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When does the CR start over for the new week?
Luminous Aphrodite
AZ, USA
Monday, October 10, 2005 06:23:34 AM
IP: 207.200.113.147

Pokes the CR
Luminous Aphrodite
AZ, USA
Monday, October 10, 2005 03:55:25 AM
IP: 207.200.113.147

Spike: Yeah, and the guy that voices Mugen on Champloo also does Spike on Bebop. But I really REALLY don't like the way Mugen's mouth is drawn. I dunno it just REALLY bothers me. But other than that Champloo is just soooo cool. I like the randomness of the hip hop stuff and, I dunno the motion. They all move so well. Same goes for Bebop. I've seen the eps prolly a billion times but its still just cool. Like classic...cool. I'll call in my other faves: I'm nuts about Inuyasha. Sucky part is, I've seen the end of the animated series, and it just sucks what they did. The manga is still going on, and will be for a long time, but where they ended Inuyasha is in no way an appropriate ending point. There is still so much coolness afterward. Fushigi Yugi is cool too, but I've not been able to watch the entire thing. Anyone know any good places that I could get the series? Like Borders carries the mangas, but I prefer the toon. :( Wanna see the end!
And, although Trigun is weird, I still say it rocks. I just love the way Vash just lucks outta most bad stuff, just kinda manuevers around it. And how silly it is at the same time. yay!

oh yeah, and me and my pals here just finished watching all of the seasons of Farscape (on dvds) ..(not to totally change topic) and the movie. Weeeeeeeee! I want more!! Hellooooooo Cookie Monster! :D
Dezi
Monday, October 10, 2005 02:53:28 AM
IP: 68.54.214.198

DPH : I'm with Spike on this one, it definatly sounds like a coatimundi.
Spen
Sunday, October 9, 2005 07:19:02 PM
IP: 207.177.11.252

Believe me, it's not a raccoon. I've seen the local raccoons and possums and they have the right colors. This unknown animal doesn't share their coloration. The best I can tell, there is no 'mask' on the face. The best that I can tell is this unknown animal sleeps in a small barn. I have never been able to get a close enough look to see the feet.

I'd have to travel all the way 40 minutes one-way to rent the last Cowboy Bebop dvd. What I liked about Cowboy Bebop was the realism. For once, we have a series set in space where people use real, projectile weapons. Most series set in space assume we don't use projectile weapons anymore.
dph
ar, usa
Sunday, October 9, 2005 05:50:22 PM
IP: 63.232.248.72

dph>> Sounds a bit like a coatimundi but that's a south Texas/New Mexico animal. I suspect it's just a racoon out in daytime. The younger ones will do that from time to time.
Spike
Sunday, October 9, 2005 02:18:17 PM
IP: 70.251.66.79

...
Spike
Sunday, October 9, 2005 02:16:41 PM
IP: 70.251.66.79

Got a biology question, for those out there. What animal is roughly the size of a raccoon, walks on all fours during daylight, and is tan-brown? Tail looks similiar to a raccoon's tail. I've had this mysterious animal in my backyard for a while, never getting close enough to identify it, though.
dph
ar, usa
Sunday, October 9, 2005 01:24:28 PM
IP: 63.232.250.155

re: AMGC>> Zoe and her husband moved to another state in late Aug./early Sept. That's why AMGC has been in limbo lately. Until someone can get ahold her or she gets back online, they can't get into the AMGC files to update.

Anime>> I like Cowboy Bebop, Kiki's Delivery Service, The Cat Returns, Fruits Basket, Yu Yu Hakusho, Getbackers, Noir, and Samurai Champloo, which incidentally is a new one by the guys that did Cowboy Bebop.
Spike
Sunday, October 9, 2005 10:12:43 AM
IP: 70.251.66.79

HoE> Yep, I've noticed the subtle change in Spike also. I don't know when they started planning the movie, but it fits in perfectly between Sessions 22 and 23 for all the reasons you stated.

No, I've never met anyone who tried to use the movie as proof that Spike wasn't dead, but I have seen a lot of people who are still in denial about his death. A lot of them seem to miss the part where Vicious eviscerated the guy.

Yeah, "Bebop" almost always made the violence look beautiful... ever seen "Berserk"? Another great show, but it never made violence look beautiful. In fact, it was alwaus brutal and ugly.
Greg Bishansky
Sunday, October 9, 2005 01:46:41 AM
IP: 65.33.202.237

I just thought of another cartoon to add to the roster. I can't remember what it was called, but it was done by Disney in the 1950s, back before the Mars missions really got underway and everyone was still entertaining the idea that Mars might harbor complex life. Anyway, there was an episode of Walt Disney Presents that showed this animated expose on what forms said life on Mars might take. For its time, it was very imaginative, both in style and content. I cannot remember what it was called, but I do remember that Mike Judge and Don Hertzfeldt actually showcased a copy of it at the first annual Animation Show. They might have put it on the DVD. I don't know. I still have to buy it.

*WARNING: SPOILERS FOR ANYONE WHO'S NEVER WATCHED "COWBOY BEBOP" AND WANTS TO.*
Greg B: Yup. I'm actually surprised you never noticed the signature I used in Station 8 once (or if you did, you just didn't say anything). "Ballad of Fallen Angels" was actually the first episode I saw. I love it when people succeed in making violence look beautiful. Anyway, I asked this question a few months ago in the CR to another Cowboy Bebop fan, and didn't get an answer. I don't know if you noticed this, but I think there was a definite subtle change in Spike's character from Episode 23 onwards. He was still a little hotheaded, but he seemed more reserved and contemplative than usual. For me, it coincides with the movie taking place between Episodes 22 and 23, and how events in the movie seemed to bring old memories back to the surface for Spike (Vincent's speech to him at the end almost paralelled what Spike told Vicious in Episode 5, about life being a dream he can't awaken from). I'm not exactly sure just when they started planning a movie. If it was well after the series ran, then it's a weird coincidence. And have you ever run into any fans that used the movie as proof in their argument that Spike wasn't dead? I guess these people never watched to the end of the credit sequence in the last episode.
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75@gmail.com]
Sunday, October 9, 2005 12:06:49 AM
IP: 69.174.1.148

Lynati> The recommendation list wasn't for anime exclusively. I am looking to compile a list of animation works to introduce someone who has never seen or doesn't get animation. I'm steering away from fav and top ten lists because personal preferences are often unqualified. 'I like this one' or 'I love that one' doesn't mean anything to someone outside the genre.

I'm on the fence about including anime. I'm not an American animation snob, but anime has its own set of context and in-jokes that compound the problem. FLCL illustrates that problem perfectly. The entire series is one big in-joke for anime lovers. But you don't have large working knowledge of anime from Hamtaro to Tenchi Muyo, Gundam Wing to Yu-Yu Hahkisho (sp?) then the jokes mean nothing and since FLCL has no story to speak of it is complete chaos to someone not familiar in the genre. Anime deserves a decent encyclopedia to explain the myriad of references and in-jokes.
Taleweaver
Saturday, October 8, 2005 11:51:54 PM
IP: 207.69.137.7

Once again, thanks to everyone for clearing that up for me.

Todd : "After rereading the recent posts about the alternate names of various mythological figures, I suddenly found myself imagining a gargoyle commenting, "And humans wonder why we didn't bother with names." Too true.
Spen
Saturday, October 8, 2005 06:43:36 PM
IP: 207.177.11.252

After rereading the recent posts about the alternate names of various mythological figures, I suddenly found myself imagining a gargoyle commenting, "And humans wonder why we didn't bother with names."
Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Saturday, October 8, 2005 07:24:10 AM
IP: 4.244.12.50

Tribun: I beleive Zoe is the current head of AMGC. And you're not the only one wondering where she is.
Lynati
Friday, October 7, 2005 10:30:30 PM
IP: 70.248.26.54

Spen - Odin = Wotan = Woden.

*goes back to reading Pendragon and Writing HS*
V
Friday, October 7, 2005 09:45:05 PM
IP: 205.250.217.92

I know this not really belongs here, but I have no idea where exactly to ask, since I have no idea of the admin-scruture on the whole of g-f.org.

Does anyone of you know who the admin of of the AMGC section is? He seemed to have simply disappeared, letting the site rot.

Hope you can help me.

-Tribun
Tribun
Friday, October 7, 2005 09:06:55 PM
IP: 87.122.41.42

We wondered a little about the Fafnir business, but since we never wound up doing anything about the Volsunga Saga (Aaron Ziegler once suggested a Timedancer episode based on the Nibelungenlied with Brooklyn witnessing Kriemhild's revenge, but the idea was never picked up), it never became an issue. Maybe the Fafnir that Sigurd/Siegfried slew was a different Fafnir (that Fafnir wasn't a true dragon but a person who was turned by his lust for treasure into a dragon - a bit like Eustace in "The Voyage of the Dawn Treader" - and maybe he named himself after the Fafnir of "Dragons' Wrath").

As for Odin's alternate names, both Woden and Wotan are correct. Woden was the form that his name took among the Saxons of Anglo-Saxon England, and Wotan among the continental Germans (and in Wagner's operas).
Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Friday, October 7, 2005 07:08:02 PM
IP: 4.245.23.66

Lynati : Ah, thanks for clearing that up (I seem to be saying that a lot this week) one other note though : "Odin is Wotan" Don't you mean Woden?
Spen
Friday, October 7, 2005 06:33:35 PM
IP: 207.177.11.252

Spen: Sigurd *is* Siegfried, the same way that Odin is Wotan, and Odysseus is Ulysses. It depends on what language the translation is from.
Lynati
Friday, October 7, 2005 05:07:23 PM
IP: 70.248.26.54

Lynati : "Fanfir is supposed to have been killed by Sigurd." I could have sworn that his name was Siegfried.
Spen
Friday, October 7, 2005 04:37:59 PM
IP: 207.177.11.252

Todd: ahh, so the names aren't from Arthurian legend then. I still think the name is ironic, and I wonder how this is supposed to impact TGS folklore since in the Volsunga Saga, Fanfir is supposed to have been killed by Sigurd.
Lynati
Friday, October 7, 2005 01:58:21 PM
IP: 70.248.26.54

LYNATI - The reason for that is that, in the original legends that "Dragons' Wrath" was drawing upon, the battle between the red dragon and the white dragon was representative of the struggle between the Britons and the Saxons taking place during Arthur's time period. When we decided to give the dragons names, I thought of choosing names for them that would reflect this. Thus, I named the red dragon "Albion" since Albion is a very old and poetic name for Britain that would evoke the Celtic/Arthurian culture that it was supposedly symbolizing. (I didn't know of any similar poetic names for the Saxon lands that Fafnir the white dragon represented, so I simply named him after the best-known dragon in Germanic/Teutonic mythology.) And, yep, at the time, we'd forgotten about the root words behind "Albion". (Though there is an alternate theory that "Albion" isn't based on the Latin word "alba", meaning "white", but from a different word meaning "high places" or "mountains" - perhaps related linguistically to the Alps.)
Todd Jesen
St. Louis, MO
Friday, October 7, 2005 10:15:15 AM
IP: 198.209.226.130

I was watching my tape of Revelations today when I noticed that Jack Danforth was using the weight machine he was on incorrectly. Now this is only a minor detail but it's one I never noticed before. So I thought I would mention it and see if anyone else noticed it as well. That's all I'm going to say, I'm shutting up now!
Vinnie - [tpeano29@hotmail.com]
Marquette, Michigan, USA
Friday, October 7, 2005 04:42:16 AM
IP: 69.54.209.104

Todd: I have a Pendragon season one question, pertaining to Dragon's Wrath. So, we have a white dragon and a red dragon, and their names are Fafnir and Albion. How did Albion get to be denoted as the red dragon when the very word Albion means "white"?
Lynati
Thursday, October 6, 2005 10:30:32 PM
IP: 70.248.26.54

Mecord's Cat : Ah, thanks for clearing that up for me.

Has anyone else noticed that this room and S8 are about equal sizewise this week? I personally think that's a good sign.
Spen
Thursday, October 6, 2005 09:11:20 PM
IP: 207.177.11.252

Spen> AIM is short for AOL Instant Messenger, which can be downloaded for free at www.aim.com.
Mecord's Cat
Thursday, October 6, 2005 01:10:29 AM
IP: 70.56.98.173

Lynati : "Or get on AIM and message me there?" Forgive me for being in the stone age technologically, but what the frell is AIM?
"and I was thinking more I'd just link you to what I've compiled so far as opposed to trying to forward you all the documents...they're all html anyway." That might be the best way to handle this.
Spen
Wednesday, October 5, 2005 11:32:13 PM
IP: 207.177.11.252

Cat> <<some randomness thrown in>>: "Why yes, I can prove that my hair is naturally spotted white and black." And I did like the snake's theme.

Na zdorov'ya.
Gside - [gside@comcast.net]
Fair Haven, NJ
Wednesday, October 5, 2005 11:11:51 PM
IP: 68.83.187.89

Spen: why not sign up for a new free account with yahoo or hotmail just for a bit? Or get on AIM and message me there? and I was thinking more I'd just link you to what I've compiled so far as opposed to trying to forward you all the documents...they're all html anyway.
Lynati
Wednesday, October 5, 2005 07:46:20 PM
IP: 70.248.26.54

Lynait : "well, if you want a boost, I can see about forwarding you what *I* have; it might help." Yeah, it probably would. There's just one problem : My e-mail still isn't working. True, I can recieve mail, but the only way you'd know my e-mail address is if I were to send you an e-mail, which I can't do at the moment. Of course, I could make life easier by simply posting my e-mail address, but I'm a bit too paranoid to do that.
Spen
Wednesday, October 5, 2005 07:30:42 PM
IP: 207.177.11.252

I missed who we're recommending anime to. Will someone please enlighten me? I'm in the middle of watching Full Metal Alchemist and Gundam Seed. And, based on recommendations I've seen here, I must now go track down Wolf's Rain.

The darker side of animation brings Happy Tree Friends to mind, or what's left of my mind after having watched an episode or two of HTF.

I will add a recommendation for Fruits Basket as a good place to start for anime, since it's got the sweetest character ever, some randomness thrown in, and a healthy layer of darkness from the Bad Guy that affects everybody. And don't tell me how it ends, because I haven't finished reading the mangas yet. ^-^
Mecord's Cat
Wednesday, October 5, 2005 07:30:25 PM
IP: 70.56.98.173

Gunjack>Yipee! Someone else likes Serenity. I gave a shout out about it last week but got no response. Least I'm not alone in my moviefanage. I enjoyed it immensely.
Taleweaver>I second Lynati's push for "Flight of Dragons" (which I think was actually animated by the same people that did The Hobbit animated movie) I also concur with the recommendations of "The Last Unicorn" and "Mononoke". I still think "Wolf's Rain" would be dead on the money, but my biased love for that show might cloud my judgement. (It's post apocalyptic meets folklore) It's a bit bloody with a magical tinge. If you want a walk on the darker side then try "Vampire Hunter D" or "Witch Hunter Robin" I also still stand behind my rec for Fullmetal Alchemist.
Luminous Aphrodite
AZ, USA
Wednesday, October 5, 2005 04:03:48 AM
IP: 207.200.116.131

Spen> <<I always hold the Shift key while I press delete>>: I too live on the edge. And I once went off the edge on a college unix system using wildcards. Gotta love something so powerful that it lets you do stupid stuff.

Gunjack> <<Where ya workin' now?>>: Same place as the last year or so, doing tech support and a lot of etcetera for a special ed database company.

Lynati> <<For "dramady" of the more-comedy-than-drama type>>: And if I may try and pimp One Piece. Quite fun most often, but when they get down to the gritty, Oda doesn't hold back. Just look at Bellemere and Dr. Hilruk.
<<The Last Unicorn>>: Help Save Peter S. Beagle from the poorhouse. Buy his reading of the Last Unicorn.
<<The animated version of The Hobbit>>: I do rather like the songs in it.

Na zdorov'ya.
Gside - [gside@comcast.net]
Fair Haven, NJ
Tuesday, October 4, 2005 10:56:00 PM
IP: 68.83.187.89

Gunjack: I'd nearly forgotten about the cartoon where Bugs torments the opera singer. I cannot remember its name, but everything about that cartoon (the content of the rising action and the climax) ruled.

Taleweaver: Some of the creative staff for Batman: TAS have admitted to being inspired by the old 1940s Superman cartoons. I've always felt that Bruce Wayne's overall look was modeled after Fleischer's work (I haven't seen a Fleischer Superman cartoon in a few years, but I think there might be similarities in design between Fleischer's Clark Kent and the Bruce Wayne of TAS). And while we're talking about Max Fleischer, the black and white classic "Small Fry" was also quite good.

Lynati: I've always liked O'Brien's book "Mrs. Frisby and the Rats of NIMH" more than the movie, but I do remember there being moments in the movie that freaked me out as a kid. Especially since at that point, my experience with animated movies was limited to "The Land Before Time" and some Disney videos we'd gotten for Christmas. Nicodemus's story, and the reactions of the mice and rats to the drugs they were injected with, was perhaps my first peek at the darker side of animation. But I'm glad I was exposed to it at a young age. And if I remember correctly, I think my parents taped it off Showtime for us.


As far as Disney animated movies are concerned, one of my favorites is still "Alice In Wonderland." I guess I'd have to add that one to the list.
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75@gmail.com]
Tuesday, October 4, 2005 09:10:42 PM
IP: 69.174.1.148

Taleweaver> I might do a more complete list later, but if your friend is into the whole swords&sorcery thing, either Record of Lodoss War series might be a good start, as they're deliberately evocative of mostly Western fantasy. And they have some bitchin' dragons too.
Aaron
Tuesday, October 4, 2005 03:31:45 PM
IP: 70.248.26.54

Gunjack: ...you'd suggest Spirited Away but warn them that *Trigun* is weird? Spirited Away is a lot more, er, zany.

Animation and Anime: For the other well-known epics, we've got Fushugi Yuugi, Escaflowne, and the various El-Hazards. For dark and bloody, we've got Rurouni Kenshin, Berserk, and Evangelion. For totally on crack, there's FLCL and Cromartie High School. For sad and strange, Gunslinger Girls and Serial Experiments Lain *toasts lain*. (And "Nazca", in which you get to hear Thom Adcox play a psycho and curse a blue streak.) For "dramady" of the more-comedy-than-drama type, and plenty of random martial arts, there's always my first anime - Ranma 1/2. (If you don't mind the fact that the lead character occasionally lounges around topless when he's stuck in his cursed female form) And The Slayers.

And Lupin the Third's "Castle of Cagliostro" movie, from which dozens of other movies borrow from.

To be slightly more on topic, Exo Squad. It's not greatly known, as it faced off opposite X-men in timeslots (at least where I lived) but was probably the only non-comic-based epic *American* animated series I could name prior to Gargoyles coming out. Animation developed differently in the States vs. France vs. various Asian countries; Most Americans still tend to think of anything animated as being for kids, and only with the recent (last five, ten years) surge of anime into popular culture has John Q. Public started to see it differently.

My main memory is seeing a copy of Richard Adams "Watership Down" in the kids section of the DVDs a couple years ago at a Barnes and Noble.. Oh, animated rabbits, it MUST be for little kids. (...and look, another animated movie, with "dragon" in the title...lets take home a copy of Dragon Pink to the kids! XP )


Hum. The Last Unicorn, definately. The animated version of The Hobbit. The Secret of NIMH, and the Black Cauldron. "The Flight of Dragons" stands out in my mind, too, but I can't recall just how good the animation was.

Who Framed Roger Rabbit? and Pete's Dragon, the most well-known two (to me) combining Live Actors interacting with Animated Characters.

And now I'm going to bed, because I am tired.
Lynati
Tuesday, October 4, 2005 02:31:04 PM
IP: 70.248.26.54

As Gabe has demonstrated a few weeks ago, learning proper archiving procedures AFTER your own personal Library of Alexanria burns down don't do much good.

Spen, have you looked into "Undelete" software? We used to have some that could recover erased files. try a google search? No idea if it'd work, but it might be worth a try.

Gside><<They've been working me hard, so that by the time I get back, I haven't felt much like posting.>> Where ya workin' now?

Taleweaver - Any of the classic warner bros stuff; Anything roadrunner, and all the better Bugs Bunny sketches; can't remember the names, but I'm remembering Bugs Vs Elmer set to "the Barber of Seville", Bugs vs the Pavorati-esque opera singer, Duck Dodgers in the 24 1/2 century (the old sketch, not the crappy new cartoon), Bugs and Elmer re-enacting Wagner, The one where Bugs and Daffy end up in the cave of ali baba ("open... saskatchewan?")... All of these have a sort of humor that zig-zags between ultra-refined and downright zany, and none of them could ever exist in live-action. One of animation's best cards is its ability to exagerate and caricature its subject, and few have ever done that even half as well as Chuck Jones.

For the more serious side of animation, most of what I'd recommend is anime, which is probably going to be a tough sell. Anime is written largely for a different culture, for an audience of a radically different background, and the way it's put together is often very off-putting to the uninitiated. I hated Akira the first time I saw it, and I hated Ghost in the Shell. I enjoyed Princess Mononoke, but the whole movie still felt *wierd*. Some people just can't get over that.

For anime, though, I'd recommend Spirited Away and Princess Mononoke, Cowboy Bebop, The new Ghost in the Shell series (Stand Alone Complex and Second Gig: everything good about Cowboy Bebop, and then some)... Stuff like that. Trigun is fantastic, but maybe a little too wierd for the beginner, and also overrun with those strange Japanese Cliches.

I'm suprised no one's mentioned Serenity in here yet. Don't tell me y'all missed it? Well, if'n ya did, you might wanna correct that. It is good for REAL.

More later, perhaps.

*fades*
Gunjack "I've Played This Game" Valentine
Tuesday, October 4, 2005 12:35:43 PM
IP: 205.250.217.92

Spen: gyeh. well, if you want a boost, I can see about forwarding you what *I* have; it might help. Or we could do something *real* smart and collaborate. ]; )
Lynati
Tuesday, October 4, 2005 12:17:29 PM
IP: 70.248.26.54

Lynati : Oh, if only it were that easy. Unfourtunetly, due to an annoying habit of mine, that is completly impossible. A couple of years ago, I started getting tierd of always having to delete everything twice. So, I always hold the Shift key while I press delete, so that it's permenatly deleted. So, it's now gone for good

Mecord's Cat : "Plus, keep backups of all important files on disk or another hard drive." Thanks, I'll keep that in mind next time.
Spen
Tuesday, October 4, 2005 11:47:53 AM
IP: 207.177.11.252

HoE & Ed> Good News, Dangermouse is on DVD. I think it was released within the past three weeks. I saw it at Fry's about then. And I've read on IGN that Count Duckula will be out by Christmas too. FYI.

Luminous> My friend is into high fantasy/sword & sorcery, but I thought I'd make a broad appeal. You're correct that different shows and movies will appeal to different taste. But I didn't want to limit things to just one subgenre. That tends toward Top-10itis. I'm looking for insight. So lets keep the door wide open.

I'm glad someone put up "Duck Amuck". I'd be shocked if Chuck Jones wasn't in here somewhere. I'd also toss in "What's Opera, Doc". For a compare and contrast I'd put an episode of the Simpsons against one from the Flintstones.

For a bit of silly, I'd also recommend the extra short on the Incredibles DVD. The one featuring Mr. Incredible, Frozone and Mr. Skipperdoo.

And if we're talkign to source of realistic looking cartoons, I'd got by to Max Fleischer's Superman shorts of the 1930's. I think that's we the folks for B:TAS got some of their artistic inspiration.


Taleweaver
Tuesday, October 4, 2005 10:07:28 AM
IP: 4.233.29.40

Jacob: I think Professor Brown's comments were uncalled for. Who is he to say that Mercury and Venus have no self-respect, just because they don't have moons? Well, Mercury doesn't have air either, so I'm pretty sure its self-image must be awful.
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75@gmail.com]
Tuesday, October 4, 2005 10:06:25 AM
IP: 69.174.1.148

Taleweaver--I'd say figure out what type of person you're recommending the cartoons to before you pick the shows. Someone who's fun loving and way into humor would definitely go for 'Simpsons' or 'Animaniacs' style of shows. But if the person is a writer...or loves deep fantasy or such, then definitely go with the serial cartoons--the ones with intricate long-running story arcs and plotlines. (Batman: animated series, Wolf's Rain, Fullmetal Alchemist, Gargoyles)
Luminous Aphrodite
AZ, USA
Tuesday, October 4, 2005 07:19:48 AM
IP: 207.200.116.131

And because we all secretly loved that TV show....
Jacob - [<-- Warrior Princess]
Tuesday, October 4, 2005 02:24:43 AM
IP: 205.250.217.92

Spen> Yeah, what Lynati said. Plus, keep backups of all important files on disk or another hard drive.
Mecord's Cat
Tuesday, October 4, 2005 02:17:08 AM
IP: 70.56.98.173

Spen: can't you go into your recycle bin and retreive it? Most things aren't completely delted until you empty that thing.
Lynati
Tuesday, October 4, 2005 02:06:46 AM
IP: 70.245.22.181

HoE> Hee, "Cowboy Bebop" is one of my most favorite things ever! Spike and Vicious are my heroes ;)
Greg Bishansky
Tuesday, October 4, 2005 12:51:37 AM
IP: 65.33.202.237

Been a while. They've been working me hard, so that by the time I get back, I haven't felt much like posting. Let's see if I can't get back in the groove.

As for animation, I'm not one for the great masters, Yuri Norstein, etc. I'm quite fond of brainless action, Kiddy Grade being perhaps the best example.

And to clear something up I noticed one of the few times I peeked in, I don't know Russian. I know three Ukranian toasts, and that's about it.

Na zdorov'ya.
Gside - [gside@comcast.net]
Fair Haven, NJ
Monday, October 3, 2005 10:58:33 PM
IP: 68.83.187.89

I do believe that that was my longest post ever.
Spen
Monday, October 3, 2005 10:53:39 PM
IP: 207.177.11.252

*Spen walks in, looking... different. Fingernails elongated, teeth sharper, skin even paler than it is normally, hair standing on edge, lips redder than usual, insanity lurking around the corner of the eyes. Spen goes to the center of the room, and addresses everyone.*

***WARNING! RANT APPROACHING***
Earlier today, I decided that it was time to clean up MS Works. I have a lot of files that I either a.) don’t need anymore, b.) never really needed in the first place, or c.) thanks to bad labeling, have absolutely no idea what I was typing about at the time. So I was going through the documents, deleting whatever I didn’t need, when I found a line of nine documents in a row that were now useless. So I set about deleting them. Unfortunately, I made the mistake of pressing the down arrow one time to many. I then proceeded to delete all of the items, without checking to make sure I hadn’t frelled up. Guess what the extra item I deleted was.

The TGS encyclopedia.

Yep, in one moment of complete and utter idiocy, I destroyed seven months worth of work. I had previously hoped to have it done by January. Now, it looks like I’ll be lucky to be done by January of ‘07.

Now since this incident is 100% my fault, I should take the blame for it. However, I’m a bit to moriphobic to take it out on myself. As such, I need a scapegoat. Oh, Dis...

***END RANT AND BEGIN RATHER NASTY DEATH***

Spen walks over to Mr. Dis Connect, who tries to escape unseen. He fails in this endeavor, and Spen begins speaking to the cornered DC. You know, I don’t believe we have been properly introduced. Hi, I’m Spen, and I’m about to kill you. I assume you know who you are, so let’s dispense with the pleasantries, and get to the killing.”
Spen grabs DC by the arm, scratching him with one fingernail. “Mmm, delicious,” Comments Spen “Mind if I have another taste?” DC looks like he very much minds, but he is currently trapped, and can only watch helplessly, as Spen bends down to DC’s neck. After a few minutes Spen has apparently had enough, and DC makes another attempt to escape. Unfortunately, Spen is not done with him yet. “You Don’t think you’re getting away that easily do you?” Spen takes DC to a corner of the room, where the is a table just big enough for a certain hacker to lie on. Spen throws DC onto the table, and begins to wonder what to do next. “Hmm, might as well see what we have to work with down here.” Spen tears off DC’s pants, and takes a look at his legs. “You know, you haven’t been shaving these lately. How about I do that for you.” Spen takes out a sharp knife, and rather carelessly, removes all the hair from DC’s legs. Spen then cleans off the bloody knife, and moves on to the next stage of torture. Spen pauses just below DC’s belt. “ Ah, what the heck, it’s not like you’ll ever use that area anyway.“ This is followed by much screaming. Spen leaves the room for a moment, and returns with a large paper shredder, and then proceeds to put DC’s arms and legs into it. After that is done, Spen pulls out a glass of water, and pours a vial of acid into it. The glass is then emptied over DC’s face, blinding him completely. Spen looks over what is left of DC. “If you had really done something to tick me off, I’d spend a couple of days slowly killing you. As it is though,” Spen plunges one hand into DC’s chest, and pulls out his still beating heart. DC twitches a little, then falls to the ground dead. Spen then throws what’s left of the body into a meat grinder.

***END SICKOLOGICAL TORTURE ***

Ah, that felt good. <satanic grin>

DPH : " what about people born on February 29?" Actually, I once knew a woman who was born on Feb. 29th. She was turning 80, but only considered it her 20th birthday.
"You're not an experienced multi-universe traveller, right?" Nope, I mainly limit myself to time-travel.

Harvester : "Ten more years and I can run for president." Though actually, it would be eleven more years before you could be elected.
"especially since someone's comments I read in the archives" I didn't know you were reading the archives. How far have you gotten?
" Write something flattering about the DVD's cover design and give it its twelfth review." That reminds me, I have to go write that review soon. I'll start on it as soon as I li.. uh, I mean *wash* all this blood off me.

*Spen leaves the CR, looking considerably saner.*
Spen
Monday, October 3, 2005 10:52:59 PM
IP: 207.177.11.252

HARVESTER - [As far as Warner Brothers cartoons are concerned, the only one I can name at the moment is "Duck Amuck." I know this probably wasn't intended (or, since we ARE talking about Chuck Jones, maybe it was), but this cartoon basically says that to the blank paper on their drawing board, the animator is God. And I doubt even God can resist the temptation to mess with people. ( ; ]

It's even harder to resist the temptation when the person that you can mess with happens to be someone as egotistical as Daffy Duck. :)
Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Monday, October 3, 2005 08:43:56 PM
IP: 4.244.12.190

Wait. Before I eat, I left out the Cowboy Bebop episode "Brain Scratch." That's also good.
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75@gmail.com]
Monday, October 3, 2005 08:31:26 PM
IP: 69.174.1.148

Ed: Holy shit, someone else who appreciates Danger Mouse. Now THERE'S a cartoon that needs to get onto DVD.

Taleweaver: I would recommend several things. First, Don Hertzfeldt's short film "Rejected." Not so much because it's just plain silly, but because of the purpose behind the silliness. It tries to answer the question: is there room for the artist in today's society? And it does this in a manner that's impossible for live action to duplicate, which only adds to its meaning. Honestly, one of the things you'll find is that picture and sound have a very symbiotic relationship. When you're talking about animation, picture relies on sound a great deal. "Rejected" is a perfect example. You might also want to direct this person to www.theanimationshow.com. Hertzfeldt and fellow cartoonist Mike Judge are trying to get animation recognized as an art form, and so they've organized a showcase of animated films and shorts that travels around the country. Perhaps she can find some better understanding by attending one.

I would also have to agree with Ed on "The Simpsons." I had a professor in school who encouraged us to watch it, saying that it was perhaps one of the most clever things on TV. At the show's creative peak (which, in my opinion was between Seasons 3 and 9; I currently own 4, 5, and 6 on DVD) they somehow managed to tread a fine line between making a more sophisticated joke, and then juxtaposing it with something corny such as Homer falling down the stairs or hurting himself in similar knee-jerk fashion. I'd also recommend "Aqua Teen Hunger Force" (though I think a few people might disagree with me) simply because I can't think of any other animated show that better demonstrates the medium's potential for downright ludicrousness.

As far as Warner Brothers cartoons are concerned, the only one I can name at the moment is "Duck Amuck." I know this probably wasn't intended (or, since we ARE talking about Chuck Jones, maybe it was), but this cartoon basically says that to the blank paper on their drawing board, the animator is God. And I doubt even God can resist the temptation to mess with people. ( ;

I don't know too much about anime, usually because I find it hard to get into. But I loved "Cowboy Bebop." As far as both style and soundtrack are concerned, it's a mix of just about everything under the sun. You wouldn't think such a hodgepodge would work, but it does. Even though it's best to watch the 26 episodes in order for the sake of the storyline, a few episodes that really stand above the rest are "Asteroid Blues," "Ballad of Fallen Angels" (my personal favorite), "Sympathy For The Devil," "Jupiter Jazz" (Parts 1 and 2), "Black Dog Serenade," "Pierrot Le Fou," "Hard Luck Woman," and "The Real Folk Blues" (Parts 1 and 2).

I'm sure I'll come up with more later, but I'm freakin' ravenous at the moment. So I must go off to satisfy the most basic of all instincts: mastication (to those who say it's not the most basic, I offer that in order to live long enough to fornicate, you must first eat).
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75@gmail.com]
Monday, October 3, 2005 08:28:41 PM
IP: 69.174.1.148

Dang, eleventh. As if this day wasn't bad enough.
Real post later.
Spen
Monday, October 3, 2005 06:04:05 PM
IP: 207.177.11.252

Taleweaver: Great topic. I'm not sure how much I'm an 'animation fan' per se – I don’t set about to consume animation in particular, any more than I seek out thrillers or sci-fi or comedies. I’m not sure I know all that much about the field, and I certainly wouldn’t want to second-guess any creators. But here are the animations I would choose.

1. Tom and Jerry: "The Midnight Feast". You have to start here, because it's a classic, iconic cartoon: a war between a cat and a mouse in a domestic setting. Shows like "Malcolm in the Middle" have explored families that are humorously violent in a domestic setting: this is the same concept, but even more pared down and non-verbal. See also: Road Runner, “Sylvester & Tweetie”.

2. "Dangermouse". This animation really beds the absurdism seen in films such as Monty Python into a narrative satire. It's more character-focused and coherent, layered with loads references and asides, but essentially it's using the format to go to the extremes of what you could do through live-action media. See also: “Count Duckula”, “South Park”.

3. “The Simpsons”. This show keeps the broad satirical view of the world from “Dangermouse”, but bringing it back to a mundane setting like “Tom and Jerry” and with the tight and formal structure of a traditional sitcom. “The Simpsons” may have surreal moments, but broadly speaking it obeys the rules of a live action film in a similar vein – it just uses animation as a tool to elevate its humour. See also: “The Incredibles”, “Wallace and Grommit”.

4. "Batman: The Animated Series". Just as “The Simpsons” adopted the rules of live-action comedy, this is broadly adapting ideas from live-action drama. It's like "Batman Begins" or any "Batman" television show, except because it's animated, it can afford to be slicker, more stylised and more imaginative than a similar live-action show: would the look of the old Batman serial work today? Clearly not. It’s using animation because animation makes the stories more dramatic. See also: “Snow White and the Seven Dwarves”, “Gargoyles”.

5. "Spirited Away". This has the same breadth of imagination as any fantasy book of its kind ("Alice in Wonderland", the Oz/Narnia books, etc.), except the story is told through animation instead of prose. Nowadays, directors like George Lucas are just about managing to do things as visually rich with live actors, but “Spirited Away” doesn’t suffer from wooden actors and moments of plastic-looking CGI. Everything works in concert to create an astonishing, heartbreaking story told visually. See also: “Castle in the Sky”, “The Nightmare Before Christmas”.

6. "The Animals of Farthing Wood". I'm not sure the series ever got any attention outside the UK, but this is a perfect example of a broadly faithful book dramatisation that could only realistically have been achieved with animation, something that's pretty rare in serial form. The rules it follows are pretty much exclusively the rules of live-action but it’s the crossover between animation and the novel much as live-action costume dramas adapt from novels. See also: “Animal Farm”, “Watership Down”.

7. “The Snowman”. The story worked as a picture book, and it works as music – here, the animation is simply blending the two into a new form of art. See also: “Fantasia”.
Ed
Monday, October 3, 2005 03:44:21 PM
IP: 213.187.39.239

10th!!
dph
ar, usa
Monday, October 3, 2005 02:06:00 PM
IP: 161.31.67.49

#9 and feeling fine.

Actually, I was waiting for the room to clear to ask this question. A friend of mine who is into fantasy/sci-fi, but not into animation told me she just didn't get cartoons. I launched into half hour long dissertation on the evolution of animation from cartoons to animated series, but then I stopped when I realized I had no context with her to work with. I was trying to the subtle tastes of different wines to some one whose only drunk beer.

So here's my challenge for this week. What animated shows or movies best describe the craft? I'm not looking for a top ten/fav list, but a considered contextual vocabulary for someone who knows little or nothing about animation. What would experts pick for the uninitiated to get them interested in the field?

Good luck
Taleweaver - [rfootman1@earthlink.net]
Monday, October 3, 2005 01:06:16 PM
IP: 207.69.137.41

*runs toward the screen with wildly disheveled hair and beard*
...
EIGHTS!
Gujack "Confusacat!" Valentine
Monday, October 3, 2005 11:43:05 AM
IP: 205.250.217.92

Roll me some 7's
Revel
Monday, October 3, 2005 11:29:29 AM
IP: 68.116.218.20

Sixth! I think I'm partial to multiples of three.
Mecord's Cat (and Kitten)
Monday, October 3, 2005 11:22:59 AM
IP: 70.56.98.173

Fifth!
Leo
Monday, October 3, 2005 11:13:24 AM
IP: 68.231.241.236

Four is good.
Starsinger
Monday, October 3, 2005 07:07:54 AM
IP: 209.240.205.61

THIRD time is a charm and so here I am!
Luminous Aphrodite
AZ, USA
Monday, October 3, 2005 06:33:21 AM
IP: 207.200.116.131

SHECOND! (with deliberate extra H)
Lynati
Monday, October 3, 2005 06:23:20 AM
IP: 70.245.22.181

First! :D
Ed
Taunton
Monday, October 3, 2005 05:33:14 AM
IP: 213.187.39.239