy, especially if he came to try and eat the earth again. As for who'd win, I'm not sure. Hope it would be Oberon, since from what I've heard Galactus's stomach is not a nice place to live. I would also be really interested to see Oberon fighting a liquid iron T-1000, he'd probably need all the other fays' help for that.

Welcome to all newcomers, and welcome back to those who have been away!

Wilek: Yes, I read that rewrite. I didn't like that it was unfinished but other than that it was very funny. Wonder if there are any other stories like it on the web.

Paul: You're right, Borgan was a major pain in the ass. The boss we're on now, Red Fiend, is almost as bad (the other fiends were easy, but not him!). As for whether he's a mage or a wizard, I don't really see the difference. I agree with you that he was not evil in the end, glad he was able to reform. Lunn too. The deal with Leo and Mauri was an interesting subplot, if a little hard to follow at times. Hope the rest of the game is as cool as the recent bits have been, Doug and I can hardly wait to finish off Ghaelon and Zophar.

Kaioto, Lexy: Congrats on finally meeting each other. Glad you two are having a good time together so far, I pray that it will continue. Good memories are scant in this world, and the more of them you two can form in your time with each other, the more bearable your lives will be when you are separated again.

SOROW: Yes, the Postman was a movie with Kevin Costner. Good one too, or at least Doug and I thought so. Hope you get to see it someday. Good luck in your senior year.

Todd: Good creativity demon with the four horsemen. Wonder if they'll ever actually turn up in some form in TGS. It might be neat if they did. <envisions Goliath and the trio swooping down, pulling them off their horses, and throwing all four of the entities into the nearest lake>

Oberon in TGS: I agree with Entity that he was portrayed very much in-character in Darkest Hour, though like many I wish he had given the gargs more of a reward for their helping beat the Unseelie. Oh well, Titania did give them a reward of her own in helping Elisa and restoring the Cold-Duo, so at least one fay had their heart in the right place.

As for his relationship with his brother, maybe Oberon still had some deep-buried feelings for Madoc, some hope that they could reconcile someday. All that came welling back up when he saw Madoc dead, and because of it he was sad. Yeah, they had been enemies, that's true, but they were still family and blood is thicker than ethics. That, and both were immortal. Perhaps Oberon hoped that given all the time he'd had Madoc would have learned his lesson eventually and they could have reconciled. When Madoc died, all chance of that was destroyed. Doesn't that just put a tragic spin on things? :)

Christine: Glad to see you've been keeping up the good work with your fanfics, I thought Indigo was one of your best so far. *mild spoilers* Sabra was a character you could really feel for, all throughout the story her development was well-written and easy to follow, as was the exciting and often hilarious plot (loved the scene where Angela and Aiden went ballistic on their "mates"). Wonder how the clan will react once they find out where Godiva's ended up. :) *spoilers end*

SJ: Have fun on your family vacation. $ Don't worry, we're not going to do anything major with your RP characters until you get back. $

Fleur: What those guys did to your car is something that cries out for punishment. Hope they get what's coming to them very soon. :)

Gargoyles Comics: I never read them myself, wonder if they had any interesting stories. If Gargs did come back in comic form, I'd like to see it in the full monthly magazine Airwalker mentioned. That way they could work in lots of nice illustrations and other interesting material along with the stories. I would definitely shell out the extra bucks to get all that.

Gargoyles Movie: Hope it gets made soon, and with a decent script that's true to the show. Glad they rejected the Devlin script, I agree that it was totally stupid and uninteresting. Everything else I could say about this topic has already been said.

Heather: Congrats on your ROTC promotion, glad to know you're doing alright. (Hope it's the same for Ravyn, Jackal, and DumlaoX.)

Fandom Top Fives: Glad some of the things I voted for made the list. Thanks again, Robby, for the nice contest. :)

David G: Looking forward to your post on the Illuminati's secrets, hope you soon are able to give it to us. The one about life in the 21st century too.

Hmm, looks like that's all the topics. Alright then. Good night everyone, see you again next time. <waves>

**AND NOW THE RP AFTERMATH OF THE BORG'S DEFEAT**

Doug walks back over to Kitainia as she finishes posting. "Are we all still alive?" she asks him. "Yes," Doug nods. "Thanks to Wilek's portals, I think every member of our team made it out. Most of us are pretty banged up, though. Lathrop got a concussion but he's just regained consciousness. Want to come see him with me?" "Sure," Kitainia nods. They turn and walk towards the Avatar's infirmary, where Wilek, the other Ravens, and everyone else are waiting for them. Kitainia smiles as she sees that her sister is alright. "Glad to see you're alive," she says. "No thanks to our old friend, Traveler," Stephanie sighs, quickly recounting how his bombs nearly killed her. "I tried to chase him down, but he was too fast for me. Then Wilek showed up with a portal and said we had to get away." "And so we did," Doug nods. "I hope we're all alright." He glances over to where SJ is keeping vigil besides the comatose Kari and whispers a prayer. Then he walks over to where Lathrop is lying down. "Are you alive, old friend?" he asks. The wizard's eyes open and he smiles. "I'm fine," he tells Doug. "Did we win?" "We won," Kitainia confirms. "Most of the Borg are dead for sure and Guod probably is too. They won't be bothering the Earth ever again." "Good," Lathrop smiles. "I'm sorry I won't be able to celebrate with the rest of you for a while. I feel the need to get some rest."

"Then sleep," Doug tells him. "We'll be right nearby, you don't need to worry about us." Lathrop nods and closes his eyes. Wilek steps in front of Doug and Kitainia as they leave his bedside. "Guys," he says, "I'm glad we're all okay, and we won and all, but there's still more bad guys out there ready to threaten Earth. Thailog's still controlling them, too, and no one knows what he could be planning next. We're gonna have to remain on guard." Doug and Kit nod their agreement. "We shall, Wilek," Kit says. "But I think we all need a little time to rest first, recuperate. You know?" Wilek smiles. "Yes, I think I'll need a little downtime myself. Hope we get some." "Me too," Doug frowns. "Though I doubt it will be long." He waves at everyone. "For now, let's all get our wounds healed and rest if we need to. Then maybe we can have a little victory celebration like I know some of you want. But after that, it's back to the war." The others nod and follow him out of the room.

**THAILOG'S REACTION TO HIS BORG ALLIES' DEMISE (AND THE BEGINNINGS OF HIS NEXT SCHEME) WILL BE SHOWN NEXT TIME. FOR NOW END RP**
Kitainia
Sunday, August 8, 1999 09:52:53 PM
IP: pool-209-138-213-51.dlls.grid.net

Jinniren> Click to go there.
Entity
Sunday, August 8, 1999 09:26:28 PM
IP: ely-oh4-32.ix.netcom.com

It's always a pleasant surprise when I hit stop on a movie and there's an episode of Gargoyles showing. ;)

It was a treat watching "The Thrill of the Hunt" for the first time in well over a year. And what is most surprising is that I was overwhelmed by the animation! It astounded me. And that wasn't all... the pans and angles, the music, the action scenes, the dialogue, everything... but it was mostly the animation. The beautiful characters and magnificent, deep backgrounds. When I remembered that this ep had been one of the not-so-well-animated ones of the first season, I was astounded even more.

The moral of the story, I guess, is... I had forgotten why I became hooked on the series. Reading stories just ain't the same as seeing them, in their original form. It was like being able to relive the experience.

I'm always so used to being disappointed upon a reviewing of a cartoon I haven't seen in a long time, because my memories are usually blown out of proportion.

Well, anywho... that's my big highlight for the day :)

FANDOM POLL - I'm glad to see that "I'm Sorry" made it to No. 1.
Entity
Sunday, August 8, 1999 09:22:42 PM
IP: ely-oh4-32.ix.netcom.com

Is the Dean Devlin script posted on a webpage somewhere? I'm curious to see what people are talking about.

Jenniren
Sunday, August 8, 1999 09:12:36 PM
IP: user-2ivf749.dialup.mindspring.com

Xanathar> I'm in the same rut, brother!

Airwalker> Gargoyles: The Timedancer? Do you know how freakin' awesome that would be??? And I'm not just saying that. The costumes, the music, the sets, the accents... always someplace new and never boring! I bet that would cost a pretty penny, though.

Blair Witch Project> No spoilers! I saw it yesterday and have a few comments... It's more of a suspense and definately not a horror, cause it wasn't that scary. If you want to see a freakin' scary movie, SEE THE SIXTH SENSE! As for Blair, I'm just glad that such a low budget movie is doing so well! No special effects or rehearsed acting (it was all improvised) and it's already making box-office records! I'm happy that the most realistic movies are also appreciated. In other words, I liked it! Go see it... with an open mind!

Tomorrow...is...my...first...day...of...school.....AAAAAUUUUUUUGGGGGHHHH!!!!! #@%$^&%(#@! Breathe in...breathe out...in...out... Okay *sigh*! Everyone wish me luck in what is to be my hardest year of high school :( I don't know why I'm saying this now, but... OKIloveyoubyebye!...... I do feel a little better now.
SOROW
Sunday, August 8, 1999 08:31:13 PM
IP: usr11-dialup369.mix1.irving.cw.net

Top Ten! Waves and re-lurks.

Starsinger
Theresa - [Starsinger@Webtv.net]
Sunday, August 8, 1999 08:18:35 PM
IP: proxy-513.public.rwc.webtv.net

Somewhere in the top ten, maybe? This early clearing is cool.

Anyway, all the comments last week about the Illuminati have inspired me to do a new Obnoxiously Long Post presenting a possible view of the "secrets of the Illuminati." I've got to check some books to get some of my facts right, so the full post will come later this week. It will be a mix of true history, Gargoyles continuity, and stuff I made up for the fun of it. For those interested, I'm going to lay out some of the ideas about the Illuminaiti that I plan to use in Freelance.

I'm still going to do the OLP about life in the 21st century, but not till the new Timedancer series starts. I'd hate to be proved wrong right after I made my post...
David G. - [david_goodner@yahoo.com]
Arlington, TX, USA
Sunday, August 8, 1999 07:49:29 PM
IP: pppa17-fortworthb16-3r662.saturn.bbn.com

Top 10?
Wilek
Sunday, August 8, 1999 07:47:07 PM
IP: tnt-1-222-56k.portsmouth.zoomnet.net

TOP TEN! And I wasn't even trying!
SOROW
Sunday, August 8, 1999 07:46:04 PM
IP: usr11-dialup369.mix1.irving.cw.net

YAY!!! Top Ten!!!!!
Mary Flanders
Sunday, August 8, 1999 07:44:36 PM
IP: ramp-1-42.ucdavis.edu

ok....here's an interesting story that just happened to me...

my cousin, he's a little nutty. We were driving around town today and he starts egging some guys in the car next to us at a traffic light. When the light turned green, they were turning and we were going straight. I ended up flicked them off because they were bugging me as they were turning. They turned around started to chase us...so we had them following us for a while but I managed to run through stop lights when they were yellow. My cousin said that they went to the side of the road to pass the car infront of them and ran the red light. Then we turned on to the bi-pass and were basicly home free then....

GOD!! WHAT A RUSH THAT WAS!!!!!!

Dags - [Dagastino_2000@hotmail.com]
Sunday, August 8, 1999 07:06:03 PM
IP: 216.1.24.218

Third! Maybe! Cool! :)
Mandolin
Sunday, August 8, 1999 06:59:05 PM
IP: pm3-1-ppp37.iximd.com

SECOND!!!!!!
Dags - [Dagastino_2000@hotmail.com]
Sunday, August 8, 1999 06:33:50 PM
IP: 216.1.24.218

Clearing the room rather early tonight, largely due to the fact I'll be watching the final MST3K episode and may get sidetracked afterwards...

Anyhow, two weeks ago, I started the fandom top five poll, and ended up with 32 sets of votes. Some of the high vote pullers I had figured on, others were surprises... For a complete list of all people and stories and characters voted for, as well as vote numbers, just email me and I'll send a copy of the list... In the cases where there are ties, I'm listing alphabetically... If I mispell anything, I appologize in advance, I went with how I knew it or how it was presented in the vote! Also, pretty much all TGS work is denoted as TGS work since breaking it down into writers and artists and planners and such would just be a large task I don't feel like undertaking... Anyhow, here's THE FANDOM TOP FIVES!

FAVORITE WRITER
1. Christine Morgan
2. Christi Smith Hayden
3. TIE! Coyote, Jewel Faulkner, Pistoff
4. TIE! Skydancer, Stephan Sobotka
5. TIE! Amy C. Cyrway, Merlin Missy, Tina Price

FAVORITE ARTIST
1. Christi Smith Hayden
2. CrzyDemona
3. Aimee Major
4. Demona May Stephans
5. TIE! Amy K. Cyrway, Raptorwoman, Shauntell Holm

FAVORITE CYCLE
1. TGS Gargoyles
2. TIE! TGS Dark Ages, TGS Timedancer
3. Athenaverse
4. Christine Morgan's tales
5. TIE! Christ Smith Hayden's Avery series, Pistoff's G2K, Skydancer's Damien Series

FAVORITE INDIVIDUAL STORY
1. "I'm Sorry" by Aaron Zieglar
2. "Something Old, Something New" by TGS
3. TIE! "Crossroads" by TGS, "Darkest Hour" by TGS, "Into the Woods" by TGS
4. TIE! "Coming of Age" by TGS, "Daddy's Girl" by Christi Smith Hayden, "Daylight" by TGS, "Faith" by Christi Smith Hayden, "Hazards" by TGS, "Of Whine and Noses" by Tina Price, "Prince of Thieves" by TGS, "Seeds of Change" by TGS, "Sun and the Serpent" by TGS, "Tomorrow and Tommorrow" by Batya and Constance.
5. TIE! There's about 30 entries here that got one vote... If you're curious to see them, e-mail me, I don't feel like typing them all up, since they didn't actually win by merit of vote, but by simply having one nomination. (Since individual stories were so widely spread, this was the largest category with the closest competition, first place only had five votes.)

INDIVIDUAL ARTWORK
1. TGS Elisa and Goliath from "Seeds of Change"2. Another large set of ties with only one vote apiece. E-mail if you're curious.

FAVORITE MALE CHARACTER
1. Brooklyn (TGS)
2. TIE! Jericho(Christine Morgan), Richard Harrison (TGS), Lexington (Christine Morgan)
3. TIE! Mark Adams (Skott Iskow), Brooklyn (Pistoff), Goliath (TGS), Graeme (TGS), Kox (Pistoff)
4. Same deal as before, e-mail to see all the choices that were nominated, but didn't get a second vote.

FAVORITE FEMALE CHARACTER
1. Demona (Series unspecified)
2. TIE! Angela (TGS), Ariana (TGS)
3. TIE! Christine (Jewel Faulkner), Elisa (TGS), Sata (TGS)
4. TIE! Asrial (TGS), Avery (Christi Smith Hayden), Elektra (Coyote), Rosanna (Coyote)
5. And once again, e-mail for the results here...

FAVORITE VILLAIN
1. Thailog (Series unspecified)
2. TIE! Harthoth (TGS), Ventura (Christine Morgan)
3. TIE! Loki (TGS), Madoc (TGS), Maeve (TGS), Shiva (Athenaverse/Ryan Stout)
4. TIE! Jerico (Christine Morgan), Roland (TGS), Sekmhet (TGS)
5. Damien (Skydancer), Demona (Christine Morgan)

WRITE IN CATEGORY!!! Thats write, enough votes for favorite characters referred to canon characters, and not a particular fanfic series, and so I decided for the heck of it to post the WRITE IN CATEGORY! FAVORITE CANON CHARACTERS!
1. TIE! Brooklyn, Demona
2. Goliath
3. Elisa
4. TIE! Angela, Thailog
5. TIE! Lexington, Xanatos


Robby - [MrNoying@aol.com]
Sunday, August 8, 1999 06:13:11 PM
IP: spider-tj081.proxy.aol.com