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My father's been having fun putting together his Műmak, but is now debating what to do with the extra tab of plastic in the mouth (to treat it like a tongue even if it doesn't really look like one or not).

Gunjack> <<attireless?>>: Doesn't have the same ring.
<<FF4-inspired acrobatic dragoons>>: They behaved the same in 3 and 5.
<<Again, not really working against the mob stereotype>>: How about this: if he dies, the sun won't rise after the solstace, only a giant ball of gas will come into view.
<<Yeah, but the backsides are sooooo complex>>: You mean with the naked ladies?
<>: I don't believe Mike's yet used his that way, pretty much just violence so far.
<>: Lain must be happy.
<<Someone needs to make a fighting game with a vulgarity-driven combat system>>: Not quite right, but check out the SNES RPG Treasure of the Rudras (Rudra no Hihou). It creates magic effects based on what you name your spells.
<>: Bad Boys of Computer Science. Nick Yu's old strip.
<<This is because I am a foo>>: T pities you.
<<When you tell me that there is a Megaman cartoon show, my heart swells with joy>>: Watch out, it's not classic Megaman, it's from the EXE universe. Ant the plot's just the classic young boy trying to be the best at what he does. Granted, I've only seen most of of the vanilla EXE series, not any of the newer EXE Axess.

DPH> <<He believes that there is at least an indirect connection between the status of owned properties and how the dice roll number is determined>>: Cheating computers is a classic way of making harder opponents witout needing to spend the time to make them smarter.

DPH> <<Shouldn't the government have the absolute most-powerfull "net navies" instead of kids?>>: Netto's father is a research scientist who's bonded a soul to the navi, and Enzan owns his own company. The main characters in a show like this are always some type of chosen one.
<<Rare battle chips>>: It's based on a game, so it had to be had to use the things that were balance for that in the show somehow.
<<Is it even possible to build something the size of a gameboy that has expotentially more powerfull computer than today's supercomputers?>>: Someone once figured out the theoretically most powerful computer ever, using the mass of the universe to both hold data and power the thing. But sure, even gameboys are exponentially more powerful than many computers that came before them. Even my 233MHz laptop has trouble running a GBA emulator.

Na zdorov'ya.
Gside - [gside@comcast.net]
Fair Haven, NJ
Monday, August 16, 2004 02:20:18 AM
IP: 69.141.212.54

Annnnnd now that that is all over with, I'm sad it's gone. Yes I had a wonderful time at the Gathering, was great to get away from work and was great to spend time with my mate.

My journal can be found in the Ask Greg Questions waiting to be submitted section or here: http://www.livejournal.com/users/tex_garg/

sorry, I can't hyperlink both and I figured more people would be interesting in the pictures.

So there, take a look. I bought a digital camera at the beginning of the summer so I took lots and lots of pictures. The links are dial up friendly, not thumbnailed, however most of the pics are pretty good in size and there are about 90 of them. They are not going anywhere so take your time, plenty of bandwidth to go about.

Oh and... Body massage machine GO!
Revel - [<------Gathering Photos!]
the bayou city, tx
Monday, August 16, 2004 01:22:53 AM
IP: 68.119.237.207

**WB Spoilers**
More to stuff to cover.

Megaman:NT Warrior - The premise is on shaky ground, for starters. 1st, everything in the real world LITERALLY is connected to the cyberworld. Complete and total integration. People use "Net Navies" to interact with technology and these "Net Navies" can also battle. Problem #1. Shouldn't the government have the absolute most-powerfull "net navies" instead of kids? This is basically logical in infinitismally more resources can be more devoted to coding these government "net navies" to be virtually indestructable. Problem #2 - Rare battle chips. Ok, if I'm the government, I would insist that ALL new battle chips would be tested 1st and I have a copy of EVERY battlechip so that the people who have the best government "net navies" have absolutely the best possible defense. Problem #3 - These "net navies" are simply highly evolved AI. Very evolved AI. In essence, older 'net navies', unless updated from time to time, contain old AI battle strategies that the newer 'net navies' already know how to beat. The code for the AI will keep growing expotentially as humans improve the gaming abilities of each 'net navy'. These AIs have extremely large amounts of code and would require expotentially fast computers to keep them running, as well as large storage devices to hold the code, and well, exceptionally large amounts of memory to keep the program running. So, in essence, whatever small hand-held device used to interact with net navies must, in fact, be expotentially more powerfull than the best supercomputers of today. Is it even possible to build something the size of a gameboy that has expotentially more powerfull computer than today's supercomputers? I mean, even light has a speed limit. Sooner or later, there is a limit to how fast we can make a chip process info.

YuGiOh - Ok, it's impressive to see how much 'faith' the writers give Yugi. Even Kiba was shocked. Anyways, back to Kiba, I think he is finally borderlining on friendship with Yugi. I noticed, in a repeat, how seemingly happy Kiba was that playing against Yugi **always** brought out the best in Kiba. At least, I believe that Kiba is at the point of 'grudging respect' for Yugi. I like it how that what's-her-name was pointing out that in ancient Egypt, Yugi and Kiba were friends. Of course, I'm thinking that she's probably stretching the truth a little bit. Anyways, Kiba giving Yugi that card probably meant more to Yugi than it did to Kiba. Kiba acted like it was a test of skill; I have to wonder if that is what he's telling himself to avoid admitting that is helping Yugi for the right reasons.
**END WB Spoilers**

Gside - It's funny how the computer opponent started playing much, much better when I finally decided to wipe it out. My final score ended up being $180,254. It took a lot of patience to let my final score get that high.

Hellcat - <America might have some people who aren't thinking straight!> Only a few?
DPH
AR, USA
Sunday, August 15, 2004 06:24:46 PM
IP: 67.14.195.48

Hellcat: <<America might have some people who aren't thinking straight!>>
Um... isn't that something you can say about every country and society ever?

So is it weird and/or pathetic that while camping out, (when I finally managed to get to sleep - it was FREEZING last night), I had a dream that I was at the Gathering? Haha... seemed pretty cool, too, so now I'm even more pissed that I missed out.
Tharos
Sunday, August 15, 2004 01:39:57 PM
IP: 69.40.139.175

Just popping by to delcare something. It's been ayear that Green Baron and I have been together! Whee!!

I'm on a little elated mood this weekend becauseof that.

As for recent talks on thsi board...I'm really far behind. But did anyone hear about an american widow suing a canadian family for her miltary husband dying in Iraq?

Crazy! The family wasn't even from Iraq. They were from Europe (India I think) but basically Canadian for yeas and years. America might have some people who aren't thinking straight! (No offense to anyone of course. :) )

Also what about that Pakistani guy that was arrested a few days ago for videotaping major American cities in the south. Any word as to why he videotaped transits and skyscrapers? I missed out of the news for a few days so just curious if anyone can update me haha. (too lazy to look up newspapers)

Did anyone see the olympics? I didn't see much due to my lack of sports interest. Congrats to the atheletes that won medals. Canada got none so far. Go figure. Snow is in our blood haha.

Now I need more coffee!

Hellcat
Sunday, August 15, 2004 10:37:33 AM
IP: 205.251.135.66

Hmm. dph seems distracted at the moment and I think I'll take advantage of it.

Attireless sounds pretty close to clothing-impaired. Is there a difference?

Gunjack - My master has left out many, many problems with the whole set-up of the series which I will force him to address in his next post. But he detects some plot, albeit slow but steady developing. He's seen the old status quo sorta broken, but is in doubt but it being restored.

GSide - my master has been observing some very clear patterns in the dice roll of monopoly that leads him to some . . disturbing conclusions. He believes that there is at least an indirect connection between the status of owned properties and how the dice roll number is determined. He has noticed a consisent pattern of the computer player landing on Income Tax whenever hotels are present on the light blue section of the board. He is being to think the AI has indirect control of the numbers being rolled. Of course, sadly, he's trying to break his record for largest winnings and he's taken . . . steps to . . avoid the computer player going bankrupt until the amount of wealth is at a certain level.
dph's hologram
AR, USA
Sunday, August 15, 2004 01:23:11 AM
IP: 67.14.195.36

Two days left till departure. Today, the less-than-fuzzy Gabe dropped by. When people visit me, we always seem to go off shooting. Today was no different. We burned through our 9mm ammo, discovered that my 30-06 bolt-action had a broken exctractor that kept it from chambering a round, went to lunch, bought more ammo, and blew that too. We even got some pointers from the helpful gentleman firing his VERY LOUD Colt 1911 on the next station over, which helped gabe get in the Red with suprising speed. The best part, though, was the little girly yelp he let out when he touched off that first round. Recoil is fun. feeling the muzzle blast from the guy next to you with your sinuses, also fun.

Gside><<But the problem is what -less word is gender and clothing neutral?>> attireless?
<<But apparently the game was good, even as a game, not just for a licensed game.>> If so, probably because it DID play to its strengths: vicious, gritty action, shivs, and witty slang.
<<Greatly adaped for grasping heavy calvary that fight on foot?>> FF4-inspired acrobatic dragoons, only this one in particular has hands for feet AND hands. If you saw the last episode of Clone Wars, it's kinda like the borg general.
<<Not quite, but you'd like him. He has his own slaughterhouse.>> Again, not really working against the mob stereotype. Now I'm picturing a porcine Bricktop (y'know, from Snatch).
Real, all the way through. Preferably nobody lower than Grant.
<<But you'd usually only have one option for a backside per game.>> Yeah, but the backsides are sooooo complex...
<<Are you as good with Jun as Mike is with his?>> I have not read CRFH in some time, so I am not going to wander into that possibly quite obvious trap.
I will say, however, that I aim to please.
<<Pretty much, makes your oppenents stop a moment in thought, and that's when you strike.>> Confuse them with strange combinations. Heh, there's a thought. Someone needs to make a fighting game with a vulgarity-driven combat system. Button-mashing in particular would be hilarious.
<<But they've mostly been jiggy (BBoCS}>> I should know what that acronym means, but I don't. This is because I am a foo.

Tharos><<Does he HAVE strengths? Seriously, I can't stand that guy.>> I dunno, he ain't bad when he relaxes and stops strutting. he's got kinda a bald, young Stalone thing going on.

DPH - When you tell me that there is a Megaman cartoon show, my heart swells with joy. When you tell me it has more plot than the origional megaman, small chiors of angels begin singing handel's messiah, because I did not know that the origional even existed and already they have improved it.

When you tell me that the plot content is about the same as the first two seasons of Digimon, my heart springs a leak in the pure joy chamber, whose contents sublimate away leaving only a small, empty, shriveled husk.
And then I cry.
Gunjack "Born a Lover" Valentine
Saturday, August 14, 2004 11:56:41 PM
IP: 4.7.36.9

DPH> <<I'm more convinced that with a clever engineering, somebody could create program to predict which numbers would be rolled with dice and use that to figure out when to roll the dice to get desirable outcomes>>: You want to have a program to figure out the results for another program's random number generator. You do realize that if the order of the numbers aren't determined at initialization (in which case nothing you can do will change anything, besides changing the number of randomizations you use up on your turn (somthing I've exploited a number of times in emulator savestates (Megaman Battle Chip Challenge, namely))), you'd have to time your action to the millisecond (or whatever is the quickest changing varient for the generator, might even go down to the clock pulse).

Na zdorov'ya.
Gside - [gside@comcast.net]
Fair Haven, NJ
Saturday, August 14, 2004 11:30:38 PM
IP: 69.141.212.54

Hmm. I'm definitely in a human lexington mood right now, since my mind is on computer programming.

Wonder of wonders, I'm trying to tidy up my computer programs, finally taking stuff off of the backburner to consolidate a few of them into on program and making pretty error-free.

**Kids WB Spoilers**

I figure it's better for me to give me the general headers since I plan on offering unsoliticed and subsequently ignored commentary on several shows.

YuGiOh - Where do I start? Ok, Joey could have beat Seto by changing one single move: use graverobber to pull out Seto's crush card. That would have wiped Kiba out and left Joey wide open to summon the only monster available for over 1500 arrack points: the 1000 year-old dragon. It's hard to quantify the difference in Joey's skill, Seto's skill, and Yugi's skill, but I'll try. Essentially Joey is over-dependent on fate (aka "Heart of the Cards") for victory. Yes, he knows enough to think a few moves ahead, but that isn't enough. He just doesn't think very long-term ahead in the game, which is why he can beat *most* duelists. Honestly, I don't think Joey stopped to consider how he was going to beat Blue Eyes Ultimate Dragon if Kiba summoned it. Seto doesn't believe in fate (aka "Heart of the Cards"), but relies on it. Yes, Seto knows enough to think extremely long-term, but his deck is faulty because of its theme: Overwhelming brute force. Seto should have realized that he would have lost his duel against Joey if Joey had just changed one single move he made; meaning, next time Seto battles Joey, Kiba better rethink his strategy. The crush card is powerfull, but it's also an achilles heal. Yugi relies on both fate and skill to win. Unfortunately, Yugi is . . 'afraid' of extremely strong monsters. I don't want to sound mean, but Yugi had to be coerced into summoning his god card the two times he did. Yugi would rather settle disputes with lots of weaker monsters than pull out his 'big guns'.

The commercials for "The Batman" have me concerned: I noticed Batman was **SMILING** during a couple of them. I sincerely hope I was wrong. Pardon me, but as I understand things, Batman NEVER is truely happy.

Megaman:NT Warrior - More plot than the original Megaman. In fact, it looks like the plot pace is about the same as the 1st two seasons of Digimon. Definitely more plot than Pokemon, which isn't saying much.

Static Shock - Anybody remember the Superman villain LiveWire (I think that was her name). Her powers remind me Static's and it would be interesting to see how the two measured up against each other.

**End Kids WB Spoilers**

I finally decided to buy software version of Monopoly, and I'm more convinced that with a clever engineering, somebody could create program to predict which numbers would be rolled with dice and use that to figure out when to roll the dice to get desirable outcomes. I've set record winning of over $100,000 in a single game, but that took a lot of effort and time to get there. One feature I do complain about in this version is it doesn't remove the buttons for players after they went bankrupt.

This past week I saw a sight which made me awe-struck. Seriously, it really did impress and leave me speechless for a while. I was in my backyard, just outside the kitchen window, sitting down on the ground, waiting to catch a kitten, and I was noticing a pair of rabbits in the distance of my backyard. Suddenly, a pair of . . . . . deer showed up and went under a pair tree in my backyard and stood there. A moments later, I noticed a 3rd one. Two of them looked about half the size of the other. I've been told that was no more than 100 feet from where I was sitting down. If only I had a camera so I could have taken the picture. Once I spotted the deer, my cats became unimportant. Just to see the deer in my backyard. That was awesome. More than awesome. Yes, I spend a lot of time around technology, but nature never ceases to amaze me at times.
DPH
AR, USA
Saturday, August 14, 2004 02:07:53 AM
IP: 67.14.195.7

Gunjack: <<Anyone remember that wierd movie "pitch black" from awhile ago? I really liked that one, so against all available evidence, I went to see Chronicles of Riddick at the cheapy theater tonight.
...Ouch. Talk about not playing to your strengths. >>
I remember Pitch Black. I thought it was going to rule, but then someone named Vinn Diesel (sp?) stepped in. Does he HAVE strengths? Seriously, I can't stand that guy.
I hear there was a pretty cool X Box game based on Chronicles, though.
Tharos
Saturday, August 14, 2004 01:32:01 AM
IP: 69.40.143.116

Ah New Jersey politics. Our governor just resigned, because he is gay (and is married to a woman), had an affair (that his wife apparently knew about), made that guy the head of his secruity department, and now the guy is suing him for sexual harassment. If you want to know more, search for "McGreevey governor".

Patrick> <<"a pantless rider" - also known as a Lady Godiva Clause>>: I don't know, she wasn't really notorious for being pantsless, she was usually pantsless. But the problem is what -less word is gender and clothing neutral?

Gunjack> <<Ouch. Talk about not playing to your strengths>>: But apparently the game was good, even as a game, not just for a licensed game.
<<Having too much fun over here with my highly-prehensile dragoons>>: Greatly adaped for grasping heavy calvary that fight on foot?
<<It's from "Something Positive">>: Ah, been a while since she was mentioned.
<<Just designating an available outlet. Or inlet>>: I thought the context meant that I would be getting buggered.
<<He sounds like someone from the mob... Maybe the BACON mob, in fact>>: Not quite, but you'd like him. He has his own slaughterhouse.
<<One of these days, but hook or by crook, I WILL have a Pallet of Money>>: Does it have to be real money all the way through, or would you accept a core of fakes?
<<and then you can turn them over and look at the stuff on the back>>: But you'd usually only have one option for a backside per game.
<<Dude, I know about CRFH>>: But it is better to note your sources. See my forgetting of Claire.
<<Don't make Jun get all tentacle-fu on you>>: Are you as good with Jun as Mike is with his?
<<Ain't creative vulgarity swell?>>: Pretty much, makes your oppenents stop a moment in thought, and that's when you strike.
<<And I'm sure there've been a FEW detestable muppets>>: But they've mostly been jiggy (BBoCS).

Na zdorov'ya.
Gside - [gside@comcast.net]
Fair Haven, NJ
Saturday, August 14, 2004 12:20:17 AM
IP: 69.141.212.54

Anyone remember that wierd movie "pitch black" from awhile ago? I really liked that one, so against all available evidence, I went to see Chronicles of Riddick at the cheapy theater tonight.
...Ouch. Talk about not playing to your strengths.

Gside><<Come to the porn side.>> Heck no. Having too much fun over here with my highly-prehensile dragoons. << I'm not getting that, and what does it have to do with someone inputing to my output?>> It's from "Something Positive". Just designating an available outlet. Or inlet. Not too sure about my terminology here...
<<Another reference to Pratchett. It's a book and his world's version of Santa Claus.>> He sounds like someone from the mob... Maybe the BACON mob, in fact.
<> One of these days, but hook or by crook, I WILL have a Pallet of Money. Or even one of those 70-pound shrinkwrapped blocks that you can barely fit in a duffelbag.
<<Not enough variety in a standard deck. Unless you've studied your tarot, and then it's not really free association.>> A point, I suppose. Still, you've got four shapes, two colors, and fifty-two discreet faces... ranks, objects, fonts... and then you can turn them over and look at the stuff on the back...
<< Like a nonsense contest (see crfh.net)>> Dude, I know about CRFH. Don't pretend you think I don't know what CFRH is. Don't make Jun get all tentacle-fu on you.
<> Ain't creative vulgarity swell? And I'm sure there've been a FEW detestable muppets...

Three days till departure.
Gunjack "Prehensile" Valentine
Friday, August 13, 2004 11:46:03 PM
IP: 4.7.36.9

Well, I haven't read anyone's journal yet (there's always too many details that are uninteresting to me, no offense intended), but besides the DVD announcement, any other big announcements from the Gathering at all? Or anything even remotely interesting that was revealed?

I hope I can go next year, maybe by then I'll have the costume made I was planning to make for this year if I could go (i bought the material LAST YEAR, but never found a pattern to help me, since i can't sew for the life of me). Still even if I do make it, I'm not sure if I'd participate in the masquerade, I'd definatley wear it though, but I'm too chicken to stand in front of people. I hate being the center of attention when it involves people looking at me.
Andrea
Friday, August 13, 2004 11:41:51 PM
IP: 24.41.3.231

hi all ...

just kinda stoped in to say ... hi and pfffttt ... just seeing what was buzzing about the gathering...

i cant wait for the dvd to come out .. dec 7.. boy its gonna be a hard wait..

oh well gonna take off now ...
*glides out window*
Brute...aka... Brutis - [creature_of_the_night_20042004@yahoo.com]
hammond, Louisiana, Usa
Friday, August 13, 2004 08:05:47 PM
IP: 205.214.170.231

My Gathering diary is posted! Clickie or go to http://www.eskimo.com/~vecna/gathering_04_text.html! Photos coming soon; some of us still have boring old ordinary non-digital film ;)
Christine - [<---- Gathering Diary!]
Friday, August 13, 2004 03:56:45 PM
IP: 67.136.147.165

I'm posting from the library. A change of ISPs was in order I was told when I got home from the Gathering and the plug was subsequently yanked. I should be back up and running and mailing the things to people I promised to mail in a couple of days. (I hope).
kathh
Friday, August 13, 2004 12:48:16 PM
IP: 65.6.53.195

I'm done with Saturday now in my Gathering Diary. Ten pages so far, and I'm just over halfway done.

"a pantless rider" - also known as a Lady Godiva Clause. ;)

Yeah, there was a little something missing this year without seeing Thom drop his pants. But a few of us got to see Keith in a bathrobe on Tuesday morning, so that kind of made up for it. ;)
Patrick - [<-- Gathering Diary]
Friday, August 13, 2004 06:37:37 AM
IP: 68.170.199.45

Mandolin> <>: Excellent, my faith is restored.

Na zdorov'ya.
Gside - [gside@comcast.net]
Fair Haven, NJ
Friday, August 13, 2004 01:27:02 AM
IP: 69.141.212.54

Posted the second part of my con journal in my LJ

http://www.livejournal.com/users/gregx/
Greg Bishansky
Thursday, August 12, 2004 01:49:13 PM
IP: 162.84.164.187

Gside: <<Someone had better have added a pantsless rider to that, or I'll be very disappointed. >>

I followed it up with "Pants optional" - and fulfilled my quota of one witty comment that made sense for this Gathering. :)

Working on my G2004 diary, which won't be as detailed as G2003 because my quote-taking petered out (and most of the good ones occurred when my notebook was nowhere within reach).

In the meantime, though, I have a meeting to go to. Joy. :)
Mandolin
Thursday, August 12, 2004 08:46:33 AM
IP: 199.173.224.23

Lynati> <<She was also the one to yell out "Thom Adcox!" in response to the question, "What does the fandom want?">>: Someone had better have added a pantsless rider to that, or I'll be very disappointed.

Gunjack> <<Still, better chances this month than last>>: Come to the porn side.
<<are you saying this is the "get yer jesus off my P****" guy?>>: Nope, I was initially confused by the singer because I wasn't expecting a similar name.
<<Never played that game... it always looked wierd>>: Just old puzzles dressed up with spooky sides. And it helped create a marked ro CD drives.
<>: Not really debating, just going over proper steampunk.
<<someone DOES have to handle Claire>>: I'm not getting that, and what does it have to do with someone inputing to my output?
<<Who the heck is Hogfather?>>: Another reference to Pratchett. It's a book and his world's version of Santa Claus.
<<maybe a shrinkwrapped Pallet O' Money>>: I hear those are worth $99 before they are in banks.
<>: Not enough variety in a standard deck. Unless you've studied your tarot, and then it's not really free association.
<<Absent a good way to score, though, it'd just be an excuse for massive BS>>: Like a nonsense contest (see crfh.net)
<<Muppets exist. Who are you to define their behavior?>>: I was using the interpretation of being detestable, not that they actively inhale.

Na zdorov'ya.
Gside - [gside@comcast.net]
Fair Haven, NJ
Thursday, August 12, 2004 01:29:51 AM
IP: 69.141.212.54

I'm working on my Gathering Diary. I'm up to Day 3 of my visit to Montreal, which was the first day of the convention. I'll post the complete Diary in "Ask Greg" when it is finished, but for now those who are interested can read it in my Livejournal. I won't spam the comment room with it because I tend to be rather detailed and long-winded.
Patrick - [<-- Gathering Diary]
Wednesday, August 11, 2004 11:42:06 PM
IP: 68.170.199.45

Packing for the move, and it is not easy paring your earthly posessions down to the maximum allowable on a commercial airliner. I've got a 4-inch stack of artwork, our journals to each other, a D&D player's guide, "Patterns of Exposition", our animal, gun, and wedding photos, assorted letters, and the bootleg dvd set of Helsing I was stupid enough to buy off ebay last week, thinking it were the real thing. Not the hottest cartridge in the box, I know.

Gside><<It's not pure violence now, just role reversal.>> So I saw. Still, better chances this month than last...
<<http://www.coax.net/people/erics/>> *looks at site* ,,, are you saying this is the "get yer jesus off my P****" guy? Cause that would be scary...
<<Pretty much, reminded me a bit of an upbeat version of the 7th Guest soundtrack for some reason.>> Never played that game... it always looked wierd. I think there was sommat with a head popping out of a stewpot? ...But yeah, harpsichord = GOOD!
<<All the more reason to get on the wrong side of the local street toughs.>> I forget what we were even debating... but the short version is, the electricity and stuff is pretty rare. I think I am going to have to cheat and claim that they've discovered REEAAALLLLYYY efficient clockwork powerpacks, but I like cheating. And all the back-alley ruffians use percussion guns or knives...
<<With whom?>> Well, someone DOES have to handle Claire...
<<All the more reason why you'd need fluffy clouds and a smiling sun (flashback to Hogfather) to lift you out of it.>> Who the heck is Hogfather? And I need neither of those. I need my wife, and some anime, and maybe a shrinkwrapped Pallet O' Money.
<<But stabbity gets stuck, unless you like slashy better.>> Blades, not points. Though the Queen of Hammers is good too.
<<It probably uses Rorschach blots.>> Naw, I mean free-association off the information contained in the cards. Absent a good way to score, though, it'd just be an excuse for massive BS.
<< It doesn't exist.>> Muppets exist. Who are you to define their behavior?

Special addendum to everyone comming back from the gathering: HATING YOU SO MUCH!!!

That is all.
Gunjack "Sleepytime Tea" Valentine
Wednesday, August 11, 2004 11:33:16 PM
IP: 4.7.36.9

Got home last night, got sick today and stayed home, but it gave me time to unpack and make a dent in my post-Otakon mess of an apartment. Haven't posted here in forever either - will try to get my con diary up by Friday at the latest.

Oh, and if I do make it to G2005, someone remind me to get something for an upset stomach? This is the second year a stomach ache has made me miss out on some of the fun stuff. (But no, not NEARLY as much as the Great Blimpie Attack of 1998 did, fortunately.) :)
Mandolin
Wednesday, August 11, 2004 09:25:42 PM
IP: 68.55.87.89

We're finally home, too, and I should have my Gathering diary up by tomorrow or Friday. Be longer on the pictures, though ... some of us still don't have the digital cameras ;)
Christine
Wednesday, August 11, 2004 09:12:17 PM
IP: 67.136.147.218

Gside: [<<Sign my grandmother!>>: Did he?] Cat's grandma wasn't there, actually, and I think had Weisman not been surprised by the randomness of the comment, he would have asked her to bring her grandma to Vegas. (This is the Cat who was affectionately dubbed "Spazz Kitty" at '02, sported long green dreadlocks at this year's con, and is in no way related to the Cat that is Mecord's wife. She was also the one to yell out "Thom Adcox!" in response to the question, "What does the fandom want?")

I'm currently crashing at Emambu's; I'll be heading to Norcumi and Quindar's place tommorrow (they live only a few minutes drive away from here)and will hang with them until they take me back to Maryland on Sunday.

Keep an eye on the Gathering site; I'm not sure when it will change over to Vegas 2005, but when it does the massive Con forum should be quick to follow. There is going to be part of it set aside as a "suggestion box" for people to submit and discuss ideas for how to improve various aspects of the con. and I'm making a list of panel possibilities, so if anyone has something they'd like to do, or to see someone else to, send it along to me. Whit, Ygg, and I already plan to reprise Gargie Bio, provided we can all make it to Vegas.
I know I'll be there.

oh, and Keith David is already in for next year as well. ;)

(Hey Silver, will you email me so I can send you the details on the art-related thing we discussed? and that giant pic of your avatar at 2002 was in acrylic paint, wasn't it?)

I should be actually writing a con journal this year. I think I'll do a full one then crop out all the "boring" details to make a version postable to Ask Greg.
Lynati "mmmmbody massage!" Kshudra - [Lynati_1@hotmail.com]
in transit
Wednesday, August 11, 2004 08:01:00 PM
IP: 216.151.117.236

Gathering 2004 was a blast

Went out to have breakfast at the diner with everyone and we parted ways. Lynati and Emambu are heading down to Pittsburgh and Aaron, Mara, Revel and Spacie have a very long haul to Houston.

Had a great time, but am depressed cause I hate this part... a lot.

I suppose I should now start my con journal.

Prologue

Getting to this Gathering was planned out several months in advance. Revel decided he was going to drive up with Spacebabie and would pick me up since it was in Montreal and I was on the way. Then this expanded into my brother coming, as well as Aaron and Mara... which was going to be a very tight squeeze. Then Emambu and Lynati joined in with Emambu's car... which helped a lot. It became a two car caravan with walkie talkies to stay in contact.

Wednesday, August 4th.

Spent the entire day getting ready, packing and cleaning up the house for my six guests. Constant phone calls to see where they were, plus plans to briefly chill with my friend Ron and his girlfriend Natalie who are flying back to Israel on Sunday (so this would be my last chance to see them). Ron and Natalie were at a concert in the city, and would not be in till late, and Revel said the caravan to the Gathering (here after referred to as the Rogue Squadron for reasons you'll see later), wouldn't arrive till late... Alex and I had bets as to who I'd see first.

I get a call from Ron that he and Natalie are at the train station so I go pick them up, we chill for a bit watching a re-run of "That 70's Show". Then I get a call from Revel, they're lost in Croton, and it takes a bit of doing but we manage to talk them to my street and drive way.

Gods, except for Mara I have not seen any of them in over a year. It was great, and my kitchen was very, very crowded. We eat, we chat, Revel and Spacebabie set up the inflatable bed in the dining room for themselves and drift off to sleep while the rest of us relocate up here to check e-mail, chat, watch AMVs, etc, etc, etc. At some point I dropped Ron and Natalie off at Ron's house.

We finally manage to get to sleep at around 3:30 am, with plans to be out of the house and on the road by noon.

That does not happen.

Thursday, August 5th

We try to get up early, but considering this crew (I am very guilty of this as well) we don't all end up up till at least 11 am. Then it's a while to get everyone showered and dressed and out. Plus we need to go to the hardware store so Lynati can pick up some wiring for her wings. Afterwards it's to the gas station for gas and some sodas.

Finally around 2:30 we are on the the Rogue Squadron is on the road. We head south to cross the Tappan Zee Bridge and head north... Montreal is well over 300 miles away, but traffic is light and we're making good time, we figure it shouldn't take more than a five hours to make the drive. Plus we have the walkie talkies to keep contact between the two cars. I'm riding in Revel's SUV (which is gold and named Hyena) and Aaron is riding in Emambu's car... dubbed affectionatly The Mafia Cruiser. We're constantly in contact and only have to make one stop in this back water town. These are the parts of New York state I never see. There is a town in NY called Troy... and there's another one called Coxsackie... we had a lot of fun with that name.

Finally we make it to the border... which had hundreds of cars all moving at a snails pace... and why, because the Canadian border controllers are on strike... but since it is illegal for them to strike, they are slowing things up as much as possible. We sit there for about 90 minutes. Finally, we get through and everyone stops to use the bathroom... and funny enough, once we crossed the border the temperature just dropped that very instant... so out come the trenchcoats. Nice to have trenchcoat weather during summer time and at a Gathering.

We get back into our cars and start heading north another 40 miles to Montreal... where we enter what we called The Death Star Trench The high way was reduced to one lane surrounded by these concrete barriers... and Aaron grabs the walkie talkie and starts quoting from the original Star Wars movie all sorts of lines from when they are flying through the Death Star trench, and we're quoting follow up lines... this goes on for several miles, and I have to say it's a good thing no cars broke down because we'd have been fucked, there is no where on either side to pull off. We figured the Canadian High Way unions do the same thing as ours'... they waste money.

Finally we make see the Montreal skyline, which has the weird search light shining all over the place, so in the geek moment, I use my Frodo voice and way "We made it to Mordor. It's the Eye". It takes us a bit of time to find the hotel because none of the signs are written in English. Which leads to one of the great weekend quotes from Aaron.

Montreal is like Broadway. It's large, slightly confused, boring and can't read or write English.

But we finally find the hotel, which was easy to find, and check in, there is a crowd of people and Sapphire comes up to say hi... and I regret to say that I did not recognize her without her glasses, with longer hair, and with her tattoos covered... Sapph, if you read this, I'm sorry.

We check in, and immedietly my keys are handed to a bellboy... which I snatch back, I will find my room myself, and I don't want to have to tip him. We put our bags in our room, and come back down. Here we run into Seth/IRC Goliath... and a bunch of other people, I'm blanking out on names, I'm sure someone will remind me.

Hudson, Chris Rogers and his crew arrive and we immedietly start talking Gathering 2005. And at the time, Chris asks Aaron to be his Treasurer, and Aaron says yes. And for those of you who don't know, Aaron and I had a pact after Gathering 2003 that if either of us ever seriously considered being on con staff again, we'd commit ritual suicide. But the pact was broken, and I did not feel like ritual suidice anyway.

We all hang, and finally the G2004 staff and Greg Weisman arrives. Greg gives me some good natured ribbing for last year, which is fine, I have a sense of humor about it, and it is funny. Ironically enough, I was more at ease with Greg this year than at previous years, because there was still the celebrity Gargoyles creator thing going, but this year we were like old friends instead of series creator and series fan. And Greg is just one of the greatest people in the world any way. It was great to see him again.

It was really great to see Crzy Jen, cause I was always disappointed that she couldn't make it to Gathering 2003. It was really great, and finally as one con chair to another I went up to Karine to tell her it would all be over soon... I said it humorously though... but seriously, Karine did all this and was five months pregnant. Talk about an iron will.

The con staff goes to bed and the rest of us hang out with Greg Weisman in the lobby for about another hour. And afterwards we decide it's time for bed, had a long drive and we all need sleep.

To Be Continued...
Greg Bishansky
Wednesday, August 11, 2004 01:14:36 PM
IP: 162.84.164.187

Woot! People are finally coming home.
It's good to hear that you all had tons of fun. Personally this was probably the most frustrating weekend in my life. Not only that I couldn't make it to the con, there was virtually -noone- around to chat with, neither online nor on the phone, there was -nothing- on TV and it was so hot over here that I didn't like to do -anything- that would include any physical work.
Short: I was bored out of my mind
I tell you, I was really tempted to try the old Gargoyles drinking game ;)
Currently I'm at work, rebuilding a comp that died last week because of a fried harddrive (again: the hot weather). No fun, no fun at all.

I'm really looking forward to seeing a bunch of Gathering photos and reading the journals of everyone.
I'm still waiting to hear from Hudson and Chris and from Arno. I hope Arno could grab Guan and my stuff to bring it back to europe. I wonder if Huds and Chris bothered to get a convention pin for Guan and me. After all we kept an eye on their servers in their absense (Knoxville too), that of course includes keeping an eye on garg-fans ;)
I'm really looking forward to getting my Convention T-Shirt (and you can't have too many T-Shirts these days)
Duncan
Wednesday, August 11, 2004 05:49:25 AM
IP: 217.82.217.107

I'm back from the Gathering... and this is actually the first time I've posted in here in AGES! But I thought I would drop the link to my Gathering pictures.

Duncan, you were missed!!

Jen
Jennifer "CrzyDemona" Anderson
Wednesday, August 11, 2004 12:33:29 AM
IP: 216.249.95.49

Silver> <<Anolgoy(sp?)>>: Anthology.

Patrick> <<Sign my grandmother!>>: Did he?

Gunjack> <<Maybe soon I can finally get around to contributing to the violence content on AMGC>>: It's not pure violence now, just role reversal.
<<Dang your exhaustive knowledge of obscure tunes>>: Obscure songs? This Eric W. Schwartz is a furry artist, rather well known in the genre. See: http://www.coax.net/people/erics/
<<the Stranglers were new, no?>>: Pretty much, reminded me a bit of an upbeat version of the 7th Guest soundtrack for some reason. That, and the occaisonal harpsichord is good.
<<"They" are bad@$$ main characters in a graphic novel>>: All the more reason to get on the wrong side of the local street toughs.
<<Bugger off>>: With whom?
<>: All the more reason why you'd need fluffy clouds and a smiling sun (flashback to Hogfather) to lift you out of it.
<<Spades are sharper, and I like sharp>>: But stabbity gets stuck, unless you like slashy better.
<<There ought to be a cardgame based entirely off free-association>>: It probably uses Rorschach blots.
<<Suckmuppet>>: It doesn't exist.

Na zdorov'ya.
Gside - [gside@comcast.net]
Fair Haven, NJ
Tuesday, August 10, 2004 11:49:42 PM
IP: 69.141.212.54

Went to the ole court house, and they STILL don't have my paperwork. Yeesh. Drew some guys with shotguns, plus some new characters. I've advanced to the point where I can actually draw a distinct face with a degree of repeatability. That is comming a LONG way, believe me. Maybe soon I can finally get around to contributing to the violence content on AMGC.
The rest of the day was spent trying to ship lain's computer, and trying to sort through all our stuff to figure out what I'll be lugging up there. Not really a pile of giggles, y'know.

Greg><<Waiting for dinner. Currently in my house are...>> DAY-um. That I would pay to see.

Mecord - Um, wow. That's really scary. Lain and I are mortally afraid of munchkins... But congratz all the same! :D

Gside><<When I saw the URL, I temporarially wondered why I hadn't seen that part of Eric W. Schwartz's website.>> Dang your exhaustive knowledge of obscure tunes! ...But hey, the Stranglers were new, no?
<<Surely while they're there, they will annoy some random street punk or be in some way objectionable to the populace. >> "They" are bad@$$ main characters in a graphic novel. Mostly they fight each other... there's probably plenty of random riffraff, but the main characters mostly start out booyad to the nines.
<<Couldn't you be nice and light and fluffy?>> Bugger off. I was depressed.
<<Or if you want a three, Penn and Teller agree that the three of clubs is more appropriate.>> Spades are sharper, and I like sharp. There ought to be a cardgame based entirely off free-association.

Back to drawing and reading this neat Scott Kurtz debate thingy. Clicky for the link; it's fun cause they're stupid!
Gunjack "Suckmuppet" Valentine - [Scott Kurtz Vs World]
Tuesday, August 10, 2004 11:30:50 PM
IP: 4.7.36.9

Back from the Gathering
Real con report to come later, but we arrived back an hour ago.

Waiting for dinner. Currently in my house are:

Aaron
Mara
Revel
Spacebabie
Lynati
and Emambu

They'll all be leaving tomorrow, and I'll begin my con report then.

In the mean time

GARGOYLES DVD: December 7th!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yours truly got interviewed for it, hopefully I'll make the final cut ;)
Greg Bishansky
Tuesday, August 10, 2004 10:01:33 PM
IP: 162.84.164.187

Home! Details later.

kathy
Tuesday, August 10, 2004 09:25:02 PM
IP: 66.82.195.117

I'm back from Montreal! The Gathering 2004 rocked! It was great to see so many familiar faces again, and a whole bunch of new ones as well. Everyone on con staff worked their butts off this past weekend, but even so I still got some time here and there to just catch up with old friends and make some new ones.

I'll start working on my big Gathering Diary in a few days, once I've had a chance to fully recover. But for now, I'll leave you with two things.

First... mark your calendars for DECEMBER 7, 2004, a date which will live in fandom history, when the first season of "Gargoyles" is released on DVD! The DVD will contain all 13 episodes of the first season, UNCUT, and the bonus features will include a commentary track on "Awakening" and a 15-minute documentary on The Gathering.

Second... the Top Five quotes of the weekend, as recorded by me...

"I can't imagine there's anything left in this fandom that I haven't signed yet." - Greg Weisman

"Sign my grandmother!" - random shout from the audience

"Vampires... it's what we're not." - Ed Asner

"I just like beavers." - Cindy Kinnard

And finally, the one that made me think if only he knew who he was talking to when he said it...

"If you can't be good, be good at it." - Keith David
Patrick
Tuesday, August 10, 2004 09:24:14 PM
IP: 68.170.199.45

OH yeah! Post your Gathering Journals at Ask Greg!!! Clickith my name, just copy and paste, tis what I did!
Post it even if all you say it "It was fun"
Silver - [<--Clickith the nameith!]
Tuesday, August 10, 2004 05:04:52 PM
IP: 216.93.113.76

I don't post much but since Taleweaver wants details! ;)

Of course the first day announcement of the DVD release date. Dec 7th 2004!!!! Uncut with commenary! W00T!

Saw what I think was the largest Gathering to date, tones of people showed up at the last minute. Most of whom lived in Montreal. Saw many who haven't been active in the fandom for years but showed up. Like Ithil, it was good to see her there. Saw MANY con-virgins... CKayote being one of them ;)

Oh yeah Pheonix Gate Anolgoy(sp?) sold like hot cakes... everyone seemed to have a copy of it! The art show was truely the best I had seen in years... and I've gone every year since '99. Two of my peices got ribons. yee!
Oh and the Camra crew where wonderful... They where always around filming something... doing interviews. I didn't do an interview because I'm a coward. Be interesting to see what footage makes it to the DVD.
Keith David was the greatest! He got there a little late, but he was a wonderful guest and great speaker.. He did the Goliath roar too. Hehehee

Anyways.. Hows that for chatter? ;)
Silver
Michigan, US
Tuesday, August 10, 2004 04:58:41 PM
IP: 216.93.113.76

OK, it's been two days and I haven't heard much about the Gathering.

I want details. For those first timers, what were you most surprised by? What completely blew your mind? Were the actors and crew what you expected or no? Come on. The Gathering comes but once a year. Lets here some chatter.
Taleweaver
Tuesday, August 10, 2004 03:22:35 PM
IP: 209.179.168.35

Back in town. Great con. My first. Glad I went.
Well, I got back okay, but airline travel was airline travel. So I'm going to invest in a rocket pack for next year.
Costumes kicked ass! I'm going to get a website so I post up all my pictures from the con.

I'm very happy to hear (from Greg) that Disney WILL BE ADVERTISING the the DVD. Nothing major but hey, it's effort put into to it.
CKayote - [CKayote@worldnet.att.net]
Orlando, FL
Tuesday, August 10, 2004 12:34:13 AM
IP: 65.244.171.25

Duncan> <<it's the prerogative of everyone who couldn't attend to be grouchy and impatient>>: As long as we don't actually expect anything.

Yggdrasil> <<There will be commentary on the 5 part premier, and that's it>>: Shame, but take what you can get, right?
<<the biology talk. I had a blast>>: And it's all thanks to me for proposing it. Bwa ha ha ha ha (continued insane laughter).

Na zdorov'ya.
Gside - [gside@comcast.net]
Fair Haven, NJ
Monday, August 9, 2004 11:33:25 PM
IP: 69.141.212.54

Greetings;

OK, survived the Gathering. To answer some of the questions:

1. The Gathering 2005 is in Las Vegas on July 29.

2. The 1st season DVD will be out on December 7th. There will be commentary on the 5 part premier, and that's it.

I'll be posting a full report later, but for now I would like to thank Whitbourne and Lynati for their help in the biology talk. I had a blast, and can only hope to repeat the procedure next year.

Yggdrasil - [eng050599@hotmail.com]
ON, Canada
Monday, August 9, 2004 04:46:23 PM
IP: 66.185.84.203

Hey, it's the prerogative of everyone who couldn't attend to be grouchy and impatient! :-P ;)

Duncan
Monday, August 9, 2004 04:21:50 PM
IP: 217.255.210.110

We're frigging sleeping, dude. Those that aren;t are still there at La Ronde amusement park
Whitbourne
Monday, August 9, 2004 03:46:27 PM
IP: 156.34.48.215

Err, he-llo?

Did you all get arrested at the border trying to re-enter the states because of participating in a meeting of a group with religious resemblance and satanistic (read: "magic") beliefs?

:D

Where is everybody?
Duncan
Monday, August 9, 2004 03:33:41 PM
IP: 217.255.210.110

Ok, Gathering is over

fine

I wasn't there

fine

WHERE ARE THE FIRST PICTURES DAMNIT!?!?!?!????

:-P

Duncan
Monday, August 9, 2004 03:38:37 AM
IP: 217.255.210.110

Anderea> <<where is the 2005 gathering?>>: It isn't officially announced until during the previous gathering, but I believe the last news was that it would be in Las Vegas.

Na zdorov'ya.
Gside - [gside@comcast.net]
Fair Haven, NJ
Sunday, August 8, 2004 11:18:54 PM
IP: 69.141.212.54

Yeah, I'm back! Life sucks...no big shock there. I'm still trying to figure out where I "stand" on a lot of things, but at least after a few months of rest from communicating with the outsode world (for fear of makin situations with those i knew online worse than they had become), I'm at least at a stable point.

I couldn't go to the gathering, since my parents decided last month to make a vacation to florida at the end of july (we got back tuesday evening)...and since that vacation was 8 days, and i couldn't afford to take 2 weeks off from work, I had to miss out. Plus, I don't think they'd be too inclined to let me leave the country without them...since I'm their "baby", they're less inclined to let me go (and they WONDER why I'm a bit childish...).

Not to mention, I was without a computer for like 3 weeks in june since a power surge went into the house during a thunderstorm, which my mom saw in HER room. It turns out, it hit the router, burned my sister's and mine's "slot", traveled down teh LAN line, fried the cable modem, AND went into MY LAN line and killed my motherboard. Cost me $365 to get a new computer (I found someone I knew from a restaraunt who had opened his own computer shop, and he just replaced me needed parts, rather than spend $500 on a totoally new PC with the moniter and other crap I didnt need since I already HAVE them). And people don't believe me that during a severe or drawn out thinderstorm, it's MUCH safer to have the computer off and unplugged...because you NEVER know when your computer could get fried like mine did!

Anyway, is anyone BACK from the Gathing, with any news? I saw the news about the DVD (man, can't it come any SOONER?), but that's it. I REALLY wanted to go to the gathering, to have some REAL fun (unlike last year, but I blame that partially on my immaturity, and a BAD case of PMS. Damn these female hormones!)

BTW, call me stupid if this has already been announced somewhere, but where is the 2005 gathering?
Andrea
Sunday, August 8, 2004 09:02:28 PM
IP: 24.41.3.231

Well I'm the 5th second post and the 5th poster.....

the reason the top 10 is taking so long is EVERYONE IS AT THE FREAKING GATHERING except for us poor smucks
Damien
Sunday, August 8, 2004 06:22:46 PM
IP: 205.250.247.23

Mecord> <<with news at 11>>: And you almost hit it, too.
Congratulations
Happy Birthday Cat
Congratulations.
<<Cat is having a kitten>>: She's Cat, and you're normal, so does that mean she could be having a catgirl?

And the fourth second post by someone before the end of the top ten.

Na zdorov'ya.
Gside - [gside@comcast.net]
Fair Haven, NJ
Sunday, August 8, 2004 12:26:18 AM
IP: 69.141.212.54

Well, in all fairness, with almost everybody away at the Gathering, there aren't that many people to participate in the Top Ten.

(Since the Gathering's in Montreal this year, you can always blame Canada - again.)
Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Saturday, August 7, 2004 08:53:11 PM
IP: 4.245.18.33

I just have to say... this top ten is PATHETIC!
Fire Storm
Saturday, August 7, 2004 08:41:28 PM
IP: 68.250.202.164

Ich Bin NINTH CRer!
Fire Storm
Saturday, August 7, 2004 08:40:42 PM
IP: 68.250.202.164

According to the TGS clock it's 11:00. So Here's the news.

Today is a celebration thrice over. First, summer finals have ended and my three weeks of summer have commenced! heh.
Second is my wife's birthday! (she's twenty-two) and we're throwing a party.
Last and getting bigger, Cat is having a kitten!!!! (for those of you lost right now, that means my wife is pregnant.)

There was much rejoicing! (yay)

Mecord
Saturday, August 7, 2004 11:01:13 AM
IP: 65.103.224.133

8th! with news at 11!

Mecord
Saturday, August 7, 2004 10:54:46 AM
IP: 65.103.224.133

7th and loving it!
Vinnie - [tpeano29@hotmail.com]
Marqutte, Michigan, USA
Saturday, August 7, 2004 04:28:55 AM
IP: 216.234.120.123

Gunjack> <<Keep your Jesus off my P***s>>: When I saw the URL, I temporarially wondered why I hadn't seen that part of Eric W. Schwartz's website.
<<If your head is on fire and your feet encased in a block of ice, on average you're fine>>: And as long as they don't say anything about it, you can ignore friction.
<<These guys are all special>>: Surely while they're there, they will annoy some random street punk or be in some way objectionable to the populace.
<<Little Black Cloud>>: Couldn't you be nice and light and fluffy?
<<Three of Spades>>: If you're going to be a singleton, might as well have something good so you could take a trick with it. Or if you want a three, Penn and Teller agree that the three of clubs is more appropriate.

Damien> <<why must we wait till fall?>>: Oh, let the Gathering people be on their special feature. And does anyone know if Gregs been working on a commentary track?

Na zdorov'ya.
Gside - [gside@comcast.net]
Fair Haven, NJ
Friday, August 6, 2004 11:29:00 PM
IP: 69.141.212.54

5th in the name of beasts of stone

Just watched 'Vows' again..... DAMMMIT WHEN DOES THE DVD COME?????? why must we wait till fall?
Damien
Friday, August 6, 2004 11:22:35 PM
IP: 205.250.247.23

4th!! Finally, a random wipe.
DPH
AR, USA
Friday, August 6, 2004 11:21:06 PM
IP: 67.14.195.26

Third.
Gunjack "Three of Spades" Valentine
Friday, August 6, 2004 11:12:17 PM
IP: 4.7.36.9

Second in the name of confusion!

I haven't read through in a while, maybe I should find out why the room's clear.
Tharos
Friday, August 6, 2004 10:38:32 PM
IP: 69.40.139.168

First!
Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Friday, August 6, 2004 09:20:15 PM
IP: 4.244.12.18